Property - How many people

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 13:21

have paid deposits on property and never seen a brick layed..............

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 13:25

There are people who have paid for their houses in full and have never seen a brick laid . Very very sad but very true .

Regards , Simbas

Rogerdodger


Joined: 24/04/2008
Posts: 271

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 13:30

boerboel,



Where is you place supposed to be built.



RD

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 13:34

Too many.....

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 14:15

Paid deposit 3 years ago on a bungalow in Tatlisu. Development never started, builder cancelled but not admitting to ever receiving our deposit which estate agents inform me he did, cannot find out if any others paid deposit and what happened to them - did they get their money back - go to court or what!!!!!

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 14:18

Simbas - why would people pay in full, thought all payments were in stages as foundations etc got going

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 14:29

If you buy off plan and make your payment up front you can get a substantial discount .

Regards , Simbas

TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 14:32

The returns reflect the risk. Substantial discount = substantial risk.

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 14:55

We were always led to believe that off-plan was stage payments, paying up front was never mentioned. Who in their right mind would pay in full for a drawing, definitely the proverbial head up your a..e No matter how much discount surely if paying in full you should be buying something to move into immediately

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 14:59

Who in their right minds ?? me for one ! Although by the description you gave , one would never know

Simbas

kaiserphil


Joined: 14/12/2008
Posts: 1096

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:05

Keep your head on Simbas.

How old is the kiddy in your arms btw?

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:07

Yes, have to agree with you, we also feel the proverbial, but fortunately not to the tune of your loss.

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:09

Hi Kaisephil , she will be 2yrs old next month . I suppose i should update the photo but i don't want to frighten off prospective new buyers .

Have a good day , Simbas

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:11

What loss do you speak of ?

Regards , Simbas

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:27

Deposit of £13,000, of which £1,000 was to pay a lawyer (never told who that was) to authorise the four signed contracts, which incidentally, all disappeared, how convenient is that for the agent and builder.

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:34

That's a terrible situation to be in boerboel.

However,if I remember correctly on Simbas site,as she said many people were foolishly hoodwinked into paying in full for their off plan villas....over £100K...and still do not have properties many years later.

Simbas was in a distinct and fortunate minority who saw something for their money.



*apologies Simbas if I've got any of this wrong.....just trying to remember the Troy Lake threads from a while ago !*

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:45

I'm sorry to hear of your predicament , Its more common than we dare to think , it's a story we hear time and time again , although that's of little comfort to you , i'm one of the lucky ones , and yes believe it there are some of us around . Obviously you did your homework , so what went so horribly wrong ?

Regards , Simbas

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:49

Thankyou cronos for putting us right. Obviously misread Simbas when she said 'what loss', thought she meant ours when we meant hers. Maybe she may not have been quite so sarky if she had not seen something for her money. Don't know anything about her situation as not been a forum member very long.

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 15:53

Hi Cronos , hope you are keeping well . Yes i am very fortunate . And to correct you if i may , the statement you refer to was not made by me .

Regards , Simbas

smoggyjim


Joined: 21/07/2007
Posts: 214

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 16:03

I am in a similar position but our developer actually started, we have got a concrete shell now after paying 2 stage payments and will be going to court.

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 16:04

Hi boerboel , if you knew me , you would know i could never be sarky . Sometimes the way we write can translate differently to someone else . Believe me there was no malice intended and i am very sorry if i have upset you .

Regards , Simbas

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 16:23

Hi Simba, no not upset just read it wrongly I suppose, how did you manage to become one of the luck ones. Would be interested to know how Julie Wheeler managed to get some of her money back. We lodged our complaint with HBPG and also Tugce at the Property Commission office over a year ago and not heard back. Sorry about your situation smoggyjim, hoped that we would sort ours easily as no building had been started and never will be as the North Coast road goes through the proposed plot but looks like we are no luckier than people like yourself who have concrete shells.

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 18:08

Hi Simbas...msg 19



Yes,sorry.....I didn't mean to imply that this was a direct quote or your words....I just meant that you acknowledged that many people had had such problems on your particular development.



Sorry for any confusion.

beno12



Joined: 03/04/2009
Posts: 124

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 18:11

To all, like to say I,ve been in the Biulding Construction Bussness for over 30 years to hear such quotes as" If you buy off plan and make your payment up front you can get a substantial discount " who ever do,s such a deal is asking for trouble beleave me when the Biulder makes his calculation he know before hand his profit margin any discount to the customer would be + transferred back into the project e.g not up to gradeing material -savings on craftmanship(cheap labour instead of the qualified craftsmann) all these can come to light years later ...then your paying-paying for your discount ...

beno12



Joined: 03/04/2009
Posts: 124

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 18:20

! ups !.................. Business ...........sorry about the spelling!!!.....

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 18:24

Hi Beno , In hindsight i dare say a lot of us would do things differently . In our case we had bought off plan before in 1994 and had no problems . So in 2002 we did the same , we were happy with the price and again we had no real problems apart from the site not being finished . But other people have had real problems .

Regards , Simbas

cronos


Joined: 26/10/2008
Posts: 2093

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 19:14

When you say Cyprus,I take it you mean the whole of the island?

Buying in the North is a minefield,but the problems regarding dodgy builders,corrupt estate agents,ineffective solicitors,title deeds,planning permission etc etc are all also present in the South.

beno12



Joined: 03/04/2009
Posts: 124

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 19:20

Hi Simbas, Your one of the lucky one,s I agree many have real big problems, I was lucky too back in 2005 but had 100% confidence in my Biulding Company in Famagusta after a 2 year research into there work running around the biulding site they had in production at the time before I choose them.

