Everyone - lobby their UK MP to draw attention to Oram's case Judge

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 01:09

- Email your local UK MP regarding this and explain the circumstances

- Email all your friends and family in the UK and ask them to email their local MP (give them a sample letter to help them do it)

- Email David Cameron at: CAMEROND@parliament.uk

- Send letters to UK media and get as much attention as you can, highlight the fact that the Judge was Greek married to a Greek Cypriot - why was he not excluded from sitting on a case such as this - Against EU Rules.

DON'T SIT ON YOUR *****s, WAITING TILL IT IS TOO LATE - DO SOMETHING NOW. I have already done these and had some reponses.

If more people do it, it will raise the profile of the problem - GET TO WORK, SEE WHAT YOU CAN DO!!!!

DON'T TALK ABOUT IT - DO IT!!!

harryroberts


Joined: 05/05/2009
Posts: 117

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 02:21

against what eu rules?

surely if it was against eu rules another EU country would have objected

also i stand to be corrected on this but was the decision soley in the hands of the so called illegal judge.



good luck with your petition

Troodo


Joined: 12/06/2008
Posts: 1002

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 09:27

If this is E.U. justice, God help us all.



Troodo.

As I understand it, there was also another judge either married to or was himself a GC.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 10:26

Troodo



You need to read Ismet's posts



He can inform you that the ECJ followed proper procedures to support the current EU statute and followed the legal advice of the Advocate General - who is def. NOT GR / GC...



As you may be aware their are TR judges sitting on many of the rulings at the ECHR that have gone against TR..



Should we also "campaign" to have them removed from rulings involving TR / CY ? !



THIS is not the correct path to sort out the CY property problem - any more than a GC thinking the Apostolides v Ormas' case will "help"..

Troodo


Joined: 12/06/2008
Posts: 1002

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 11:25

THIS is not the correct path to sort out the CY property problem - any more than a GC thinking the Apostolides v Ormas' case will "help"..

Mark at last we agree.



Troodo.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 12:25

The Cyprus Turkish National Committee of Existence wants the Greek President of the European Court of Justice Vasilios Skouris to be put on trial for violating the rules of discipline. ECJ President Skouris was presented with an honorary medal by the former Greek Cypriot Leader Tassos Papadopoulos for his services to the Greek Cypriots at a time the Orams Case was being filed at ECJ. In a written statement issued on behalf of the Executive Board of the Committee, Kamil Ozkaloglu said this has been a violation of the European Union’s judge rules. Mr Ozkaloglu also reminded of the fact that Skouris, who served Greece as the Minister of Interior in the past, held contacts in South Cyprus with high level Greek Cypriot officials to discuss the ECJ’s awaited decision on the Orams Case. The visit came just before two months the ECJ made its decision on the Orams Case, Ozkaloglu noted.“This is in contradiction with the EU rules of justice. Whenever shadow falls upon a judge’s objectivity

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 12:30

Cont.....

he needs to withdraw from hearing the case. However, Mr Skouris continued reading the case. This is unacceptable” he went on saying.

The Committee speaker stated that the ECJ’s decision on the Orams Case which was taken on the 28th of April, recognizes the Greek Cypriot Administration’s authority and legitimacy over the lands of the Turkisjh Republic of Northern Cyprus.

“According to the ECJ decision, the Greek Cypriot Courts have the juridical authority on all civilian and commercial matters in the TRNC. The decision calls for the recognition of verdicts to be made by Greek Cypriot courts by all EU member states” he reminded.

He stressed that this decision is a clear violation of human rights which eliminates the legitimate rights of the Turks of Cyprus gained since 1960.

FROM BRT.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 15:37

There was a message on Michael Jackson's memorial last night, words to the effect:



One person cannot do things alone but as a group we can achieve all



If everyone 'puts their money where their mouth is' (so to speak) things happen, people take notice!

Elections are in the offing - politicians like to 'court' their electorate.



Are we going to let the GC's with UK passports rule the roost??????

mixie


Joined: 16/05/2009
Posts: 302

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 16:22

Katymackem,

If I wasn't so completely thick with computers, I could have given you a link to a site I found out about.



If there are any smarties out there perhaps you could paste the link.



I entiitled it the thread "They work for you".



In it I actually managed to put in a link that gives you access to all politians and members of the House of Lords.



I contacted a few people and was astounded that I actually got one reply in writing and one phone call.



Mixie

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 16:45

Hi Mixie

I would love to have that.

You know what they say 'nothing ventured nothing gained'

Anyone got the email address Mixie is referring to, please post it.

(Mixie have you tried clicking on your name - that gives you a link to all your posts)

Katy

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 19:06

Dear Katy



the link is



http://www.theyworkforyou.com/

..now will you do ME a favour and read something about the ECJ and realise the case was ALWAYS going to go in favour of the plaintiff - from a point of law - stance - the ECJ had asked for and received a ruling from the Advocate General - NOT a Greek or GC - and she advised that the RoC Court ruling could be enforced..



Did you know that a Turkish Judge sits on a panel when ruling in cases against Turkey at the ECHR...

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 21:41

Thanks mmmmmm

Contacted them and signed up for email alerts.

WAZ-24-7



Joined: 18/10/2008
Posts: 695

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 22:11

mmmmmmm



msg 11

Your synopsis is brief and misses the facts that are important in the original ROC application.

Perhaps you may post a link to Justice Jacks appeal hearing in the UK High Court of 6th September 2006 in which he found in favour of the Orams.

The advocate general made a recomendation based upon the law. The ECJ made their ruling accordingly.

A sad decision thet has not helped the de-facto situation at all.

