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Whats the implications of not getting aPTP?

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mixie


Joined: 16/05/2009
Posts: 302

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 20:56

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Message 1 of 21 in Discussion



OK,

So we find a place and its a turkish title. We've decided on a price. They won't wait till the PTP comes through so what do we do? Whats the implications of sitting in a house without one? Can they take the house away from you if you are refused permission for a PTP.



M



keithcaley



Joined: 13/06/2008
Posts: 2521

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 21:11

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Message 2 of 21 in Discussion

As I understand it, (and please correct me, if I'm wrong!): -

Without ptp you cannot get the kochan (title deeds) transferred into your name.

The Kochan thus remains in the Vendor's name.

The Vendor remains the LEGAL OWNER of the land / property, and can throw you out!

Unless you get a TC or a legal Trust to agree to have the Kochan in THEIR name, that is.

However the same thing applies really - the person / entity in whose name the Kochan is, is the legal owner, notwithstanding any contracts, powers of attourney or anything else that you have got them to sign.

The house / land is theirs.



mixie


Joined: 16/05/2009
Posts: 302

Message Posted:
22/05/2009 21:16

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Message 3 of 21 in Discussion



Keith,

Thanks for this. Its a minefield property buying over there!



Have you or anyone else ever heard of anyone being thrown out after they "bought" the house?



M



keithcaley



Joined: 13/06/2008
Posts: 2521

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 08:39

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Message 4 of 21 in Discussion

Not personally.

I understand that the situation is the same, or even worse in the South...



eager


Joined: 23/02/2007
Posts: 1272

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 09:02

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Message 5 of 21 in Discussion

This Morning had an interview with a couple who had bought their property a while ago, had 3 holidays there too, however the Tapu had not come through and was not yet in their name. Property was sold to someone else without their knowledge their own furniture was also sold. Now trying to get some redress, but so far its cost them 90 k for their troubles.



eager


Joined: 23/02/2007
Posts: 1272

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 09:20

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Message 6 of 21 in Discussion

This happened in Turkey



sunrise


Joined: 14/02/2009
Posts: 274

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 09:29

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Message 7 of 21 in Discussion

Don't know of anyone who had their PTP before buying, don't think it ever happens. I have lived in my house for 3 years, still have no PTP whilst others around me have recieved theirs. Never heard of anyone being thrown out of their house after buying. Go with one of the bigger, reputable builders and you should be ok.



Molly


Joined: 30/08/2008
Posts: 299

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 09:54

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Message 8 of 21 in Discussion

If you have possession of your property it is most unlikely that you would lose it. There are many people in this situation and if you are concerned there other options to give you greater security;



You can put a charge on the property (you would need consent of the registered owner);



You can set up a company and transfer it immediately into the company name;



It could be transferred into the name of a Cypriot who would be your Trustee;



Extra costs would be incurred but if it gives you peace of mind....



mixie


Joined: 16/05/2009
Posts: 302

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 14:55

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Message 9 of 21 in Discussion



Sorry all, I hadn't checked the website for a while as I thought that you all weren't wanting to speak about this issue as it was perhaps too close to the bone for comfort.

My situation is that we couldn't move to the TRNC permanently,,,not yet, I still work. So the property would be bought now for the future so to speak and we would only have holidays there. I'm therefore a bit worried that someone could go and sell it lock, stock and barrel without the PTP.

Anyway, I wish I could speak Turkish because this whole situation of the conveyancing law completely fascinates me and I am sure there would be a living to be made just dealing in property issues and you all sound as if you are in need of a good solicitor there!Not even sure if you have solicitors there even!!!!

This is not my area of expertise but you are never too late to take on a new challenge!

M



Littlenige



Joined: 24/12/2006
Posts: 3594

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 15:03

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Message 10 of 21 in Discussion

Do not buy



So we find a place and its a turkish title. We've decided on a price. They won't wait till the PTP comes through so what do we do? Whats the implications of sitting in a house without one? Can they take the house away from you if you are refused permission for a PTP.



