Orams Case Bet

yunus



Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 327

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 16:27

NO OFFENCE TO THE ORAMS AS MOST OF OUR HEARTS ARE WITH THEM.

there is so much scare mongering going on that it is unfair on everybody who lives on this side of the island, some forum members love putting a downer on things for everyone!

time to put your names to it. gentleman's bet anyone. now i know politics are involved but wish to say that the orams will definately win. lets see who knows what they're talking about. WE KNOW WHAT YOUR VIEWS ARE SO KEEP IT SHORT. ( UNLIKE ME)



ORAMS TO WIN ( DEFINATELY 100%)

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 18:03

I would have thought it was obvious.. at the minute everyone is "losing" .



When do you call it an Orams' "win"..



1/ If the Court of England and Wales rule they won't enforce -it isn't "the end"



2/ I hope we could call a settlement that is voted for with both "tribes" as a "win"..

cyprusairsoft



Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 2066

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 18:04

win for orams case chucked out due to dodgy greek judge

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 18:34

oH mmmmmmmmmmmm, why are you always sooooooooo droll with your replys, please put a bit of light heartment into your answers, cannot think you are really borrrrring, as you do write interesting stuff sometimes, I say sometimes as sometimes I want to fall asleep whilst reading your posts! lol xxxxx

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 19:45

Multiple m,

Long time no see. What is your reply to my explanation of the Kangaroo court over the border or whatever you like to call it?

ismet

Blackpoolfan


Joined: 03/12/2008
Posts: 1568

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 21:00

Nobody wins in the end but would like a decision either way so everyone can move on stop bickering and insulting each other......

karakum5c



Joined: 18/03/2008
Posts: 1021

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 21:44

Maybe if we all hugged a Greek instead of a Hoodie it might help!

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 22:06

The only people who will 'win' will be the lawyers who can't lose whatever the outcome.

TimothyCadman


Joined: 13/12/2007
Posts: 1040

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 23:13

The ONLY courts that will tell the Orams that they no longer own their property is the court in the TRNC.

For however many judgements are laid at the feet of Orams, in the end procession is 9/10ths of the law. If the Greek Cypriots want it they will have to physically take it, and to physically take it means they will have go to war with the TRNC. Will they be willing to do that? Only they know the answer to that, but my guess is NO they won't.

There is one other argument that means that the Greek Cypriots can have their land back and that is that the TRNC is recognised as a country and afforded all rights under the all conventions within this world. At least then they can argue their case on a world stage as a recognised country. Then we shall see the legal outcome.

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 08:18

tim

i'm not sure thats the only worry the orams have! i think they should more worry about their assets in the uk.

i think it is a case of there will be no winners, apart from the lawyers and anyone else who can make money from the situation.

i do believe the uk courts will uphold the ecj ruling, i don't think they have a choice.

even though it does sound a little one sided, because of the gc involvment.

but i never get the answer to the person who advised/legal advice to the ecj, what nationality were they?



at the end of the day if you purchased exchange land then you always knew there could be the possibility of this happening. you paid your money and took that chance.

where are those guarantees from the tc gov? it should be them dealing with this not the orams.

we will just have to wait and see the outcome.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 14:44

Dear Dizzycows



re msg 4



>>why are you always sooooooooo droll with your replys<<



'Coz you don't like t'other perspective put by a pendantic "Devil's Advocate "?! ... "LOL"



Cyprusairsoft re msg 3



May be you missed the post re the ECHR cases having TR judges on them and the case STILL goes with the GC Petitioner? .. Try and new ( reasoned and valid) approach - those in the KNOW - realise it was a legally valid response - based on the RoC being currently the valid govt.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 14:51

Re Izzie msg 6



>>Long time no see.<< How true... you know I miss you ;)



>>What is your reply to my explanation of the Kangaroo court over the border or whatever you like to call it? ;)<<



I can't believe you missed it...I responded ( on many threads) that your "Kangaroo Court" - listens to reasoned, LEGAL defences.. I KNOW ;)



I've often said that their will NOT be a flood of "Apostolides v Orams' cases...



