Pension Wipeout

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 21:32

Just been announced on BBC that The Post Office is all but insolvent with regards to it's pension fund. How many thousands have been paying into this fund I wonder and are now sitting at home devastated by this awful news which will badly effect their futures.



10 years ago the UK had the best Pension industry in Europe and more funds at it's disposable than any other European country.

Then Gordon Brown began to raid them...



Joseph

Coachie



Joined: 29/07/2008
Posts: 2135

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 21:45

more like management raidedthem.

rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:07

the fat cats took all the funds in bonuses joseph .

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:17

another strike coming up.Its all so sad. I read today that Sir Jackie Steward is staying on as global ambassador for RBS whilsst they are axing 30,000 jobs. good for him as a tax exile in switzerland so now the tax payer who now own 68 % will be paying his fees. Please keep the 6 nations sponsorship get rid of all your super stars on money like this. At least Andy Murray agreed to a pay cut but I wonder if Zara Phillips will xxxx

rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:20

no chance lilli??

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:27

Have to agree managment, particularly post office, has been poor.

Remember the guy who was sacked by the F.A. and immediately given the top job by The Post Office, from Football to The Royal Mail... the mind boggles?



Economists figures so far as the the money "stolen" by Brown since this corrupt lot have neen in power estimated @ £14,000,000,000.

That is fourteen billion...



Meanwhile MP's who pay 0 into their pension funds, as it is paid by the tax payer have had any number of increases to their pension pots to smooth over any thoughts of them complaining. The last increase was 40%.



I wonder how many pensioners get a 40 % increase, how often and when?



I call it corrupt.



Joseph

Coachie



Joined: 29/07/2008
Posts: 2135

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:29

Rowlo..I worked for 22yrs for a large multinational group who had allowed a £500million black whole to appear in there pension fund because theyhad not been paying there share into the pension scheme.It only came to light when a take over was made and the buyers agreed to pay the "missing" money as part of the take over deal which was very fortuneate for us.Probably something similar has happened to the Post Office scheme.It is not the first and it wont be last scheme that has been plundered by firms to try and survive bankruptcy..

rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:35

ok coachie , theres not many firms if any could fill that black hole now ? and if they werent paying it in where was the money going ? top bosses bonuses no doubt ?

rtddci


Joined: 29/12/2007
Posts: 842

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:42

The Labour Government kindly allowed firms with pension funds to take a contribution holiday for several years.

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:50

oh coachie thats sad.was it ever sorted. my friends worked for ASW and spent thier late years fighting. I dont know if that has ever been resolved. Do the companies now who close down do not protect the pension funds. I live here in the trnc and do not get fuel allowence although many of my customers do, i dont get any increase but again i know people who get everything. Who the hell can blame them now if they dont you wont only another ethnic group. it makes me mad xxx

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 22:51

According to the evening newscasts, so far the figure needed to re-instate the satus quo is £6 Billion



Can someone remind us how much they have given the banks so far?



Regards Joseph

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 23:09

dear joseph who will ever know xxxxxx

karakum5c



Joined: 18/03/2008
Posts: 1021

Message Posted:
24/02/2009 23:46

The figure the Post Office pension fund will require is closer to £9 billion !



I have 25 years contributions locked into the fund, my wife the same.



Interestingly the pension fund went into a private partnership with a private financial company a number of years back to give it much needed private experience--

The companies name EQUITABLE LIFE

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
25/02/2009 09:03

now that the goverment has stakes in loads of these banks, and we the tax payers are paying to keep them afloat.

why have we not been issued with shares?

breezyboy


Joined: 14/05/2007
Posts: 1179

Message Posted:
25/02/2009 12:58

Pension funds all work on how much they can make with your money. The last 12 months hasn't been fun for the individual pension fund investor or the big boys. In my opinion large funds are ,on average not very good at it maybe because they are very cautious. My pension advisor has kept my losses down to 7% over the last 3/4 months whilst the FTSE has lost over 20%. I would imagine that those in large company pension funds receive or are entitled to receive details of what is happening with their money. As for final salary pensions, the writing has been on the wall for years now.

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
25/02/2009 14:21

Is Royal Mail the first business to come clean re the pension funds fiasco ...

and will we now see a deluge of other major corporations admitting the same.

Back home Mandelsohn is accused of leaking the info in order to push thru plans to sell off the most profitable parts of Royal Mail.



Earlier I wrote:

Economists' figures so far as the the money "stolen" by Brown since this corrupt lot have neen in power estimated @ £14,000,000,000.

That is fourteen billion...



Apologies that figure is wrong, that was the estimated figure over a 2 year period and the correct figure amounts to 7 billion a year so after 10 years in

power this corrupt lot have stolen over 70 billion to date from pension funds.

£70,000,000,000. ?



Will these people ever come clean?



