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Builders wants us to pay thier VAT & TAX

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witchfinder



Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 155

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 00:09

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Message 1 of 43 in Discussion

Just heard from our solicitor if we want our KOCAN (which we have paid all our dues) we will have to pay the builders VAT & Tax........ as well..... Don't know what we can do now, nowhere else to go...



Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 00:15

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Message 2 of 43 in Discussion

Sack your Advocate, he/she is most probably 'in bed' with your builders!



Richard



TimothyCadman


Joined: 13/12/2007
Posts: 1040

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 00:16

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Message 3 of 43 in Discussion

What do the terms and conditions in your contract say about VAT and Taxes? That's your starting position.



Vidal


Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 867

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 00:21

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Message 4 of 43 in Discussion

Who is your builder?



If your 'solicitor' delivered that news with no advice to go with it, Brinsley is right..go and find a new one sharpish.



Good Luck with everything!



Wireless


Joined: 10/08/2008
Posts: 157

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 00:28

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Message 5 of 43 in Discussion

same here - problem is with the law in NC you can sue to get your deeds and not pay them but even if you win they ar under no obligation to give you the deeds only to return your money and damages as the court see's fit. This is a trick that a lot of unscrupulous builders are using.



minertor



Joined: 14/02/2009
Posts: 1238

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 00:31

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Message 6 of 43 in Discussion

When I was waiting for my Kocan a few years ago, my advocate, who was also the builders advocate, told me the hold up was due to the builder not paying some tax. After being stalled for a while I asked the advocate how much it was. It was only 125tl. The advocate said it wasn't my bill and I shouldn't pay it. I called at the builders and told him that I'd pay it, in return he offered to have my aircon serviced. I paid the 125tl, I also paid for the aircon service myself. I don't hold the advocate responsible and would recommend him to anyone. I also used him to draw up my will. Still not exactly sure what the 125tl was for but worth paying it for closure.



Oxoners


Joined: 24/01/2008
Posts: 128

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 01:26

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Message 7 of 43 in Discussion

Steve



What is the total figure you have been told to pay



HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 01:36

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Message 8 of 43 in Discussion

who is your builder?

Who is your advocate?



gates


Joined: 08/12/2008
Posts: 1096

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 08:01

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Message 9 of 43 in Discussion

i think the builders tax is the same as you pay and most at the moment who can still aford to pay will get it done as the discount is there for them to . but if your builder is skint witch most are they cant pay . hope you are well witchfinder give us a call when you are back hope all goes well for you kind regards kirk and leona



negativenick


Joined: 10/11/2008
Posts: 6023

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 08:06

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Message 10 of 43 in Discussion

Mess 1 - they should be strung up........



When is "the new Government" going to act like they promised ?



Who the hell would consider buying over here with builders being able to get away with such tricks ??



Washerman


Joined: 19/09/2008
Posts: 2301

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 08:39

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Message 11 of 43 in Discussion

I imagine that we are talking a sum into the 000's, there is no specific performance law here, there isn't anything (legally) that you can do to force him to do anything. You could sue to make him pay the KDV, but (even if your contract says that he agrees to pay the KDV) - If he refuses, that's it, I'm afraid that you don't get your Kocan.

My advice: Don't do anything or, enter into any further agreement without it being in writing. Try negotiating with the builder, go see him face to face. Ask him for his help, don't argue with him, don't threaten him. Make sure that he hasn't got a list of extras that he wants to charge you for as well.

Many Brit's have fallen foul of the system here - me included. Marion Stokes - HBPG will (at least) listen to your problem. It may make you feel better.

The system here isn't fair - the Brit's problem? We don't trust our own, but (it seems) we will trust a builder in a foreign country with 000,s?