A "smart" brief would enter a defence on time ( in TR and English - as TR and GR are the official languages of the RoC ) and point out that now ( this wasn't a card to be played,then) the ECHR prescribed route of using the TR local remedy - the IPC.... should be used to decide a property ownership issue ..





Now you KNOW the RoC might not want to HEAR that and refer to their TC Guardian of properties.. as per their statute..but it would be a have to be valid counter ;)

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 15:12

Marky,

Its not a proper answer, you can't wiggle out of it properly. The court in the south behaved as a kangaroo court and I explained exactly how they behaved. They stopped them putting in an "Appearence" in time and now you tell me if they had put in a defence in time etc. etc. Orams side were obstructed when they tried to file a "Memorandum of Appearence" in time. They told them to come next day and when they did first thing in the morning they were kept waiting for the official forms while the honourable (not) judge gave judgement against Orams in their absence. There can be no better description of a kangaroo court.

ismet

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 15:18

I see Mark has skirted around the answer as usual.....not bad for his quickness in a reply....5 mins after I had alerted him on another blog......keep banging your head against the wall Ismet!

Stewart


Joined: 19/07/2008
Posts: 1107

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 17:10

Someone with so much confidence..willing to back it up with 100%....must have some insider knowledge..

Hope you are right Yunus....or you will get a big fall from grace....with that sort of confidence..I'm with you...unless you are playing????

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 00:33

Dear Ismet



re msg 14



I know if I'm served with a writ I don't hang around.... "no wriggling" - remember I have BEEN a defendant in a RoC Court - twice - it was ( and is) a VERY simple matter to file an intention to defend...appear in Court - and to get a Court Official to officially receive documentation..



You can go to the Court - and you get a nice date stamp to prove you submitted papers.... "simples" ( sharp intake of breath through teeth) [ You need to receive British TV to understand the end bit, Izzie ! ]



We BOTH know that the Orams' didn't have a leg to stand on - in the eyes of the RoC Court..



We BOTH know why and that the ECJ decided on points of *Law* - the law the EU has to respect..



The ECHR have ruled that a RoC Court has behaved "badly", proceedurally. ( Solicitor in Limas(s)ol wrongly "done" for contempt )



So..IF the Orams' have been "done", proceedurally and exhausted all routes in the RoC - I'm surprised they didn't take the ECHR route ??!!

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 01:57

Marky wrote:

"So..IF the Orams' have been "done", proceedurally and exhausted all routes in the RoC - I'm surprised they didn't take the ECHR route ??!! "



They have done that already but it will take years. In the end ECHR will condemn them (the kangaroo court)too, no worry, slowly slowly, siga siga my friend.

ismet

Birdsong


Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 43

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 14:26

In reply to mmmmmm, last part of msg 13 and, bye the bye, to elko msg 14



The Orams did produce their documents in Turkish as well as English, but they were thrown out as well, because although the "court" is supposed to recognise Turkish, the judge couldn't speak it!



It really was totally outrageous and it's a crime that the GCs were allowed to rush the case to London because all these details were then passed over for the "bigger picture".

sporty


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 685

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 14:30

it'll be thrown out! if i didnt think it was going to be i wouldnt be sending my money over at the wkend for our place we're buying!lol.

wanderer


Joined: 05/02/2009
Posts: 1653

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 15:00

Birdsong

The GC will have their comeuppance it may take till the court of human rights but such criminal malpractice cannot go unpunished

It is usually false evidence that is the cause of such wrong judgements not the courts conspiring to rig the case .

M

You cannot defend the indefensible .

A court that is supposed to be impartial should allow for all parties to defend themselves properly especially in such a high profile issue .

