Exposed:how Labour depends on the votes of Welfare Britain

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 16:57

There we have it........as I have been saying for some time now. Labour has dumbed down education and increased the underclass of society.........so that it stands a better chance at the ballot box. Again......has this socialist party no shame, when it come to social engineering. I always suspected that,although you didn't need to be uneducated to vote for them...................it certainly helps! Article by Glen Owen,political correspondent,for the Mail on Sunday

vincent1


Joined: 20/07/2009
Posts: 212

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 17:30

It's no wonder the NHS is in trouble when our wonderful doctors are posting on web sites all day.



What has this got to do with TRNC ? Please elaborate if you can spare your valuable time.

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 17:45

Vincent......the NHS is in trouble.....but not because a GP may post on a forum between surgeries ! There are many "managers" of one description or another in the NHS, who are actually non-productive,as far as patient care is concerned.....that is why we are in trouble.....ask any doctor.....we will all tell you the same.

It's got plenty to do with this........indirectly. More and more educated people are leaving the UK,as a direct consequence of Labours policies. The TRNC is just one of those destinations that people choose......"simples"

waddo


Joined: 29/11/2008
Posts: 1966

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 17:54

I have a friend who is a project manager for the NHS and has had no project to manage for the past 4 years - why? Simple, he will be 65 early next year so the NHS in its wisdom decreed that he would not have sufficient time left in service to see out any project??? So, he asked for early retirement - answer was no! As I have no project to manage said he can I have redundancy instead - answer was no! For the last 4 years he has wandered into work whenever he fancied, read his emails and then wandered out again. Yes he could have retired but on a reduced pension, yes he could have left and had no wages - but why should he??? It is not his fault that he has no work to do - it is the fault of the NHS and its poor management, simple!!!



Is the NHS in trouble? If it is - why? Answers on the edge of a postage stamp will do.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 18:20

Looks like Labour zealots have put their ideology and careers before the well being of the people.



They have created arbitray targets (sitting in their ivory towers) which is driving de facto behaviours forcing service quality to fall and costs to rise. Worse still the audit comission encourages best practice, forcing other departments to adopt wastely practices.



The Conservatives are not much better, but at least it seems that Cameron understands that arbitrary targets limit the potential of the system. He realises that linking purpose to customers needs is the only way forward. This will drive better methods for saving costs by enabling front line people, those who actually do the work to find the best way of making things work.

waddo


Joined: 29/11/2008
Posts: 1966

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 18:46

Just like to point out that both my friend and I are non-political animals, we are both of the same mind that whichever party gets into power it only will do the minimum it promised before it got there and then carry on and make as much for themselves as possible. Sad to say that is the way of things down through history and we can see no sign of a change in the modern world.



Good luck to whichever party gets in and we can only pray that income tax will not go up again and again and again.

LOvegod


Joined: 22/03/2009
Posts: 161

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 19:26

Getting us out of the European Union would be a major step forward to restoring normality. We are now running a trade deficit with the EU as well as paying to belong to this most corrupt of organisations. Soon they will try to drag us into the Euro again, the re writing of our history books has already started as EU propaganda is fed directly into our schools. In the EU parliament building the word England has already been erased from the political map.

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 20:02

If only the Audit Commission knew anything about "best practice".....it might then be in a position to make comment about what it thinks others do ! I personally could make 500000 people redundant in the NHS tomorrow,and do you know........patient care would not be altered at all. The problem is.....the managers are the ones who are the delusionaries, who feel they are indispensable. We Doctors and nurses know different!

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 20:55

clarets. I was a manager of part of a Home Care service with a local authority the 3 managers above me who were my bosses could not take over the running of the service when I was on holiday or if I was sick, they didn't have a clue on organising the staff I had of 75 and 400 elderly clients and keeping to a tight budget. They were good at holding meetings though.

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 22:24

"I always suspected that,although you didn't need to be uneducated to vote for them...................it certainly helps!"



Clarets,rather a sweeping statement.How many of us do you consider to be uneducated? Maybe you fancy a bit of social engineering yourself,maybe deny us thickies the vote so we dont harm ourselves.Just because one is a peasant ,it doesnt follow one cant grasp the rudiments of what is going on.

I shant be voting labour ,but it will be because I dont see any difference in the two main parties,not because I care that you might think I am thick for voting for them. I dont need to be intelligent to know however ,that the Tories, will serve their own needs and the establishments, that is ,after the election.

kaysera


Joined: 14/07/2009
Posts: 103

Message Posted:
09/11/2009 23:06

Talking of the waste in the NHS, what about the GP's who had massive pay rises to work far less hours? And the consultants who spend more time doing their private work, than their NHS work? And all the 'Bank' nurses that are used to fill the gaps, at triple the cost of an 'employed' nurse?

littlejohn


Joined: 09/03/2009
Posts: 316

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 02:10

There was an asylum just up the road from where I live which was closed during the Thatcher revolution when "care in the community" was introduced. I am convinced most of you lot are the old inmates - particularly Clarets!!

keithr


Joined: 20/08/2008
Posts: 720

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 07:06

An example of the waste endemic in the NHS....



A friend of mine works for the NHS supplies in East Anglia. He said they had a large quantity of surgical gloves returned from a large hospital because the new surgeon there preferred a different brand that was not on the picking system !!!



They were sent off for landfill !!!!!



Amazing eh ????

vincent1


Joined: 20/07/2009
Posts: 212

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 07:22

Clarets,



In your surgery do you condescend to treat the unintelligent, ethnic labour voters between times when you are posting messages on bulletin boards ?

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 07:50

Vincent1: In between postings Clarets is polishing up his racist bigotry - whilst raking in a huge NHS salary and then blaming all the problems of the NHS on others!



