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Largest loss in Corporate history

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No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 12:55

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Message 1 of 42 in Discussion

Royal Bank of Scotland (RBS) has announced the largest annual loss in UK corporate history.



RBS, which had to be bailed out by the government last year, said that its 2008 loss totalled 24.1bn ($34.2bn).



Despite this Sir Fred Goodwin, the bank's former chief executive, is already drawing a pension of 650,000 a year, despite only being 50.



Allright if you can get it!!



Coachie



Joined: 29/07/2008
Posts: 2135

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 13:14

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Message 2 of 42 in Discussion

No1..No doubt some other big corporate finance company will take him on and pay him some ridiculous salary.They all look after one another..If I am not mistaken did he nothave a job with government in some finance capacity???



No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 13:46

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Message 3 of 42 in Discussion

I'm not sure Coachie. If it were me I wouldn't bother looking for work - that's for sure. ))



The-Wicks


Joined: 27/05/2007
Posts: 2279

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 13:52

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Message 4 of 42 in Discussion

Bill - surely if "we" own the bank now, we can object to this ridiculous pension? LOL.

This matter is going to be discussed on the Jeremy Vine Radio 2 programme at lunchtime - should be interesting!!



Kind regards



J



No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 14:02

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Message 5 of 42 in Discussion

Jean, once his pension is 'in payment' there's nothing any of us can do about it. I'm amazed he's been able to build up such a huge pension 'pot' - estimated to be around 17m!



We're all in the wrong jobs i'm afraid.



Dixie Normus


Joined: 22/02/2008
Posts: 820

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 14:13

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Message 6 of 42 in Discussion

Scotish Company, Scotish Chancelor, Scotish Prime Minister, Gormless Gordon will be shoveling money at RBS to keep jockland alive for the next 10 years.

RBS was the most succesfull thing to happen to Scotland in recent times, now its going to be a ball and chain arround the British peple for the next decade, the directors and managers who engineered this high risk stratagy should have their assets stripped and be put behind bars, (Iron bars).



D.N



kavenkoy


Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 1787

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 16:21

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Message 7 of 42 in Discussion

I had the chance to visit RBS 2 months ago for a corporate meeting .



you want to go in the canteens for top earners up in scotland ,5star cuisne ,wine lists of extensive choice etc



put any restraunt out of business,food fab



kav



ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
26/02/2009 16:48

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Message 8 of 42 in Discussion

msge 7



You were privileged kavenkoy. Their head office is meant to be awesome.



I went to Drummond House in Edinburgh two years ago just before they moved to the new offices in Edinburgh. Even the food at Drummond was fantastic, as it is Manchester, Birmingham and London.



No surprises, the city has been describing Goodwin as a megalomaniac for a number of years now. Talk about the pot calling the kettle...........



negativenick


Joined: 10/11/2008
Posts: 6023

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 16:50

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Message 9 of 42 in Discussion

i know Garry Monger's Missus lost her keys under the sofa a couple of years back......





Nick



BillyB


Joined: 19/05/2008
Posts: 436

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 18:00

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Message 10 of 42 in Discussion

Nick leeson gets put behind bars for his irresponsible dealings but the directors of these banks get awarded 650k a year pensions for their irresponsible dealings. 650k a year, they could of saved 25 redundencies with that.



Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 18:08

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Message 11 of 42 in Discussion

The way I understand it is this corrupt and useless govenment of ours already knew of and approved of this deal and until the public outcry they simply said nothing, but now they are the peoples friend................shameless.



rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 18:11

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Message 12 of 42 in Discussion

i worked on the new rbs hq at gogarburn in edinburgh, its like a little city in their, electricity used in a month would run a small country for a year??



rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 18:36

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Message 13 of 42 in Discussion

oh and how about jackie stewarts 4 million pound a year salary , for being a global ambassador ? what a global joke .



Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 19:50

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Message 14 of 42 in Discussion

hiya rowlo global ambassador ot what, corporate planning on how to fail yet get a great pensikon. What they hell are they paying him for, even zara phillips took a reduction. I think if they stop all the sponsorship maybe we m,ay get a british team as such. Reason if they big maney is not there we cant we cant pay the big guys so maybe we will have to look at grass roots and bring our young talentened youngsters into the arena. What is paid to the sportsmen now would wipe out our debt. Please dont get me wrong I love sport but not prima donnas, as is now from managers to players. Without the massive sponsorship deals we find the new british talent xxxx



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:19

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Message 15 of 42 in Discussion

Hi Lilli et al



One common question that runs thru this post and similar is Accountability.



Refer: "Pension Wipeout"

Refer: "Corruption... Cover up ... or Just Plain Dihonesty"



Be honest if your son played for one of the Premier Football clubs and was on 100,000 per week you would be downright proud of him, or earned that a year from a top bank I daresay the same would apply. The banks got away with monstrous rewards because no one stepped in on behalf of the paying public to put a halt to such greed. Especially at the top?