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 20:16

Yeh Beno , i am very lucky and don't i know it , when i read some of the posts its heartbreaking to hear the horror stories , but then on the other hand you do have people who are happy with their purchases . I agree with you , you cannot do enough research . But i can tell you , i did'nt do any research back then when i first bought , How scarey is that , i would'nt dream of not doing it now .

Regards , Simbas

ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 23:22

boerboel wrote: "Deposit of £13,000, of which £1,000 was to pay a lawyer (never told who that was) to authorise the four signed contracts, which incidentally, all disappeared, how convenient is that for the agent and builder."



If you paid this into a bank or if you made out a cheque the should be a paper trail. Equally if you paid in cash you must have had it witnessed and receipted. What are the police saying about it?

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 13:53

We have proof of payment from our UK bank but it has taken 2 years for us to get anything from the agents. They have given us a piece of paper giving us a breakdown of how our deposit was supposedly paid to the developer less their commission etc and also a copy of a cheque for the balance paid to the developer. However, the developer says that the said cheque was not payment from us but from another client. So who is telling the truth??? We feel as no property has ever been started, the agent on our behalf - certainly as an act of goodwill - should recover the money from the developer who they still deal with. This though is extremely unlikely as they just tell us to get it from him. We have consulted a lawyer but have not been to the police as any dealings here regarding problems usually results in the shrug of the shoulders. If it was the UK, the Fraud Squad would have been called in by now.

ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 14:02

In that you you should go to the police as it seems to be a criminal fraud. Surely you want to get your 13K back if so i wish you all the best.

Troodo


Joined: 12/06/2008
Posts: 1002

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 14:19

Sad but true. Yet there are many more who had good builders and are happy.



Troodo

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 14:30

Yes, we want to get our 13K back and will pursue it. Unfortunately we are one of hundreds in a similar boat although yes there are also lots of very happy people.

Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 14:39

This is one of the main reasons that people are advised not to hand over their payments to the ESTATE AGENTS.



Think about it. Are you employing them? NO

Is the developer employing them to sell his property? YES

So where will their loyalty lie?

Could it not complicate any future problems or put you even more at risk of being fleeced? YES

Send all your payments via Direct Debit, in stage payments, to your advocate. Ask your advocate to release money to the developer, only having confirmation that the agreed stage has been reached and upon a receipt from the builder.



Never pay upfront and anyone who pays all before completion risks exploitation .You have left yourself with nothing to bargain with and no incentive for the builder to complete. Most of the biggest scams in the TRNC have been where 1 or 2 houses are completed to a very high standard. The builder really looks after these purchasers who then sing the developers praises to lure customers whose villas are then never co

Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 14:49

cont



completed. I have witnessed this on this very site. People raving about their villas encouraging all to buy. Describing all the positive things the developer has done for them, not realising they are one of the key players in the scam, albeit innocently.



It is very sad but unfortunately a reality of buying in the TRNC.



Which is why you must never mix hospitality with honesty and why you need to take complete control rather than being led.



Go to the police . A fraud has obviously been committed.

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 18:57

Back to the top

joandjelly


Joined: 24/02/2008
Posts: 2953

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 19:51

Hi Boerboel I'm also sorry to hear of your predicament. You have nothing to lose by going to the police so you should at least try. If the developer is telling the truth that the agent did not pass your deposit on then they should have no qualms about supporting you in a case against the agent for fraud. Failing that, perhaps you could try shaming the agent into refunding the money by going to the newspapers.

Good luck.

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 20:19

Hi Jo, yes we are still looking at all options. Will go back to HBPG on Tuesday, also our lawyer this week who seems to have a 'give up attitude'. Going to the Police is an option, but as we don't speak Turkish may have a problem with that. The agent and developer know who we are now and yes we can go to the newspaper as we are not the ones in the wrong. Spoke to Ian Shepherd (Cyprus Today) last year about a problem we had with importing a car and the house situation came into discussion and he was of the opinion like most on this forum, no house, deposit should be refunded or its fraud.

simbas



Joined: 16/07/2007
Posts: 5943

Message Posted:
24/05/2009 07:10

Hi boerboel , is there someone you know over there , that can speak English and Turkishthat could help you . On a recent visit to TC , i had an occasion to spend some time at the Police Station , no-one spoke English . Thank god for the owner {Hakan } of our Car Hire firm { SUR } . He was wonderful , he sorted it out for me . Otherwise it would have been a very different story .

Good luck , Regards , Simbas

boerboel


Joined: 02/05/2009
Posts: 290

Message Posted:
24/05/2009 11:30

Just like to thank everyone for their advice and positive thoughts. Will certainly keep pursuing said agent and developer and will keep you posted on a result.

On a more positive note, we love the island and the people, have no intention of returning to the UK and look forward to a long and good life here.

We hope we have not put people off buying here, but stipulate its best to rent first before parting with any hard earned cash. Wish we had done this and done a lot more research when arrived here.

There is lots of advice available on the forum you only have to ask and someone will be able to help you.

Geejay


Joined: 18/04/2009
Posts: 475

Message Posted:
24/05/2009 11:36

Going to the police is probably not going to help. They will look at this as a civil matter. Plus they're too few and those few are too busy catching criminals. However some police do speak good English but you may have to arrange a time to speak to them when they're on duty.

The HBPG will probably suggest you "name and shame" as going to a solicitor for a legal solution will take a long time and be costly. Decisions of the court are also difficult to carry out as there seems no system of enforcement. This "option" may be just good money after bad.

Of course your solicitor is also at fault for not advising you properly. However they have no duty of care and only respond to ones questions.