Amazing how Clarets could get 'rid of 500,000' jobs in the NHS at a stroke and make no difference to the level of service! Why exactly 500,000 if were 500,001 or 499,999 would it make more or less of a difference - or am I right in believing that Clarets is talking once again out of his digestive system?



Littlejohn: Those who were released in to the 'care in the community' by Thatcher were only insane - Clarets is the new 'Fuhrer' - and redefines what madness exists in the NHS

deecyprus4


Joined: 27/07/2008
Posts: 3452

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 08:21

As I see things the only reason there are so many people wastefully employed in the NHS is to prevent the unemployment numbers rising and as a result Labour losing the next GE. The NHS is ridiculously overstaffed with pen pushers who wouldn't know one end of a thermometer or which orifice is to place it in. Clarets is right and he should know being a doctor.

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 09:30

Dee.......that is the only sane response out of the last few.

Moover 321......"sticks & stones...." you ratify your pseudointellect with your comments,thus making MY point in its entirety.......thank-you.

Vincent....you obviously understand nothing of my personal ethics nor those of a Doctor. I treat everyone equally.Usually it is Labours voters who need my professional skills in te main part......they tend to be the ones from the lower social strata and uneducated about health(and other matters to boot)and how to keep themselves healthy. Therefore it could be argued that I actually spend a disproportionate time on those in Labour strongholds. Again,my small brained friend......you make my point for me.

Littlejohn....is that reference to some part of your anatomy or he perception of your worth in educational terms? You have the unerring ability to string out 2 seconds worth of comment into several hours of bull***. Are you a politcian or a lawyer ?

Kaysera...we had a rise (cont)

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 09:35

5 years ago.....just to inform the uninformed. We are independent contractors,about which you undersatnd absolutely nothing,by the sounds of things. Consultants work harder now than at any time in the past....and if labour had not got rid of so many beds in the NHS, then we would not need so many bank nurses. There are well over 600,000 managers and people doing nothing for patients in the NHS......so getting rid of 500,000 of them is not actually going to be noticed by patients nor Doctors nor nurses......perhaps their spouses might notice.......there again!

LittleNige......you wont get me going that easy!

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 09:45

Clarets: You reputation preceed you!



Your clarity of argument would make mud look like cut glass crystal.



Just because you are a doctor (though it is hard to believe) - does not mean you and only you have the solution for the NHS problems.



You like to attack those that challenge your empty rhetoric with vitriole.



Racist ideology is alive and well in the NHS too ?



Hope is better than hatred, but I doubt if you will ever understand that ;) lol

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 10:10

Moover321,as I said previously,if you cannot accept(or more pertinently) cope with my views/arguements,please do not try to pigeonhole me into something YOU ASSUME i am. It is obvious to a blind man on a galloping horse that your debating skills are.........."lacking". I am the eternal optimist, and HOPE that one day you and your like will actually wake up and see the socialist experiment for the human behaviour defying nonsense that it is.

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 10:24

Tut...tut Clarets!



You seem to be losing your rag as well as the argument )



I do not need to 'pigeon hole' you - you seem to be doing a very good job of that yourself



Hope is better than hatred - I wonder which part of that you cannot understand?



Enjoy )

vincent1


Joined: 20/07/2009
Posts: 212

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 11:07

Together with your new ally Deecyprus4 you have one thing in common.

Neither of you can conduct a debate without resorting to personal insults. For you i find this very sad as you purport to be of high intelligence. Personally I am beginning to seriously doubt this notion.

Your arguments are totally impossible to logically follow and you are just full of hate to any who disagrees with your rididulous ideas. I'm amazed how you can tell how people vote just by treating them in your surgery!

Are you really a doctor???



Maybe you should inform all your patients that you are a closet BNP racist. I bet that it would go down well !!

Have you done any meaningful work today ?You have been on this forum all morning. Do something to justfy that massive salary you get from the taxpayers.

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 12:21

Deecyprus

Yes too many managers,but I dont think the suits have been manufactured by labour.Its in the system ,the bigger we can get our department,the more powerful we appear to be. The Trusts are in charge of recruitment, not labour.If labour wanted to take people off the dole they would have increased the number of nurses ,porters, etc ,who would be more inclined to vote labour than managers.

Its like the ROC for re'74 .History did not start in' 97.The manipulator of dole figures was MrsT, by shoving people onto disability benifit,somehow its labours fault now.



Why no comment about Network Rail or Royal Mail, one manager for about every 7 workers.



As for Clarets, maybe he should be on his own list of those to be sacked,going by what what quite a few nurses think some doctors and most consultants especially when it comes to efficiency. Im sure those of the uneducated lower orders in his hopital would be happy,



Sackings,always someone else ,not me.I'm important.

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 13:00

You assume too much again......I have a much longer fuse than you appear to have.You have an obssession with "hope and hatred",and that really is having a great effect on your judgement. You pigeonhole people without conscious effort,and blindly criticise people who differ in their opinion to yourself. I sincerely hope that you do not apply such glaucomatous views to your profession.......whatever it may be!

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 13:34

With due respect to all , but unless you have frontline experience { Dr or Nurse } then you truely truely have no real understanding of what is needed to refloat our NHS and make sure patients and related services get what they need . Way way too many managers and many of them have no healthcare experience either .

KeithR , with all due respect , those gloves would never have landed in landfill they would have gone back to supplies , i know this first hand , if you order something you are not sure of , you just keep the box you opened and send the rest back for them to be redistributed . If i was being operated on by a Surgeon , i would want him to feel comfortable in the gloves he was wearing .

Have a good day All , Simbas

vadiev


Joined: 29/08/2009
Posts: 204

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 13:46

The relevance to all of us in TRNC of this politically motivated drivel is ??????

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 13:56

As Clarets has first hand dealing with the NHS why moover321 would you not think that the NHS could get rid of 500,000 managerial staff!! I for one think that is a figure that could be nearer the true mark!