"Caesars wife should be above reproach"

On this case the RoC court has proved it self a Hoar by not giving a fair and just hearing in the first place and at appeal

M

If your case was against "Stavros roc builder" you were sorting out something that is common place for the RoC court

The Orams were not it was a chance for point scoring against the North & Turkey

It should have been a chance for the RoC to show that they can be trusted to be fair

Justice should be like the statue blind to race or creed

NOT BLIND HATRED as shown by them

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 16:14

I am thinking of becoming a hermit on a desert island, without electricty, newspapers or any rescue



this would shield me from the turgid manoeverings of the orams' claimant and his shadowy backers,

the repetative and over-exposed marital troubles of katy price and her erstwhile paramour peter andre,

and lastly the tidal wave of crocodile tears when cypriots admit there never was any deal to be done

cyprusairsoft



Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 2066

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 18:33

those in the KNOW - realise it was a legally valid response - based on the RoC being currently the valid govt.





of course your always in the know mark and as dizzycows says your getting boring ive told you before go and sort out your wifes visa

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 22:02

Dear Cyprusairsoft



1/ What is incorrect about " it was a legally valid response - based on the RoC being currently the valid govt.

" ?



2/ Wife's "visa" -it's a residency permit - all done - just waiting for it ( and waiting )



Your opinions ( as always) are backed up with well reasoned, thought provoking, articulate observations and conclusions ..................

yunus



Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 327

Message Posted:
06/07/2009 23:39

dear stewart



TRUST ME, mate

i hope for a quick final verdict so that some of these members who know it all, can put a sock in it.

i am willing to do the same if i am wrong. the oram's will keep their home and will NOT pay any compensation.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 00:06

Put pressure on everyone, get all your friends and relatives to put presure on their MP. Lobby every MP you can and get everyone else to do it also. I have already done this and even sent a sample letter for them to send and I had some responses.

David Cameron's email address is: CAMEROND@parliament.uk

I think Gordon Brown's is: 10DowningSt.gov.uk (or similar check on web)

Your local UK MP can be contacted by your relatives

KICK UP A STINK!!!!

DON'T SIT ON YOUR *****'S WAITING TILL IT IS TOO LATE!!!!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 02:50

re msg 27



Far more GCs - with UK passports - been doing just the same ( with more success - and the LAW behind 'em) for years..!

yunus



Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 327

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 03:11

re msg 27

-Far more GCs - with UK passports - been doing just the same ( with more success - and the LAW behind 'em) for years..!-



doesn't stop us trying, or should it dear mmmmmm. would you prefer us not to ? sounds like you would! you have a bad bone in you my friend. much more gc's with british passports ? what do you mean ? this is the TURKISH REPUBLIC OF NORTHERN CYPRUS. you haven't left the solar system with lostgeeza i hope. you do know he's out of this world. gc's don't have no say on this side of the island just in case you didnt realise. starting to feel you belong on the dark side dear mmmmmm. go preach your gc politics and propaganda over there. sorry to tell you your going to lose, no matter how much you try and stir. what a dumb comment to make.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 10:13

Dear Yunus



re 29



"Dumb" is arguing with reality - there are more GCs with UK passports influencing THEIR MPs ( and with the weight of UN resolutions on their side) than there'll ever be "supporters" of UK Citizens ( may be 80% or more of 'em ) who ignored FCO advice re buying property on land STILL owned by a GC.



Better to lobby for a brave TC leader to call for the end of the "TRNC" - to campaign for the status of an autonomous region in a new Republic and "allow" nations to support TCs.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 13:05

All the more reason for the Expats, holiday makers, Turkish cypriots with UK connections etc etc etc take action to counteract the GC's with UK passports (Thought the GC had EU passports the same as us)

Get everyone to lobby your MP. I have also followed this up by copying documention from the website and sending that to the MPs. ie the statements made on BRT regarding the judge in the Oram's case.

The Government were against the Gurka's - but they won.

I lobbied my MP's and David Cameron regarding that to. Politics is not something that happens in 10 Downing St, but you need to KICK UP A STINK to get heard.

Email everyone you know in Britain to email their MP's, If you are not in Britain send emails to David Cameron and Gordon Brown (and Uncle Tom Cobbley an-all). Get the message out - DO SOMETHING but DON'T WAIT!

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 13:06

Send your emails now



WHAT HAVE YOU GOT TO LOSE???????