This ruling will give the RoC "indigestion"

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 07:03

EUROPEAN COURT OF JUSTICE RULES VISAS NOT NEEDED FROM TURKS

ENTERING EU STATES TO PROVIDE SERVICES



The European Court of Justice yesterday ruled that visas should not be

required from Turkish nationals planning to enter European Union member

states to provide services. Two Turkish nationals in 2007 challenged

Germany's visa requirement of Turkish truck drivers, arguing that this

violated the Ankara Agreement between Turkey and the European

Community.

"Article 41(1) of the Additional Protocol," the court said in its

ruling,

"is to be interpreted as meaning that it precludes the introduction, as

from the entry into force of that protocol, of a requirement that

Turkish

nationals such as the appellants in the main proceedings must have a

visa

to enter the territory of a Member State in order to provide services

there

on behalf of an undertaking established in Turkey, since, on that date,

such a visa was not required.



Will RoC comply..TR doesn't ;)

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 08:14

that is a bit of a shock for them.

also for the tc's who have been crossing south for work.

now they will have competition from the turkish as well.

black market wages just got lower,lol.

erolz


Joined: 17/11/2008
Posts: 3456

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 10:46

The RoC will comply but it will still not allow what it considers to be Turkish nationals to cross from the North to the South.

darrener2


Joined: 30/12/2008
Posts: 187

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 11:23

I was speaking with a Turkish National two days ago who told me that he had been informed (by whom, he didn't say), that as he was married to a British National he would be allowed to accompany her over to the South, after showing their marriage certificate.

They tried at one crossing and were refused, so the next day they tried at another and were allowed to cross.

He didn't say exactly when this happened, but I think that this was within the last couple of weeks.



Fiona

denizkisi


Joined: 18/09/2008
Posts: 196

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 11:46

Message 4.



I also know a Turkish lady married to an English guy, and they find that sometimes she can cross over and other times she can't!! Depends who is on duty I think?

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 11:46

My son, a Turkish Cypriot, married to a Turkish national in Istanbul. First they did a test trial at Famagusta check point where it is controlled by the British Bases. They followed good advice and they had the following originals with them:

1. ID card of husband and ID cards of his mother and father.

2. Marriage certificate.

3. Turkish ID card for her.



At checkpoint the officials got photocopies of everything and then they gave her a paper saying that she is free to cross over and they confirmed that this paper was recognised by the GC authorities.



They crossed over several times from various check points with no problem but they do take much longer than others to check their papers. Apart from the official "pass" she always carries the Marriage CErtificate just in case and on occasions they have asked to see it.



My understanding is that the GCs are more fussy if the marriage took place in TRNC because it reminds them of "settlers"

ismet

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 11:51

Re. msg.1



According to this ruling, if the Turkish Nationals are allowed to enter ROC without a visa, can they refuse entry from the checkpoints on the premise that they did not enter Cyprus through a legal port? If they cannot make this argument against EU nationals, can they make it against Turkish nationals? I bet they will use this excuse and let European court of Justice sort it out in the next couple of years.

ismet

erolz


Joined: 17/11/2008
Posts: 3456

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 12:04

Elko



I know of Turkish nationals that were refused pertsmission to cross despite having a valid visa. Now they no longer need the visa I doubt the situation will be any different. They will I suspect be refused for having entered Cyprus via a port of illegal entry.



The real problem here is the inconsistency as to what is allowed and what is not. Non EU citizens from countries like US, Canada, NZ and Australia have no problem crossing North to South despite the fact that the same law re entering via a prot of illegal entry applies to them as it would to Turkish nationals.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 12:10

msg. 8

Erol,

My all time favourite tv advert was:

"Yoktur birbirimizden farkımız fakat biz Osmanlı Bankasıyız"

In English:

"There is no difference between us but we are the Ottoman Bank".



We are much the same. No matter what the laws are, we Cypriots as a whole act as it suits us.

ismet

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 12:39

Hi Erolz, I know I owe you a response on another thread - and you will get it- but I'm not home, yet !



This ruling means that the RoC will be contrevening the VERY protocol that Turkey refuses to adhere to re RoC Planes , shipping , customs, etc. if they refuse to allow a Turkish lorry driver to ply his trade..!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 12:48

Hi Fiona, re msg 4



The person is correct.. it concerns the VERY EU Directive that I locked horns with the RoC with re Veta !



2004 /EC /38



http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2004:229:0035:0048:EN:PDF



Essentially, if one's dependent is a non EU national - and you are - and can demonstrate a partnership ( marriage / living together - even same sex) then the member statehas to provide the EU dependent a right to enter and reside - unless a risk to public health or national security !!!



It is better to apply for a Visa- which must be issued FOC, but a member stae cannot refuse entry if one can demonstrate the relationship ( e.g marriage cert.)



Of course that is the THEORY...



http://eumovement.wordpress.com/information-cyprus/

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 12:58

Hi Izzzie re 7



they might TRY - the EU Directive re freedom of movement only applies to an if a Turk was accompanied by an EU national - a dependent, they wouldn't have a leg to stand on.



But the Anakara Protocol isn't being implimented by Turkey re the RoC.. so I think the RoC might reciprocate !

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 13:02

re msg 8, Erolz,



YES they are inconsistent - but legally ( EU wise)



Your lady can cross as she is with you .. you woould only have to demonstrate a relationship.



They checked Veta's visa and made sure she had arrived via LCA/ PFO when we crossed at Ay. dom / M' Han, but NEVER going in / out at Ledra Palace..

erolz


Joined: 17/11/2008
Posts: 3456

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 15:30

Just for the record my partner crosses all the time without me. Nor are we formally married and I have no idea how I would prove our common law couple status if such was necessary, which to date it has not been.

breezyboy


Joined: 14/05/2007
Posts: 1179

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 15:46

Am I missing something?

A turkish National can cross into EEC in this case theROC, to provide services.

If you dont give him a work permit to provide these services then he cannot in theory enter ????????

Driving a lorry he would be working for a TRNC employer.

Going to do plumbing he would need a work permit?

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 16:08

Hi Erolz re msg 14



Please excuse the typos, earlier - I'm trying to touch type and I was on a lap top!



OK, so you've also proved (again ) the RoC aren't efficient enforcers of their own laws.. Does you partner ever try to cross in a car alone ?



I witnessed a family of Aussies arrive into Paphos - when we were enduring the usual your wife is on a stop list crap - they all had a RoC stamp put in their passports ! They SHOULD check - as they are the "frontline" of the EU.....

ROBIN HOOD


Joined: 26/05/2008
Posts: 238

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 16:12

Maybe the Turks will stop charging a tenner for a visa for brits landing in Turkey on the way over then. May happen? Mightn't it? Possibly?

erolz


Joined: 17/11/2008
Posts: 3456

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 17:51

"Does you partner ever try to cross in a car alone ? "



Regularly

Macha


Joined: 18/01/2009
Posts: 650

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 19:19

Erolz: " Nor are we formally married and I have no idea how I would prove our common law couple status if such was necessary"



Come on and get on with it- I bet she's itching to be asked. ;)

Macha


Joined: 18/01/2009
Posts: 650

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 19:21

Sorry, "she" was an assumption...