And why are any of you bringing in Clarets other beliefs when it is a question on Labours votes re NHS. Im not interested in who he votes for but do agree that our NHS is in deep shite!



Would it help these hospitals and other NHS organisations to bring back the old 'Matron' system? ..... get rid of these managers of managers? .....

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 14:19

Moover

You say.

"I'm amazed how you can tell how people vote just by treating them in your surgery! "



Same way that -.Someone made unemployed is a bone idle scrounger .A person claiming disability benifit is a cheat.



You have to be able to see only black and white .No grey areas like some immigrants ,some jobless,some benifit claimants are abusing the system.Also you have to know that when bankers , the rich, and MP's. do it,its not the same thing. Like the poor are mad but the rich are just eccentric.



Its a skill some people have and others haven't .Certainly though, its harder to tell how people vote just by the way they dress how much money or education they have.Its not just poor uneducated people that dont vote Tory.

My father was well to do and voted old Labour, My grandfather was not well off, though not poor. and voted Tory.He also lived in a ,shock horror, council house.





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0DUsGSMwZY



Changed days?Not for s

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 14:32

Girne 29, which is you then boyo??????



And Littlejohn what are your REAL thoughts on this thread please? NHS I mean, not the silly schoolboy answer please!

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 14:50

You should spend a week in General Practice , that would soon open your eyes to what's really going on !

Magbs


Joined: 26/02/2009
Posts: 278

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 14:53

Moover,



I am not a frequent guest here though I've noticed that I tend to agree with your posts in general ... But it's a bit overplayed now. I mean calling your opponent racist...just for holding right-wing opinions!?



The word "racist" has been extremely overused. Unfortunately, as a result it has lost its strong emotional affect and has become vague and unclear in its true meaning.

What the word once meant is someone who believes in the inherent superiority of a particular race or is prejudiced against others.



Overuse then only makes it difficult to clear problems. It can't help maintain communication what we clearly see here.

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 15:27

Well said Maqbs,you appear to know the true meaning of the word,but alas not many others do on here! It is used when they can no longer counter superior debate and hide behind pc phrases and name calling. Vincent appears to confuse some of his own behavioural patterns with mine. It is a cheap Freudian defence mechanism and one often utilised by pseudointellects ! He thinks I have been on the Forum ALL morning......again,maybe he has,but what takes him all morning.....I can manage in minutes ! His infantile assumptions about what conversations I have in my surgery and the application of the word "racist" to every arguement I have.........belie his uncensored lack of education to any significant level. The constant default to his fallback position indicates the lack of insight into anything that others communicate on here.I agree he cannot understand my arguements.....he is incapable of doing so! I am no more a racist than Nelson Mandela,but you only believe what goes round in your twist

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 15:50

Dizzycows



Clarets should have done as you said, stuck to what is wrong with the NHS .I actually agree with what he says, based on what I get from my own NHS relatives.Far too many managers.Although Doctors arent blameless, did they not get a 30% pay rise over 2 years '6-'7,combined with a reduction in services.

but

His thread had little to do with the NHS and more to do with his politics and how if we didnt vote the way he votes, we are somehow stupid.

He cant make up his mind if the problem is managers who likely vote Tory,or the stupid people that voted Labour.

Who started the NHS "marketplace" culture anyway?

We all know people with first hand knowledge of the NHS,some vote labour some vote Tory,none I know are uneducated.



He works in the NHS,but wants rid of 45% of NHS staff .Administrators make up 3% so say we keep1%

Thats 43% of front line staff,Nurses cant cope as it is!!!

It would be the end of NHS, a dream for some no doubt.But can private health fill gap?

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 15:51

Dr Ashworth...... your next patient is ready to see you now!



Good on you Clarets & Simbas, people that have my respect for the work they do.



No one ever listens to the front line staff, lets see how Cameron ball's it up further.

vincent1


Joined: 20/07/2009
Posts: 212

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 16:29

Dr. Doolittle.



How many posts have you made today ?



It must be hell being an overworked GP.

kaysera


Joined: 14/07/2009
Posts: 103

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 17:26

18 "just to inform the uninformed. We are independent contractors,about which you undersatnd absolutely nothing,by the sounds of things." Another one of your assumptions!



"Consultants work harder now than at any time in the past" Yes, mainly doing their private work, where they direct their NHS patients to on the pretex of the long wait on the NHS.



"There are well over 600,000 managers and people doing nothing for patients in the NHS." So, because you say they do nothing for patients, we have to believe you? How many of these people are nannying the Doctors/Consultants so that they have even more time for their private work?

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 18:28

Girne29,msg 33......"I want rid of 45% of NHS staff ?" There are currently 1.53 million people working in the NHS.Only 700,000 have anything directly to do with patient care,Nigel. 500,000 does not constitute 45% of staff at all! Where are your outdated figures from.I can assure you....mine are up-to-date.

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 18:30

Kaysera....you appear to have a bag of spuds on your shoulder.Lets play "guess your occupation"

kaysera


Joined: 14/07/2009
Posts: 103

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 18:47

Just goes to show what some doctors think of the staff that do all the backroom work for them, while they are on the computer or golf course etc etc etc

deecyprus4


Joined: 27/07/2008
Posts: 3452

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 18:53

This is the state of the NHS, Kevin my partner whom a lot of you know had to go to our local hospital a couple of weeks ago to get some catheters as he needs to self catherise at least twice a week and he had run out, the BRI, Bristol Royal Infirmary which is the only hospital here that has an oncology dept refused, not the doctors I hasten to add but some pen pusher saying he would have to go to Cheltenham where his surgeon is, a doctor overheard this and went and sourced one for him..now why couldn't the over made up self important pen pusher have done that.!

waddo


Joined: 29/11/2008
Posts: 1966

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 18:53

Clarets, dodgy move when you get to play with figures and statistics. You want 45% of NHS staff gone because they have nothing "directly" to do with patient care! The same could be said of the Armed Forces - lots of support staff there that never go to the front line! Same for the Police - they have to have the office staff! Same for the Civil Service - oops sorry stupid me wrong one to pick on! But you get the drift? The man/woman at the cutting edge needs the support staff as well - maybe not as many as there are but there have always been more Indians than Chiefs in any Government supported system.