The Law may be the law but is justice delivered? On divided Cyprus where the Law is totally on the side of the majority the answer is NO.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
09/07/2009 00:52

Dear Waz/ Warren



re 13



>>Your synopsis is brief and misses the facts that are important in the original ROC application. <<



Again, you miss the point - the ECJ ruled on whether a RoC Court judgement could be enforced in the third party state. It takes into account that the RoC can't enforce..



Look at the ruling on the left hand side of this page



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostolides_v_Orams



The link to Justice Jacks verdict



http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/2006/2226.html



Note- the Orams subsequently had an appeal to the CY Supreme Court dismissed



Justice Jacks ruled the Orams should not have a default judgement enforced - the ECJ ruled "the defendant was able to commence proceedings to challenge the default judgment and those proceedings enabled him to argue that he had not been served with the document which instituted the proceedings or with the equivalent document in sufficient time and in such a way as to enable him to arrange for his defence."

dodger



Joined: 29/07/2007
Posts: 1895

Message Posted:
09/07/2009 00:59

The verdict on the Orams case will again be reversed at the next hearing.Its a game of cat and mouse but then again this is Southern and Northern Cyprus,

Paul.

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
09/07/2009 03:31

and the papers and the radio. The people you speak to every day. Whenever you get the chance ... fly the flag ...



When you love a place so much, you have to and beguile the nonsense that is spoken.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
09/07/2009 20:34

Hi Mixie

Thanks to mmmmmm I have the email address and have already loggod on for email alerts regarding Cyprus. I have also searched current entries/statements.

Also I found it very useful for reporting problems in 'fixmystree' and have reported several problems in my local area.

Many thanks for letting me know there was a website and many thanks to mmmmmm for giving me the link - great!!!!

mixie


Joined: 16/05/2009
Posts: 302

Message Posted:
09/07/2009 22:35

Hi there Katymackem,



I think all the brits should be lobbying their MPs and educating them. I seem to think that I read an article either today or yesterday which went along these lines...Gosh, I have a head like a sieve and I can't remember where I actually read it.



A Turkish minister said that the very much appreciate the lobbying done by the Brits because basically we Brits are important to TRNC economy and its ability to develop; that both the Turkish Cypriots and ourselves share the same land so we must co operate with one another.

Anyway if someone knows where this came from could you post the link.



Lord Gilclooney from the House of Lords has been fighting for TRNC recognition for 30 years and he says he will continue to do so. Really nice chap, he phoned me back after I contacted him on "They work for you"



Good luck



Mixie

WAZ-24-7



Joined: 18/10/2008
Posts: 695

Message Posted:
09/07/2009 22:52

mmmmmmmmm msg 14

Thank you.



Any application by anyone from the TRNC in any ROC court is unlikely to get a fair hearing.

This was always the problem for the Orams. The ROC have simply capitalised upon their European Union status in the knowledge that the TRNC is excluded from the same benefits both legal and economic.



I believe that Mr appostolides and his legal team were well aware of the likely failure of the Orams defence in a Court room under the umbrella of an administration that aspires to destroying its neighbour.



What is your specific point that I appear to have missed ? again!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
10/07/2009 04:02

Hi Mixe re msg 18

As previously mentioned, John Taylor (Lord Gilclooney) is from my part of the world and doesn't seem to respond so enthusiastically to questions that are "difficult" for him to answer...No letter/ emails or phone calls...



re 19 Waz



>>Any application by anyone from the TRNC in any ROC court is unlikely to get a fair hearing. <<



As you know the application came from the area of Cyprus beyond the effective control of the govt.. Do check Justice Jacks reference to "TRNC".. It was refused because the Defence HAD no defence..



The ECJ have made it clear to the Court of Eng and Wales that they accept the default judgement should be enforced..



You keep referring to the "destruction" of something the RoC ECJ/ EU/ UN et al regard as *legally invalid*...



It's OK.. no need to thank me for posting the links as you asked.. IF you had read them, you would realise the point you keep missing

CyprusChill


Joined: 08/05/2009
Posts: 666

Message Posted:
10/07/2009 04:56

and dont forget the years 1955-59.



when many British and Irish men and women and civillians died for the sake of Cyprus.



http://www.britains-smallwars.com/cyprus/ROH.htm

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
10/07/2009 16:10

Sadly mmmmmm

you read the text but only take in the points you believe in and not the overall picture.

Lobbying our MPs is a positive action and some thing we can do as an alternative to sitting doing nothing and rabbiting on on a forum all day.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
10/07/2009 16:23

Dear Katy



>>you read the text but only take in the points you believe in and not the overall picture. <<





Kindly substantiate your observation with factual examples.. this is patent nonsense.. *I* gave you the links to lobby your MP... !



I *can* differentiate between facts and opinions .. please try !

WAZ-24-7



Joined: 18/10/2008
Posts: 695

Message Posted:
11/07/2009 02:14

mmmmmm

Msg 20.



I stand by my comment regarding lack of fairness to anything linked to TRNC in any hearing in any ROC Court. This is my opinion references that you quote do not alter that opinion

KatyMcM


Joined: 12/07/2009
Posts: 46

Message Posted:
13/07/2009 22:04

The Bellapais Auction shows that we do not only have to fear the Greeks coming and taking property - the TRNC will also do it????

What can be done now?

KatyMcM


Joined: 12/07/2009
Posts: 46

Message Posted:
16/07/2009 13:28

It has been stated that if you

- form a TRNC/or other nationality (Virgin Islands) Limited Company, then the Greeks cannot claim your assets as the Limited Company is not EU.

- it could be that a group of residents living on the same estate/development form a limited company to protect their assets.

Any thoughts on this idea - sounds good!