Washerman



kavenkoy


Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 1787

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 09:05

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Message 12 of 43 in Discussion

THEY NEED NAMING AND SHAMING AND A CAMPAIGN AGAINST THE ROBBING TOSSERS



KAV



Carndi


Joined: 12/06/2009
Posts: 613

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 09:13

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Message 13 of 43 in Discussion

There was an item of advice from the government ( not this one ) that if you were told to pay your builders VAT and Tax then you should go to the police.

Would suggest that you take Washerman's advice and contact Marion Stokes.



ozankoys


Joined: 20/06/2008
Posts: 905

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 10:49

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Message 14 of 43 in Discussion

The builders are victims of the Government as well, when many of these properties were sold maybe 5-6 years ago the taxes were based on valuation which was often 1/3 of the market value. Capital Gains Tax was only 3% therefore if a builder sold a property for 60k he would estimate on paying 3% on 20k tax i.e. 600 stg. Now the tax is based on contract value converted to TL at date of contract (which can also have an adverse effect on the amount of tax paid) therefore with the current discount to 4% their liability is a minimum of 2400 stg is there any wonder that many of them are unable to pay??



Washerman


Joined: 19/09/2008
Posts: 2301

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 11:03

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Message 15 of 43 in Discussion

OK, but that being said, the builders are not the victims of the Government, they are the victims of their own(so called) solicitors who should have anticipated this and advised them and constructed the contracts accordingly, but what is the point, with a legal system with no specific performance law

Yeh! I really feel sorry for the builders most of whom, if they had completed building on time, would have avoided the extra charges, but why bother, when they can just pass them onto their customer.

Washerman



ozankoys


Joined: 20/06/2008
Posts: 905

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 11:08

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Message 16 of 43 in Discussion

Maybe some have completed on time but the PTP have not come through. My friend has been waiting nearly 6 years, it appears her file has been 'mislaid' somewhere she has had to start again with a 2009 application.



Washerman


Joined: 19/09/2008
Posts: 2301

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 11:08

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Message 17 of 43 in Discussion

Kavenkoy - Message 12, but we only have 1000 characters per post, how would we fit all their names in?

Washerman



Washerman


Joined: 19/09/2008
Posts: 2301

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 11:10

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Message 18 of 43 in Discussion

Ozankoys - did they get an original file number from their legal rep'?

Washerman



ozankoys


Joined: 20/06/2008
Posts: 905

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 11:20

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Message 19 of 43 in Discussion

Yes but their lawyer is not very proactive & they took over the chasing themselves



Washerman


Joined: 19/09/2008
Posts: 2301

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 11:27

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Message 20 of 43 in Discussion

OK, so what did they do, where did they go, who did they speak to?

Have they actually started a second PTP application?

Washerman



spondoolics


Joined: 13/06/2009
Posts: 73

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 12:28

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Message 21 of 43 in Discussion

Im buying. Everything underway, Talked to Estate Agents, Builders and most importantly, people. If it all goes pear shaped I will blame no one but myself, and not sit and groan about iffy builders, agents and advocates. I have not sold my property UK as their is no way I could live full time here, certainly under the present conditions. I appreciate a lot of ex pats have been ripped off, may be due to a lack of self control and over excitement of a future prospect which could not be achieved in UK. And without a doubt the "Golden Tongue" syndrome is alive and thriving in TRNC, they could sell snow to eskimos, and by they I put ex pat builders and agents in the same cess pit.



kavenkoy


Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 1787

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 13:53

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Message 22 of 43 in Discussion

washerman



there not all bad ,but the crooks and blackmailers amongst them should be named ,shamed and then dealt with .



like allways they give the honest genuine companys the problem



kav



Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 14:02

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Message 23 of 43 in Discussion

Msg 22



NO, they should be all lined up and shot!



Richard



witchfinder



Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 155

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 23:09

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Message 24 of 43 in Discussion

Hi Oxoners, I am waiting for the figure to be sent to me, will e-mail our group with more info when I get that figure as you know it affects us all.....I may then Name and Shame (not that will do any good as we know, but might make me feel a little better) Will e-mail later I need a drink now... had a bad day at work as well....