Why not just ditch the NHS - just a thought - and go to A&E for free only, the rest of us get to pay for the abuse we do to ourselves over the years. A bit of thought would go a long way towards keeping fit and well. You have a hard job buddy, good luck with it and I hope I never have to meet you - proffesionaly!

deecyprus4


Joined: 27/07/2008
Posts: 3452

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 18:53

catheterise I meant.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 18:57

The NHS wastes its resources - all resources including staff. But also patient resources.

In December 2007 my mother aged 98 went into hospital after a fall which injured her hip-what did they do???

Performed a hip replacement operation - I ASK YOU!!! On a 98 year old women (although very fit - how was she supposed to recover and get physio to get over that) Then just before Christmas they sent her home with an infection and arranged for community care to deal with her (Hospital too busy at Christmas). Early January my sister was very worried and called in a specialist - Mam was rushed to hospital with a serious infection which needed urgent treatment - WHAT DID THEY DO - took out the hip replacement and put her on Traction. So we have a 98 year old woman, tied to a bed having had 2 major operations. She now has a pump set up to pump the infection away. I complained that her room was too cold for me so they sent an engineer up to the room and he said it they were not working so

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 18:59

I asked them to get some heating in her room - I had my outside coat on and was still cold. They said they would do something - 3 hours later an electric convector heater was placed in her room.

How much money, resorces, staff, medical care, heating, and patient management was spent on this situation - she died 3 days later.

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 19:14

Magbs: Thanks for your post!



The word racist is often overused - I can agree with that! But if you read the posts by Clarets, Deecyprus 4 et al, there is an undoubted theme. Look at the posts of both in the light of how they refer to 'our society' as if they have the sole right to it! Secondly, both Clarets and Deecyprus either support or are sympathetic to the BNP.



Now correct me if I am wrong, but the latest court agreement when the BNP was taken there by the 'Equal Opportunity Commission' was an open admission by the BNP that its constitution is racist - it does not allow blacks, asians and others not classed in their categories to be members.



So the use of the word "racist" is not only just in terms that I have used it, but also supported by the very constitution from which their dogma stems!



) Hope is better than hatred

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 20:30

Kaysera......I do all my own work and the work of others who decide certain bits of the NHS work are not for them....that includes consultants,nurses and most of all admin staff. I recognise that admin staff are necessary and helpful(in most cases). You appear to have a very large chip on your shoulder about extremely hard-working doctors(of whatever type).The NHS NEEDS more doctors and nurses and it NEEDS less administrators,some of whom just try to block what Doctors and nurses are trying to do on a daily basis. Most of them could be weeded out without a second thought,thus saving huge amounts of money,and with no detrimental affect on patient care at all ! We just don't need 1.5 million people working in the NHS ! Only the Chinese Red Army and the Indian Railways employ more people and they are in countries with over 1 billion in populus. We have a population of 60 million.It ain't rocket science is it?

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 20:34

Katymackem.......and your point is........a little off thread if you dont mind me pointing that out!

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 21:56

Clarets,



Sept 2008 NHS information service. total nhs staff 1.37 million.

total administrators 39,900,



The 2009 figures are indeed higher say 1.5 million.

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 23:13

Sorry had to go.

48 cont.

figures for sept 2009 will come out March 2010 .I will go by the known figures till then, ,I will

allow for an increase to 1.5 mill for 2009, an increase of 10% ,though anticipated rise is 3-4%



Anyway I see I have used your figures of 600,000 wasters, whereas I see you would only get rid of 500,000





wasters -2008--- 600,000 out of 1,37 mill= 44% 2009 wasters 600,000 out of 1.5 mill= 40%

to sack --------------500000 out of 1.37mill= 36% to sack 500,000 out of 1.5 mill=33%.



700,000 not directly involved in patient care,what does that mean,40,000 are administrators ,lose 20,000 that leaves 680,000 ,who are they?.Not directly involved in patient care- porters, cooks, cleaning staff ,laundry staff ,maintenance technicians ,radio technicians,appointments secretaries

,For a doctor to suggest they are non essential is very strange and makes one wonder,Patients dont need heat ,fed,life support machines repaired etc.

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
10/11/2009 23:43

Katy Im so sorry for your loss xxxx

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 08:24

Girne_29:



Glad you got some 'real' facts as oppoosed to the made up nonsense from Clarets who apparently claims to be a doctor working in the NHS but seems to know very little about the real problems in the NHS.



Of course there Clarets cohorts here who believe one observation or experience they have had make that the rule!



The NHS is probably one of the best health services in the world.



Sure it has problems. Any large system that has undergone successive government changes and underfunding by the Tories for 18 years will have issues from time to time! But one swallow doesn't make a summer!



If Clarets had his way he would privatise the entire system - let the poor to go to rot and exploit the rich pickings for his personal gain! That is the ratinale of his argument - and of course he would be the Fuhrer in chief of such a health system



Every system can be improved - but the stats given by Clarets make you wonder what his real agenda is

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 08:58

Good morning Moover321 , without wanting to cause offence , you can be forgiven your ignorance , as you have really no knowledge or personal experience of what you speak of , so how on earth could you possibly pass comment ,i speak as a person who has worked for the NHS for 39yrs ,

Have a good day , Simbas

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 09:19

Girne 29.........your figures for non-clinical staff are so way out as to be laughable. There are more than 39000 practice staff alone,not to mention PCT's,Secondary care,Strategic Healh Authorities etc,etc. Where did you get your figures from.......The Daily Star ?