It is similar to outcries we get when some cretin murders a young child, given 10 years and we know he'll be out in 6. Everyone blames the judge.

But in our country it is Parliament that is sovereign, it is parliament and thus the government who set the tariff, not the judges.



So the buck on all this mess stops with Brown, no one else. This man is suppose to be safeguarding the public as our (un) elected P.M.



Therein lies the answer.



Joseph



rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:29

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Message 16 of 42 in Discussion

me thinks that blair caused all the problems , and left brown to clean up the mess ? or try to .



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:35

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Message 17 of 42 in Discussion

Fair point rowlo... except...



Who was Chancellor during all Blair's years?



Regards Joseph



rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:37

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Message 18 of 42 in Discussion

brown , but he would only be doing what he was told???



pilgrim



Joined: 11/05/2007
Posts: 1404

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:41

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Message 19 of 42 in Discussion

Brown caused mess by taking power away from Bank of England, when Chancellor. Has cost us personnally more than any other event or person in British history experts say.



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:42

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Message 20 of 42 in Discussion

That's what the bankers are saying now



Regards Joseph



rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:44

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Message 21 of 42 in Discussion

cant see that pilgrim ? we had the strongest economy in the world under blair/brown ?????????????????/



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:46

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Message 22 of 42 in Discussion

Not to be confused



Sorry last msg 20 was reply to Rowlo msg 18



Spot on Pilgrim, spot on. What gets me is this guy will be out campaigning next election with a lorry load of butter in his mouth... unbelievable



Regards Joseph



rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:50

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Message 23 of 42 in Discussion

yeah , but so will the tories ? they brought this country to its knees in the 80s ??? msg 22



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 20:55

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Message 24 of 42 in Discussion

Seriously Rowlo... it must be different in Scotland?



Down here thousands of people's jobs are in jeopardy.

The value of people's homes are in free fall?

Our kids are saddled with huge debts for attending university?

Our National health is a mess?

Our young men are bravely dying in a war they lied about?

Our teachers and police say all respect has disappeared for authority?

Our elderly are forced to sell their homes to gain health care?

Senior citizens live in fear of yobs?

Suicide has reached endemic proportions esp amongst the youth?

Our society is being wrecked by the p.c. brigade?

Just to name a few facts...



And finally, there is a brain drain, as people realise just were all this liberalism has got us and are moving to TRNC



Regards Joseph



rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 21:08

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Message 25 of 42 in Discussion

listen mate , i was in the parachute regiment for 6yrs i fought a war for this /our country , never asked a question about tory leadership , but torys , sent us their , we went and done our job , more than snivelling little prxcks will ever do in your entire life ?????????//



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 21:39

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Message 26 of 42 in Discussion

Wow Rowlo... some answer



I stick up for the bravery of our soldiers and you call me a snivelling...



Your answer is unfair and uncalled for... this was a question of snivelling...

as you call them... people at the top now, lighten up.

I have family members killed fighting for this country so you need to separate peoples politics and accountability. I would never use their deaths to justify a vote one way or the other. I deal with it privately. But no offence taken.



Regards Joseph



rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 21:54

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Message 27 of 42 in Discussion

yes joseph thats cool, no offence meant , i put my life on the line for torys to rejoise in theyre victory , didnt bring my mates home thou did it? and they dont even care ?



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 21:58

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Message 28 of 42 in Discussion

No probs Rowlo..



but I care and I think you will find everyone at home does when it comes to our lads.



Regards Joseph



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 22:00

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Message 29 of 42 in Discussion

the first woman to start a war.........was old maggie,bless her....

















spider.!!



Mr Vince


Joined: 24/07/2008
Posts: 696

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 22:02

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Message 30 of 42 in Discussion

Watching the news today and saw some female cabinet member say about this guys 650,000 a year pension; she intends to have the government remove it from him and if he does not like it then he will have to fight the government in the courts. Ding Ding, Seconds Out, Round 2.



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
01/03/2009 22:04

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Message 31 of 42 in Discussion

i belive us who live here..are voteless.......and as for by post i think not....

















me..



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
03/03/2009 17:56

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Message 32 of 42 in Discussion

Well No1D ... that didn't take long for some one to out do RBS?



AIG, last night admitted losses in excess of 60 billion... 60,000,000,000?



They have already made use of government handouts to the tune of 30 billion though I do not whether this was factored in



Frightening.



Regards Joseph



No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
03/03/2009 18:01

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Message 33 of 42 in Discussion

Joseph. It won't be long before we hear of another announcing losses higher than that!



We're all doomed. Spend your money now before it becomes worthless! )



Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
03/03/2009 18:15

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Message 34 of 42 in Discussion

Call me stupid......... Is it that these banks have lent out all this money and no one has bothered to pay them back.....& how comes with all the back room whizz kids looking aftert the books that once one bank finds out the cupboard is bare then low and behold the rest find out the same thing.



Please explain ??