There is no poicy not to issue ptp on turkish title land BUT IN PRACTISE IT IS VERY VERY RARE for ptp to be issued to a non tc.



mixie


Joined: 16/05/2009
Posts: 302

Message Posted:
23/05/2009 15:11

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Message 11 of 21 in Discussion



Little Nige



Surely the Turkish government can't want people not to invest.



m



fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
24/05/2009 10:45

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Message 12 of 21 in Discussion

do some checks to make sure the property is not to close to any army base, i think the lawyer can do this.

then if you are of good character with a clean record, i cannot see any reason they would refuse ptp to you.



mixie


Joined: 16/05/2009
Posts: 302

Message Posted:
24/05/2009 12:43

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Message 13 of 21 in Discussion

Thanks for all the advice

M



negativenick


Joined: 10/11/2008
Posts: 6023

Message Posted:
24/05/2009 12:45

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Message 14 of 21 in Discussion

Mixie,



Don't do it !



Rent for 12 months - if in doubt ask Dixie Normous - he'll put you right !







Nick



Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
24/05/2009 13:24

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Message 15 of 21 in Discussion

Firestarter,



It is absolutely nothing to do with just having good character or being situated near an army base. Many people are now not being issued pre 74 Turkish tiltle deeds and the more honest solicitors are no longer recommending purchase because of the amount of refusals with no apparent reason.





The HBPG are also alarmed at the amount of refusals or people simply being left without confirmation for 3-5 years and even longer in some cases. I really wish you would not inform people to buy such property without real evidence that it is safe to do so. How do you feel about people throwing 100.000 down the drain encouraged by your words?



I know you are totally against people purchasing exchange property but don't resort to lies and guess work in order to steer people away from this property. How many times does one need to ask you to stop promoting PRE 74 as safe? Only the odd person is now being granted pre 74 so please bear this in mind when considering purchase.



keithcaley



Joined: 13/06/2008
Posts: 2521

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 08:56

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Message 16 of 21 in Discussion

Apologies for 'reviving' an old thread, but -

You might be interested in this article in Cyprus Today, Saturday 13th June 2009, about a couple who may lose their house because the builder took out a mortgage on the land.

He was able to do this, of course, as the Kochan was still in his name...

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3550/3634245169_6633b7541f_b.jpg

Keith.



mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 10:32

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Message 17 of 21 in Discussion

Dear KC re msg 2/4



You did say if I'm wrong - correct me ..



The situation in the "rump" RoC is NOT the same .. if you buy a place WITH deeds in the vendor's name - and use a solicitor with a good reputation - all should be fine...The problem is NEW builds.



You DON't Need to have "PTP's" , either - if you are an EU Citizen !



Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 12:29

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Message 18 of 21 in Discussion

keithcaley

I for one, am interested in this article/case, (hopefully not because my apartment is in a similar situation, selfishly), but because if this couple lose their house because of it, it will have a devastating effect on the reputation & economy of the TRNC. It's bad enough with the Orams case. This type of case, it is not a one off, would I think be the nail in the coffin.



mamachina


Joined: 22/11/2008
Posts: 730

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 14:14

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Message 19 of 21 in Discussion

As someone said to me only yesterday - "whats the point - it may all be taken away from you anyway". I dont subscribe to that, I hope our PTP comes through soon and we get our Kocan, as the neighbours (been here 7 years) got theirs last year. But I suppose he had a point, what is the point of paying all this if in the end someone can come and take it all away - FOR FREE!! We dont have a UK property and would be in a very serious position if things turned nasty.



joandjelly


Joined: 24/02/2008
Posts: 2953

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 18:32

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Message 20 of 21 in Discussion

hemmo the reality of property purchase is that some people have no problems whatsoever, everything goes smoothly, they get their PTP and eventually their deeds and other people don't. It's as simple as that and each apartment, house or site is different. It is impossible to be factual other than about your own experience which may differ hugely from your next door neighbour's.



Les&Tasha


Joined: 17/03/2009
Posts: 31

Message Posted:
17/06/2009 21:11

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Message 21 of 21 in Discussion

Returning to Mixie's original question -



"So we find a place and its a turkish title. We've decided on a price. They won't wait till the PTP comes through so what do we do? Whats the implications of sitting in a house without one? Can they take the house away from you if you are refused permission for a PTP. "



If they expect you to pay in full before you have PTP then the answer is simple. You walk away...



I was invited to D&B's auction, their terms and conditions required payment in full before PTP. I replied that the interior minister had stated on 19/10/2005 that no one should enter into any Property Sales Contract or pay any deposits on properties until they have received their Permission to Purchase from the Interior Ministry. D&B had no anwer to that...



Is the money burning a hole in your pocket? This is a buyers market look elsewhere.



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