Moover321....where do I start with your ramblings of insanity? Having worked in the NHS since 1980, I have jusifiable perspective about the subject.You appear to have a bigotted,myopic view of who and what I am. I presume your natural inferiority complex and the bag of spuds on your shoulder has prompted most of your ramblings,when faced with someone like myself,who actually knows what they are talking about. I dont "claim" to be Doctor.......I am a doctor........the latter is reality,the former......an offence! If you persist in stating untruths about me with insinuations about potential offences, I shall put the matter in the hands of a lesser intellect.....my solicitor!

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 09:25

Simbas:



No offence taken - just because you have worked in an industry for 39 years does not make you an expert.



Just because someone has grilled burgers for 40 years doesn't make them an expert on fast food - does it?



The fact is - I can comment because one, in a free country I can express my opinion, and secondly, I would take abet with you that I know more about the NHS than most who have worked in it for 20, 30 or 50 years. Have you heard of the Kings Fund?



Now work out what you think I know



I often come across people who believe that the only people who are qualified to comment on a situation is those who are involved in it! That is a tad ridiculous, no offence intended - don't you think?



Tell me do you only have an opinion about the NHS as you have worked there for 39 - and you have no opinion on say, the city bonuses? Immigration? Capital punishment? The Civil Service? The local authority where you lived in the UK?



Point taken I hope

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 09:31

Clarets:



Do it I would like you to waste your 'hard earned money' on legal fees



An opinion is not slander or libel - but I guess you know that already, lol )



Put your money where your abusive and insulting mouth is Let's see

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 09:36

Claret: A lot of resources were wasted to carry out 2 major operations on a patient who was clearly never going to be able to regain any mobility or useful life from a replaced hip.

She was left with no hip, the area was 'packed' (excuse the term I come from a family of nurses so it is their jargon). One of my sisters has been a nurse for 50 years and is still nursing - she has gone up the ladder and now does agency work-because she enjoys the work and trains others. She complained to PALS about Mams care, on one occasion she spoke to a nurse about the lack of care she was personnally giving Mam.

Mam ended up in hospital for several weeks which also wastes resources. Because she has 13 children (all alive and visiting) she was put in a room on her own, so that family could visit outside visiting times as they did not cater for a large family. She was living independently in her own sheltered apartment with excellent care until they operated inappropriately-A waste of resources

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 09:42

Moover321.....the Kings Fund...yes I have heard of it,but having anything to do with it for the entire of its duration would not qualify you as knowing anything about what REALLY goes on in the NHS and the reasons for its existence.You patronise from a point of arrogant ignorance.You appear to know little about your own weasley profession too...."an opinion is not slander or libel".....maybe not,but slander and libel can CERTAINLY be an opinion. You call me "racist,abusive and insulting"......take a look in the mirror my neuropaenic friend(you wont find that in the King's Fund)......you might not like what you find!

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 09:52

Katy.....you did say that your Mother was sprightly prior to the accident.When someone over the age of 80 or so fractures a hip,there is approximately 50% chance of getting through the experience. There are no ageist policies in the NHS now,so we are obliged to treat ALL,at whatever age with the same respect,dignity and capability and to try to give EVERYONE a decent chance. This means that people with fractured hips over the age of 80,will not just be left in traction for weeks instead of operation.There are significant risks to both types of management,and any stay in hospital is risky from infection control points of view.Obviously I cannot comment on nursing care as I am a Doctor,but if you percieve any lack of care in such,you have justifiable cause to complain.

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 09:54

Clarets:



Where's the writ?



All mouth as usual I see

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 10:12

Give me your address Movicol and I will personally deliver it....we will see who has the mouth then.....won't we?

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 10:29

Clarets:



As an 'apparent' doctor your attempt to be clever is about as funny as your cure for the ills of the NHS!



You made the threat - work it out - you are allegedly smart LOL



Or perhaps your verbal diarrhoea is because you generate natural Movicol? LOL Must be genetic I would guess! better run quickly to the crumbling NHS - maybe, Just maybe a doctor might save you... ) Nah! better you stay where you are drowing in the product of your natural Movicol LOL

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 10:33

Hi Moover , after 39 yrs in the NHS i feel i can say that i pretty much am more of an expert than people who have had no experience , and yes of course i've heard of the kings Fund every healthcare professional have { was that a trick question !! } You might know about the written reports , the written word is far far different , to experience it first hand , you would have to live it to understand it . Two entirely different things . Yes i do have opinions on immigration ect but they are just my opinions rightly or wrongly just like yours , but surely if there was someone qualified in those areas having first line experience they would undoubtably want to put me right if i was making the wrong assumptions . After all who am i to question their expertise they are the people who truely know , but rather i would be grateful .

Take care , Simbas

proger1



Joined: 18/04/2009
Posts: 2918

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 10:38

Why oh why oh why.

After 12 posts read on this I realised it turned from One persons statement about the condition of a government run organisation to a mass personal attack on the poster.

I lost interest in this being informative and dropped to the end only to find that it is still about personal attacks.



I believe the statement was "You don't have to be stupid but it helps", If you can read into it that you are accused of actually being stupid then maybe the shoe you have just placed on yourself as they say might just fit !!!



lol, lmao, ha ha ha.



ps. Does anyone actually think that the add on hysterics actually deter from me being obnoxious, No, I didn't think so.

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 10:53

Proger1. You took the words right out of my mouth !