I have no debts of any kind and now I am going to be made to fork out my taxes to bale these banks out and also cough up for these wankers to live a life of luxury on their pensions.



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
03/03/2009 19:55

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Message 35 of 42 in Discussion

Hi Tiggy... big question but...



I am sure you will remember when banks were just that. You deposited your money and got say 6% on your savings then someone else would borrow it and be charged say 10% and the banks profit was the difference. But banks then decided that they would move into "investment structures" and this led to lending bigger and bigger ammounts, but not just for mortgages but for shopping malls and big business loans etc. The profits these brought in were massive and the bankers were in clover, but they got greedier and greedier and began to set targets for ever bigger profits. This is ok when borrowers are well capitalised companies.



But in the hope of maintaining big profits they began to take bigger risks, well why not they thought, we are so big we can afford it? So in order to hit targets (and get huge bonus') the risks became untenable, but still they carried on.



Meanwhile, the watchdogs, ie the government who are supposed to look after the public...



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
03/03/2009 20:03

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Message 36 of 42 in Discussion

cont...



Meanwhile, the watchdogs, ie the government who are supposed to look after the public interest turned a blind eye because they were getting in all the tax that these silly risk strategies provided.



In the UK Brown had split the responsibilty by making the Bank Of England independent but without any real remit... ie teeth. So when the first crack appeared The Treasury (Brown) passed it on to the FSA who in turned looked to the Bank of England. Result... dither dither .

Three departments all looking at each other.



Remember four years ago New Labour told us all that Brown was bees knees and the global economy had nothing to do with the good figures at that time, when it all turned ofcourse... it was the global economy's fault.



So in a nutshell Tiggy we had greedy banks with greedier boards, incompetent watchdog, ie BOE,FSA and Treasury and a PM who now tells us that the way out of the whole mess is... can you believe it... debt...spend our way out



Regards Joseph



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
03/03/2009 20:13

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Message 37 of 42 in Discussion

cont...



So when you hear the phrase toxic debts they are referring to loans made but which are very unlikely to be paid back. As with so many things the greatest economy in the world was the first to show signs of stress, ie the USA.



Problem was/is our banks had been piling into these unsustainable loans because they promised to generate huge profits, hence huge bonus'.

Add to that, the fact that nearly all these Chief Executives and Chairmen of Banks had very little or indeed no banking background and you can see where it might lead.



A guy earns say 20k a year and decides to buy a quarter million dollar house and the banks said ok we'll lend you the money... crazy?



Remember years ago if you applied for a mortgage you could borrow say 4 times your annual income and half or less of your spouse, these rules were built on common sense to protect the bank and its depositors, but they would never promise a big fat bonus at the end of the year.



Get it



Regards Joseph



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
03/03/2009 20:51

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Message 38 of 42 in Discussion

cont...

Tiggy the whole thing stinks to high Heaven.

The greedy have made sure they've golden handshakes in place or massive pensions which are written into their contracts which are watertight.



All this tosh by government to try to take away the huge pension the RBS chairman got... is just that...tosh. They are the ones who approved it in the first place. The current debate about his ill begotten 17 million pension pot is to simply deflect people away from the responsibilities they reneged on. We all know this pot is disgusting... sadly 17 million compared to the billions and billions lost is nothing, but people are now focused on a molehill instead of the mountain. He is the molehill, they are the mountain.



As you say you have no debts so why are you being punished, fact is we will all be punished via our pensions and taxes etc. And now they want to punish our grandchildren and their children by saddling them similarly.



As No1 infers... the tip of the iceberg.



Joseph



No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
03/03/2009 21:12

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Message 39 of 42 in Discussion

Good post Joseph.



fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
04/03/2009 11:50

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Message 40 of 42 in Discussion

i don't think people have learnt by there mistakes.

i was speaking with a friend in the uk who is a mortgage adviser for one of the large banks.

she was saying people are still wanting to borrow up to their limits and some even have asked to go above.

i think she is still gratefully that she has a job with the current climate in the uk.



clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
04/03/2009 12:33

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Message 41 of 42 in Discussion

Its OK talking about Jackie Stewart et Al,but they didn't bring the financial world to its knees. I would not pay ANY banker more than 50 k/annum,because they simply do not earn it. Exactly what do they manufacture and what application of skill benefits others....in fact 50 k is too bloody generous!



joseph


Joined: 17/04/2008
Posts: 709

Message Posted:
04/03/2009 12:43

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Message 42 of 42 in Discussion

Hi Firestarter



Odd you should say that, I made a courtesy call last week to a contact whom I had originally used for an inspection trip 3 years ago from the UK, he sells property flats/vilas etc... I said I hoped he was managing business wise in all the current financial chaos etc and asked how was business? His reply stuck in my mind. Credit crunch... what credit crunch? He said sales were growing?



Hi Clarets... spot on... but as they say... its not what you know it's who

Wish I knew a few of them When are you out next?



Regards Joseph



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