Regards Joseph

Coachie



Joined: 29/07/2008
Posts: 2135

Message Posted:
25/02/2009 22:23

Pension holidays were olnly supposed to take place if the company had £500million in the kitty,but some companies fiddled there books to look as if they were complying,and did not start paying in again,so they decided to try and get rid of final salary schemesand they succeeded,tyherefore did not make up the shortfall.Only time Gov.was involved was if they exceeded the £500million then they were taxed on the excess and I believe in recent years they have paid money to people who lost there pensions when companies used the funds to try and save the company going bump...

rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
25/02/2009 22:35

most pension funds were non contributing , but the real people that have been done is people like me , self employed ,own business , paying serious money to those bastxrds who just took it and paid themselves big bonuses ????

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 02:24

Here some info being discussed on late news back in the UK. to help you all choke on your morning coffee



Fred Goodwin ... late of RBS Bank... resigned/sacked got himself a pension pot of £647,000 per annum.



Just to put it in context that is ..... ...... ...... £12450.00 per week.



Could he afford to live in TRNC on such a small income



Regards Joseph

frontalman



Joined: 28/02/2008
Posts: 499

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 08:26

Pension pots are used to buy annuities, which are the actual payments most people describe as pensions. With interest rates so low, what rates have annuities dropped to, I wonder. Anyone out there in the know? What annual income (annuity) would £100K buy you now, for instance?

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 12:50

Hi Frontalman,



Fred Goodwins above is guaranteed



Many people esp. self employed would have originally signed up for a guaranteed annuity rate depending both on their provider and when they took out their original pension. That is why one should always check before moving any "pot" to a better provider in case you lose that guarantee. When comparing it is important to remember any rates quoted are "general rates" not the guaranteed annuity rates. Only your original provider will remain with the original guarantee.



Obviously outside of that guarantee anyone retiring later .ie. on 65th, 70th or 74th birthday would see better rates the longer they left it.

Some might opt for drawdown which allows partial payment of their pension in the hope that rates might improve.



Currently rates vary cos of the above, age taken and whether quoting for male or female. On your example of £100,000. level rates vary between:

£6000 and £9000 roughly.



Hope this helps



Reagrds Joseph

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 13:02

Frotalman cont...



Add to all that is whether or not you opt for single or joint pension and whether or not you have an impairment or are a smoker. Impairment and or smokers will receive a larger amount. Single pensions payout only on a single life so shoould you die thats it , whereas a joint pension will pay 50% or more to the surviving spouse.



And don't forget the tax man. Everything quoted above is liable to tax



Regards Joseph

bankadan


Joined: 14/12/2007
Posts: 979

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 13:02

A family member has just seen a Finance advisor here in Cyprus and they are recomending he moves his private pension fund (Allied Dunbar)into TL government bonds. Anybody in the know any knowledge of this ...

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 13:24

Hi Bankadan;



Sorry I would not know about TL Gov.bonds but it is absolutely vital you take professional impartial advice, so always get a second opinion. As mentioned above so much depends on your age etc.



For instance my own feel for anyone over the 60 age group is to take the best current deal as I cannot see things improving financially for a good while yet, can you? How old are you/they?



Is this a plan that is near to ending in the next year or two or are they still young with quite a lot of years still to pay in?



First thing though ... check your Pension Plan and find out if it carries a guaranteed annuity payment, this will be stated on the plan or if you are unsure make a phone call to the provider and ask, this is very important so make that call, because if you move/change the plan the guarantee could be lost?



Hope this helps



Regards Joseph

frontalman



Joined: 28/02/2008
Posts: 499

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 18:30

Thanks Joseph, I'm surprised one can still get 6% when interest rates are so low, even though you forego your capital.

ROBnJO


Joined: 30/06/2008
Posts: 1289

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 18:57

frontalman



I believe that Actuaries (those who individually assess you as a risk/term investment) will assume they are investing your 'pot' for a set term, say 30 yrs, but relying on you snuffing it well before such said term, say in 23 yrs, and granting them the balance of your pot.

Thereby they can offer you say 6%, even though they feel the actual cost to them will be considerably less.



Heads they win,... Tails you lose! (unless you live to 100!).



Rob

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 19:44

Frontalman



As RobnJo has pointed out it depends very much at what stage you are at with your payments ie. your age now and how many years are left ?



But please note this current figure is for LEVEL Rates.

RPI ... that is index linked... would be give figures abvove between £4-6000.



So when considering figures available you must zero in on those specific areas pertaining to you.



Current Age

Date pension matures

Guaranteed Annuity/ not guaranteed

RPI

Level

Smoker

Impaired

Male/Female



Etc etc, all sounds very complicated but in fact it isn't, for some reason financial packages like to wrap themselves up in loads of jargon that would send most sane people up the wall, that is why it is important to seek independent advice from a couple of sources or from a source with whom you have had a longstanding relationship/trust with. Another thought ... check whether the original paperwork was written "In Trust"...?



Hope this helps, regards Joseph

bankadan


Joined: 14/12/2007
Posts: 979

Message Posted:
27/02/2009 09:03

Joseph, thanks. Agree, very confusing. The person is in their 40's. Will tell them to check on the guaranteed annuity payment you mentioned first of all. Sorry to be thick, but do you mean if it has one then he should not be transferring.