Moovicol....losing our bottle are we ? "Apparent" doctor....no.REAL doctor....yes....amongst other things. Like I said.....send me your address,and I will personally deliver it.....clever boy.We will see who is covered in diarrhoea at that stage won't we! We appear to have been dragged off thread,but I dont suppose you can remember now......about how Labour has wrecked the UK

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 11:08

Clarets:



Like I said your humour is as good as your cure for the NHS If the NHS is wrecked - though I would disagree - maybe 'doctors' like you should take some responsibilty for that too Earning a huge wad of cash for posting on forums! Yeah! I can see where there maybe problems in the NHS ) lol )



Insult all you like - it matters little to me It simply shows you for who and what you are )



Enjoy

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 11:17

Simba:



I do not decry your valuable opinion based on your experience. But there are many, many experts who have lived and worked in the NHS for decades with many differing opinions for making it a better service.



My point throughout this thread - for the sake of clarity - is that there is NO simple solution to the very complex issues of the NHS.



Simply cutting 500k jobs as Clarets would do - would NOT the solve the problem.



It would for sure make people like him who want a privatised health service richer but that would leave many of the less fortunate in society less able to get medical care - especially the elderly. Just look at the debate in the USA on health care



Just as you have an opinion, I too have in my view an informed opinion. That is bo reason for telling me as you have - that I have no real knowledge or experience - as on both counts you would be wrong!



I wasn't aware that I needed to present my credential to express an opinion This is just a fourum

HAPPY FEET


Joined: 18/07/2008
Posts: 416

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 11:41

Are the pensioners in the UK now better off in a Labour Goverment than when the Tories were in power ?

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 11:45

Movicol 321......you obviously have no IDEA who or what I am from your ignorant posts. The point of the thread was to illuminate where Labour draws its support from,and how they go about furnishing themselves with those votes.You turned it into a personal attack on me,as Proger1 says, because you have no valid,coherent counter-arguements.

proger1



Joined: 18/04/2009
Posts: 2918

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 11:52

I am not sure if you have noticed Clarets but this is not the first time you've been personally attacked, I am sure you have. I think they might have something against doctors, personally; if I wanted to know the problems with dairy farming, I wouldn't ask a skiing instructor. I think informative statements from a doctor about the NHS is probably a good place to start.

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 11:57

Poger:



Just exactly where are the 'personal' attacks?



Seems you have selective reading issues?



I am sure Clarets is happy to receive your support - but there are thousands of well qualified practicing doctors who totally disagree with his views on the NHS!



Now exactly which doctors views would you utilise? Perhaps better ask a skiing instructor LOL

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 12:03

Clarets:



So let's hear your detailed plan for the NHS.



Show how exactly Labour has got votes from the NHS welfare system?



You make broad generalised statements and then hide behind the apparent fact that you are a doctor!



Do you think simply cutting 500,000 jobs would make the NHS better? How exactly would it be better?



Quite frankly as an apparent doctor may be you should stick to treating patients or perhaps should I say 'apparent physician heal thyself' LOL

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 12:10

Movicol321....you don't appear to be aware that you do attack people with different opinions to your own,especially when their arguements are more valid and eloquently put ! Are the voices in your head still troubling you ? I have actually just shown one of my patients your posts....he is a leading light in the Ambulance Service locally.....I could not print what he said as he was rather disparaging about people making comment with no experience. He did have a good laugh at your expense though, so thanks for easing my morning surgery!

proger1



Joined: 18/04/2009
Posts: 2918

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 12:59

I am not actually supporting anyone Moover321, I am pointing out that giving people stick on this Forum seems to occur 90% of the time and most of it is not in any way reflective of the original post.



I would however appreciate that you write my name correctly when writing to me or you could click on my profile at call me by my real name if you wish, petty I know but it has about as much relevence to this thread as most of your posts so I just thought I would throw it in the mix.



Paul Roger, (proger1), even offshore idiot will suffice but I have no idea what a poger is !!!!

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 13:15

Clarets

Girne 29.........your figures for non-clinical staff are so way out as to be laughable. There are more than 39000 practice staff alone,not to mention PCT's,Secondary care,Strategic Healh Authorities etc,etc. Where did you get your figures from.......The Daily Star ?



Yes, I notice you presume all I can read is the Daily Star.



I told you twice where the information came from ,for the 3rd and last time, NHS INFORMATION CENTRE . Got it!

brothers wife ,a mere hosp Sister and non star reader , directed me, easy..



Prof trained clinical staff 700,000

clinical support 350,000

infrastructure support 220,000 of whom 39,000 are managers.



So out of the 520,000,take away 20,000 admin we are left with 500,000.which is the number you want to sack.

every one from support.thats as NHS defines support, all techs from x-ray bio-med ,physio,cardio,radiotherapy, pharmcy,,prothetic, orthotic, med-lab,cleaners,cooks.healthcare assist.maintenance,estates.



Impro

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 13:21

Claret:



You are welcome Nice to know that the NHS can spare your talents on this forum LOL )



As far as opinion is concerned - I will say what like - that is why it is opinion!



As for your facts - I suggest Girne_29 has shown you to be rather short on the actual realities



I will simply let those who are reading this thread make up their own minds!



Enjoy

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 13:29

Proger:



Poger was an obvious typo - apologies for any offence caused - totally unintended



As for not supporting anyone - maybe I misread your post - but it seems clear to me that you refer only to Clarets being insulted - as opposed to the diatribe he has been saying through out this post! Balance?



Unfortunately, you are correct that people seldom stick to the original post - it is how forum discussion usually proceed!



As for insults - I think if you just took a few moments to read the entire thread you will see who is saying what and to whom!



Apologies once again - Paul!

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 13:37

Iain, do not move in to a second day of this twaddle.



The person that is keeping this going, may well be our banned friend that he should be busy policing the railways.



He needs medical help if it is.