Oxoners


Joined: 24/01/2008
Posts: 128

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 23:32

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Message 25 of 43 in Discussion

have two drinks then bite the bullet and name and shame, they have got away with two much.



Vidal


Joined: 14/05/2009
Posts: 867

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 23:36

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Message 26 of 43 in Discussion

It will do some good Witchfinder, It might just save someone else the heartache.



There must be some decent, honest builders out there and surely they deserve the business.



witchfinder



Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 155

Message Posted:
08/08/2009 01:54

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Message 27 of 43 in Discussion

Theres no point in naming the builder as they have only one site, I have just heard there is an injunction against them so even if I did pay we still wouldn't get our Kocan as the court wouldn't allow it..... someone please hand me the shotgun..............When will this fecking madness end.....



brandy sour


Joined: 09/04/2008
Posts: 310

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 21:09

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Message 28 of 43 in Discussion

Here is a question for some one just say like above situation that the builder wants you to pay your final snagging (which has not been done to your satisfaction) and pay their taxes because they have no money and you decide not to bother with your Kocan is the builder still in their rights to take back the property and try to resell it as it is still in their name does the builder have right to do this.



Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 21:31

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Message 29 of 43 in Discussion

BrandySour: resell? I wouldn't like to put it to the test! I have heard there are precedents - ask HBPG...



Stonehousepub


Joined: 21/05/2009
Posts: 755

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 22:00

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Message 30 of 43 in Discussion

My advice is JUST PAY IT and get your kocan... sorry to be so blunt but i hope you take my advice.



regards



Ozi



HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 23:46

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Message 31 of 43 in Discussion

If the builders met their deadlines they would not be in the problems they are in.

They blame the recession - the recession has not hit TRNC as it has his other countries - UK millions have lost their jobs, hightes unemployment for 14 years.

Our contact was signed 3 years ago with a 12 month deadline and 3 months grace - If it has been completed it would have been finalised before the recession.

Now they want us to pay the tax as well - give the advocate the monies owed plus 5% taxes and he will get it completed!!!

If it was a case of just paying it to get the Kocan - I would do it. However, I cannot even get into my house and I am having to rent another one.



trent5761


Joined: 19/09/2009
Posts: 7

Message Posted:
20/09/2009 00:14

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Message 32 of 43 in Discussion

who is your Sols Bldrs ?

Your retention fee which you held back at Sols should be used towards VAT /Tax by the Bldrs unless his name begins with R*** !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They also Had a reduction amnesty if they paid taxes etc early of 2%



Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
20/09/2009 00:17

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Message 33 of 43 in Discussion

We are still waiting for Mr Robb xxx and renting



HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
20/09/2009 00:38

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Message 34 of 43 in Discussion

It seems that Cafer Yucelgazi has a lot in common with Mr Robb

He told me that as President of the Girne Builders Association, that the TRNC Government was going to ensure that all of these properties (Arapkoi and the others) were going to be guaranteed by the TRNC government - maybe that is why he does not finish any of his projects, because he thinks the TRNC government will pick up the tab!!!!



Smity



Joined: 14/09/2009
Posts: 826

Message Posted:
20/09/2009 14:00

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Message 35 of 43 in Discussion

Hold on to your cash,Name and shame all concerned. Then get a new brief.



Molly


Joined: 30/08/2008
Posts: 299

Message Posted:
21/09/2009 09:18

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Message 36 of 43 in Discussion

Witchfinder



Get your lawyer to prepare the transfer documents and submit them to the Lands Office. IF there is an injunction then the Lands Office will declare it on the documents.