Thanks for the advice.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
27/02/2009 09:32

Adding on to what Joseph has said you should also consider whether you want a joint life annuity or an impaired life annuity.

breezyboy


Joined: 14/05/2007
Posts: 1179

Message Posted:
27/02/2009 11:56

Joseph- the total tax pot is not subject to tax as your earlier posting might suggest to some.

You have 25% tax free whenever you want to start taking your pension. This is obviously very useful to get the higher rates available in TRNC. If you continue to pay money, tax free into the pot you can immediately take 25% of it out again tax free.

Also to expand on drawdown would I think be helpful.

This is available until age 75 when you must take an annuity which is of course a lot higher by then. The percentage you are allowed to take of your pension pot varies by age. From 60-65 this is about 6.2% rising again agter 65. The big differance is that you have control of your pot whilst taking drawdown. You haven't signed it away irrevocably to some grasping insurance company who hopes you will drop off this mortal coil a lot earlier than you think. If you do drop off and your spouse is younger than you so long as he/she is not wanting to take it all in cash they can go on to 75 as well.

bankadan


Joined: 14/12/2007
Posts: 979

Message Posted:
27/02/2009 12:31

does anyone know anything about transferrring a uk private pension into TL Turkish Government Bonds at all?

TIA

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
27/02/2009 12:42

Hi Bankadan, remember seek independent financial advice... meanwhile



Re Guaranteed Annuity... yes do not transfer at this time.



Let us say you have a G/Annuity of say 10% which was quite common twenty years or so ago when you first took out your pension then that 10% guarantee would be lost if transferred.

Neither would it make sense to give up such a guarantee, especially as current rates are half of that.



Secondly when contacting company to check if there is a guarantee, ask company if the pension is "written in Trust"... if not ask the provider to add such a clause to any and all pension funds held. This should only add a one off cost of say £20 or £30 but would then free up your pension from any inheritance tax liable on your estate vis a vis pensions should you die.



Re held in trust...This is a small, but I think perhaps important detail, which you and many people may be unaware of?



Hope this helps



Regards Joseph

WETBRIT


Joined: 30/06/2008
Posts: 20

Message Posted:
27/02/2009 13:12

Try this site and select Annuity Rate Best Buy Table from left column.



Not a recommendation just a info link

In The UK With Hargreaves Lansdown



http://www.H-L.co.uk/best_buy_tables

WETBRIT


Joined: 30/06/2008
Posts: 20

Message Posted:
27/02/2009 14:22

Not only Post Office pensioners need to worry.

Though Gordon has screwed the UK, Ireland is far worse.

A Post Office bank account the so called Peoples Bank is not protected under UK FSCs rules.

It is an Irish Bank, called Bank Of Ireland,with alleged protection under the Irish Government scheme. However as Ireland is speeding towards full scale financial disaster any compensation is likely to be as worthless as the Icelandic fiasco.

An online check of banking credit rating agencies FITCH, MOODY’S or STANDARD and POOR reveal a financial institutions reputation and what they think of the Bank of Ireland.

Basically if a company does not have an AAA ratings do not touch it with your savings. Investments are different and always have an element of risk.

In March 2008 Icelandic banks were rated A and below.

Even Gerry Adams condemned the Irish government at the weekend for its pitiful financial state.

It is always prudent savers that get screwed. Note that all the sites I use are

breezyboy


Joined: 14/05/2007
Posts: 1179

Message Posted:
27/02/2009 18:37

Iceland wasnt too bad if you had invested less than £50k in a British office of their banks. I invested in Kaupthing Edge in September. Sat by the pool in October. Went home to find that the goverment had transfered my account to ING at the same rate I had from KE. Didnt even fill a form in!

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
28/02/2009 18:17

Just gets worse...



Another HBOS executive has been found to have walked away with a £600,000

handout... his job... advising HBOS how to get into the High Commision Toxic Mortgage Debt in the USA.



£ six hundred thousand pounds...?



The mind boggles...



Regards Joseph

gates


Joined: 08/12/2008
Posts: 1096

Message Posted:
28/02/2009 18:25

after the last electoin won by labour again i spoke to a driver that was delivering to the green grosers next door and said who has voted this lot in again he said you would not want the other lot in usless crowd what do you think he is saying now did you vote labour the best thing or are you anoyher oh no i voted cons ha ha as far as i am concerned you took the vote well done like that driver you get what you suport

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
28/02/2009 18:32

Hi Gates...



This shower is not labour... it is New Labour... they killed off the old party 11 years ago. Have never voted for them, too corrupt for my liking.



Bit like the EU.

I have to own up to voting yes the second time for the Common Market twenty years ago or so... The Common Market note... when and if we get the constitutional vote I am sure you can guess where I am putting my X



Regards Joseph

joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
28/02/2009 18:33

re msg 38



Or better still...where I would like to put it



Joseph