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 13:47

Dizzycows mesage 29



Voted labour,tory ,labour,so that would make me Ronnie Corbett,Ronnie Barker, and now Ronnie Corbett,but I will be neither next election.



Simbas

You dont have to be a soldier or an Iraqi to debate and know the War is illegal and wrong.

You dont have to be a dog owner to comment on whether their treatment is right or wrong.



You have made numerous posts and nobody has said to you to butt out because you are not an estate agent, caterer,involved with crime and punishment,a mother who has lost a soldier son,or a politician.



I worked for a time in the construction industry but really know no more about about planning permission than you.

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 13:58

Clarets. msg 72. Morning surgery? do you see any patients?

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 14:05

Movicol 321 I think Paul has already made up his mind about that from what he has read and also stated in his posts.

Girne 29....there were in 2008,1.12 million non-medical staff,which was an increase of 31% (FTE) on the decade prior to that.Most of the figures you quote are out of date.....that is fact! They also do not take into consideration GP practices and their administrative staff etc. You can go round and round in circles,quoting out-of-date stats about the NHS,but the facts remain! The NHS is massively over bureaucratic. Any Doctor or nurse will tell you that. Movicol321 may feel that he represents the unspoken majority of Doctors("I am sure Clarets is happy to receive your support - but there are thousands of well qualified practicing doctors who totally disagree with his views on the NHS!"),but the fact is he does not(only in his own head). Being a Doctor,teaching young Doctors and having been the Chairman of an organisation serving 1/2 million people really does

vincent1


Joined: 20/07/2009
Posts: 212

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 14:11

woodspeckie..message 79



Just a few unintelligent low life labour voters......nobody important !!



Dr. Clarets..



Were you the playground bully ??

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 14:11

contd:qualify me as a person who actually does know what they are talking about in the NHS. People in accounts offices,accountants and lawyers etc,have no concept of what makes the NHS work.....they only think they do! I am happy for you to talk about something you might actually know something about,but please stop embarrassing yourself by continuing to show incandescent ignorance about the NHS.Labour has wrecked it.....after they were the ones responsible for its inception in 1948 ! Fundholding under the Tories....was in fact the halcyon period in the last 30 years and I KNOW that most doctors agree with me there......as I talk to them and they talk to me.Smell the coffee Movicol 321 and stop deluding yourself

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 14:16

Vincent1....making assumptions again.....is there an epidemic?You and Movicol321 need a vaccination! In answer to your question.....no I wasn't the playground bully. I was on the receiving end when I started school,but strangely it only happened once ! The perpetrator bit off a little more than he could chew,and the message got around pretty quick!

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 14:23

Clarets. Not answered my question.

vincent1


Joined: 20/07/2009
Posts: 212

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 14:30

Clarets.



Don't get touchy it was not an assumption but a question.

Maybe you could recommend some anger management treatment for yourself ??



Have you done ANY work today to justify your fat NHS salary which many taxpayers on this forum contribute to ?

proger1



Joined: 18/04/2009
Posts: 2918

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 14:52

Moover321, No apology needed for a typo. I just made the mistake of thinking it was on purpose, easy to make mistakes and be slammed on here so I thought I would join in.

As for supporting Clarets when he was also insulting back, my point was that it wasn't nescessary as it isn't on most of the threads as you have agreed to.



If you want me to take a side I am afraid I am not allowed to, I don't pay tax, I don't use the NHS and I have spent a total of 6 weeks in the UK in the last 7 years and 1 of those was only because I was forced too because of a training course. I will say that my mother and 3 of her sisters were either SRN's or SEN's and her brother was a paramedic (modern name) he started as an ambulance driver/medic. They are all now in late 50's early 60's and not one of them is still with or retired from the NHS. That was well before the Labour days so I think any government you care to choose has screwed it up. Labour has just made it even worse.

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 15:42

vincent1. It appears Clarets is too busy in his surgery now to answer our questions.

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 15:44

Woodspeckie....yes just finished am surgery not long ago.Working my way through piles of paper now,before visits and then evening surgery. Dont think I missed anything.Got out of here at 8:30 pm Monday evening(which is usual). Don't think the NHS has any gripes about what I am paid for my time,and it would appear that of all the professions.....mine is valued the most highly amongst Joe Public.....in various polls produced by MORI,as the most truthful and honest.91% of people surveyed felt this as this was the case. Lawyers do not come in the top 16....they are below such parasites as Government ministers,politicians generally,journalists,trade union officials etc. Mr Blair's wife is a shining example of such nepotic practice and as for Blair himself.....WOMD's......he is still looking(Envoy to the Middle East!)

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 15:50

Clarets:



Perhaps you are just overworked - but nothing you have said regarding the natur of the topic has actually made any sense! Outside of you being an 'apparent' doctor - there is really not much point in reading what you write - besides you may well need that anger management course suggested above



Proger: Understood! I did not ask for you to take sides - simply for balance. As it happens I said there is quite a lot of insulting on this forum with postings from Claret - you can take the time a read what he has said eleswhere It is not so prevalent from other members - and on that we can agree!



Hope is always better than Hatred )

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 16:07

Clarets

for the last time, figures are sept 2008 , published in March 2009,they are not my figures.

the figures for 2009 are not out yet.

They DO include GP''s and staff, They include everybody who works for the NHS,

Even if you add the Scottish NHS, the total is 1.53 million .

Its the percentages of sackings that matter, does it matter if its 35% of1.5 mill, or 35% of 1mill.



Professionally qualified clinical staff TOTAL= 701,324



Support to doctors and nursing staff 286,254

Support to ST&T staff 55,689

Support to ambulance staff 13,060

Support to Clinical Staff TOTAL =355,010



Central functions 105,354

Hotel, property & estates 73,797

Manager & senior manager 39,913

Other non-medical staff and those with unknown classification 353

NHS infrastructure support TOTAL =219,064



Practice staff other than nurses 92,436 Mostly not employed by NHS



500,000 sackings,who?. Cant say more so I'm

proger1



Joined: 18/04/2009
Posts: 2918

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 16:08

Moover321,

I can assure you that I have seen many of Clarets posts and for the most part his insults are responses and not origins.