If there is then the transfer cannot take place anyhow so hold on to your money. If there isn't then you currently have two choices; pay the greedy odious vendor's taxes or simply sit tight and enjoy your property.



witchfinder



Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 155

Message Posted:
21/09/2009 15:18

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Message 37 of 43 in Discussion

Just got back from the TRNC, have not as of yet paid the builders taxes, waiting to hear from our advocate my next question:- If I did pay the "capital gains tax" (to be fair she has said that legally I do not have too) and was the only one so far to do this from our complex, will I get my Kocan or will the tax office say they want ALL the taxes paid for the whole site before they issue one to us...... will let you all know the outcome, evidently I am now not licked by our builder for publicizing this, (oh dear what more could happen to me.....) best I hide.



barnaclebill


Joined: 12/12/2008
Posts: 303

Message Posted:
21/09/2009 15:35

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Message 38 of 43 in Discussion

Witchfinder,

Ref mesg 37 my son was in the same situation as you,he bit the bullet ,paid the taxes,got his Kochan and has since sold on his bungalow.1 or 2 others did the same but those who didnt still have not got their Kochans .I no it stinks but its up to you. Good Luck.



HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
21/09/2009 15:43

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Message 39 of 43 in Discussion

If they can get away with doing this with no repercussions then they will keep on doing it.

NAME AND SHAME THEM - at least that way other people will avoid them and in the end they will figure out

- NOT TO CUT OFF THE HAND THAT FEEDS THEM

at the moment they know that they can get away with it.

Anyone got a really good advocate - Let us all know - if one good advocate catches onto this situation and takes up the cases - they will make a fortune and make a name for themselves as everyone will want to use them



witchfinder



Joined: 10/04/2008
Posts: 155

Message Posted:
21/09/2009 18:35

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Message 40 of 43 in Discussion

I feel we have a good advocate as she is supposed to be one of the best, the advice we have been given is it is illegal to ask for this money and we do not have to pay it, but the courts cannot at this time force the vendor to transfer the title, as the land office will not process unless the taxes are paid. Our choices are 1. hope the vendor "finds" some money as they say they haven't got any. (wonder where 300K+ has gone) and pays her tax.



We take the vendor to court (at our expense several k) get a judgement against her, but she still has to "find" the money to pay the tax or no Kocan. (basically we loose out as paid legal fees)



2. We pay the taxes and hope there isn't another reason why the transfer cannot take place, (which no doubt there is, like there is a "Y" in the day or something.



No point in naming and shaming as I believe its quite a common problem.



HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
21/09/2009 22:25

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Message 41 of 43 in Discussion

It is a common problem because no one will NAME AND SHAME!!!!

I was told that my advate was 'second to none' when I came over - turns out she was not an advocate but the wife of the advocate and was in fact a Legal Secretary. She dealt with everything as if she was an advocate and signed all of the documents etc. It was a year later when we had problems that we found out that her husband was the Advocate.



HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
26/09/2009 17:48

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Message 42 of 43 in Discussion

Now they are asking for

- All monies owed to be paid in to a pot which they will manage PLUS THE VAT

- Pay the builder up front

- and he will complete the job he was supposed to have built 2 years ago

And if that was not enough I have been informed that my contact of Sale has not been Registered with the Land Registry - even though Sener Law Firm have been telling me for 3 years, both verbally and in writing, this it was registered.



ripoffrock


Joined: 05/08/2008
Posts: 255

Message Posted:
27/09/2009 05:07

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Message 43 of 43 in Discussion

Message 40,



NAME & SHAME,



GET SOME BACKBONE MAN,



PUSSY FOOTING AROUND WILL GET YOU ZERO, MAKE A STAND, THIS BUILDER HAS PROBABLY BEEN EXTRACTING THE URINE FOR YEARS.



NOTHING NEW THERE.



WHILE YOU PONCE ABOUT, SITTING ON THE FENCE WAITING FOR A MIRACLE, MORE HONEST, HARD WORKING PEOPLE ARE GETTING ROBBED.



STAND UP AND BE COUNTED.



WHO'S THE BUILDER?



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