I agree that this happens on Forums however I still can't understand why. I am a great believer in debate but I think belittleing and insulting are just lack of an education or well founded information as a response, I may be and in all probablility am incorrect in my assumption (there is that word again) but I can only base my theories on what has been written by the acused.



I have seen several times on here, if you don't like whats written, don't read it. In this case I did exactly that and jumped to the end hoping to find some follow up information on the original thread and found that after nearly 50 more posts there was still the same content.

The fact that Clartes gives as good as he gets might be true and he may even give better or worse if based on insults doesn't justify it being started it the first place.



Self opinion = free speech, P

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 16:09

Clarets. Maybe you should have spent the time doing your paperwork earlier instead off posting on here 11 times from the surgery, time better spent I should think.

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 16:32

Proger:



I respect your view but I cannot agree that Clarets does not originate insults! and others on this thread have made the same assessment!



Let's agree to disagree



Free speech is important - but remember it also has its legitimate limits - you can see postings on this above



Hope is IMHO better than hatred!

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 16:35

So lets hope moover this is the last you have to say about this...free speach is one thing....stiring crap is another.

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 16:42

Tiggy:



I will continue to say what I want, when I want and it has little or nothing to do with you!



If you believe what I have written is "crap" no one is forcing you to read it!



The fact that your colours are clearly tied to the camp of BNP sympathisers is neither here nor there



It would be more worthy if you could actually make a contribution to the debate that is more than just slating off someone you disagree with!



As I have said Hope is better than hatred Just try and mull that over - may be you will be inspired!

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 16:54

Pike, I have to read it all t o see if their is any crap in it!.....being you...as usual it is full of it.



Welcome back in another made up name.....you must not be very busy on the British transports Poice information line. And getting paid for it as well



How did you know I was in the BNP....I'm also ex NF!! One day I hope to be on Question Time.........

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 17:05

Tiggy:



I think you need help! Now you are totally off the tracks



I am glad you are BNP and Ex-NF - I am so happy for you!



Maybe one day we'll meet on Question Time Like to see your face when you find out exactly who I am LOL

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 17:08

Tiggy:



Look another separate post - quick - get the posting police I may get as many stars as you...Oh! My God...wouldn't that be something to aspire to... )) LOL LMAO ))



You still cannot think of anything constructive to say besides insults?



Hope is better than hatred - doesn't it feel good )

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 17:26

Woodspeckie... I can manage my time efficiently between patients coming down the corridor from reception to consultation,without it impinging on my work,thank-you !

Jeannie


Joined: 04/08/2009
Posts: 3283

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 17:29

I suppose it might explain why so many GP's are "running late" when you turn up for your appointment?

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 17:32

Movicol321.....you really have become obsessed to the point of fixation with deluding yourself about everyone who disagrees with you,being a BNP activist ! This level of paranoid delusion is almost sectionable under the MH Act. Lots of people tell you that you throw insults and arrogance in all directions.......but strangely everyone else is wrong.............and you are right. Those voices getting louder?

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 18:01

QT, Like t o see my face.....I have already seen yours, so it will be no surprise. You are going down your usual track.....either you have run out of pills or you feel you are cured!



I think you may need to heed the doctors advice above! As for stars....you are floating amongst them!



Nice to see we can remain buddies.

kaysera


Joined: 14/07/2009
Posts: 103

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 18:34

Msg 100: Couldn't agree more!

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 19:43

Tiggy:



If you have seen my face then you really are delusional



As for your greind who is an "appaently" a doctor - would stay well away - never trust people who claim to work for the NHS, then run it down as being over staffed and spend most of the working day on a chat forum and of course has friends like you!



Sorry to disappoint you - I could never be buddies with you



Hope is better than hatred ) Message still not getting through - maybe your old headmaster should have helped you with the notion of hope ) LOL )

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 19:46

Tiggy:



Look more spaced out postings - better run again to the posting police and inform them )



If I was floating amongst stars I guess you and your cohorts would be in another universe



Hope better than hatred )

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 20:08

Pikey....you are loosing it again.......we had all better be prepared for one of your rants....I can feel it coming on. As for not trusting the NHS doctor...I doubt many would put any trust in your latest made up profession ....Lawyer!!.......about sums it up.



Never had a headmaster to help me.........Headmistress....now she was nice.



Please enlighten me/us about the posting Police.



I will remain your buddie as you need someone to look out for you.



Looking forward to reading your next insane episode!

Moover321


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 649

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 20:20

Tiggy:



You must be very desperate to meet this person called Pike - was he the love of your life?



You seem obsessed with him even though I don't know who he is - I can sense that as a BNP supporter you still have to remain in the closet )



I don't need to rant - I leave that to you and your friends - the boot boys of the facist BNP



Hope is better than hatred....surely by now you have got the message? LOL

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 20:31

Me mums got me dinner ready so I will have to be quick.



You are welcome to look inside my closet, you might like the darkness! not the first time that you have made that silly comment....or the last.



I see you have 3 stars up now.....still a long way to go to get your 5 as you had in the past....that's before you got yourself banned!!!!!!



I'm getting to like you alright........lets see how it goes.....no rush, let's take our time.



XXXX





Im on me way mum.

AlsancakJack



Joined: 14/08/2008
Posts: 5762

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 20:46

This thread is now closed. Reason: Thread went off topic.

AlsancakJack



Joined: 14/08/2008
Posts: 5762

Message Posted:
11/11/2009 22:42

This thread is now closed. Reason: Thread went off topic.