Do Academic qualifications, ensure success in life?

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 10:53

Academic qualifications are commonly felt to give a person the best chance of success in life. How far is this true?



Do people judge you by your academic qualifications?

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 10:55

Bill,

There is an old saying "Its not what you know its who you know".Which i honestly believe does ring true in life,

Paul.

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 11:38

i'm with newlad on this one.

julie.andrews


Joined: 09/07/2008
Posts: 27

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 11:41

Not if one forges them, and gets caught ............. apparently.

elkiton



Joined: 15/03/2009
Posts: 514

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 11:51

My experience with recent employment generally yes.



However I Left school at 16, joined RAF for 3 year apprenticeship,did my time and spent a lifetime in IT, engineering, sales, marketing, proj management etc etc. Worked for a while as consultant to the German Stock Exchange. Only got 3 GCE's to my name.



For my last job in 2008 as project consultant to the UK Edu Regulator, there was a particular certificate called P2 Project Management as used by HM Govt. Paid for a private course of training to get this qual, and found that it opened the door to literally hundreds of PM jobs around the world. No cert, no interview. With the Cert, finished course on Friday, was employed following Tuesday!



My educational colleagues / Dept heads were all Guardian readers, good University degrees coming out of their ears. We PM's delivered the goods, and it was all down to provable experience and the ability to drive projects well. Plus the P2 cert.

TonyE

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 11:59

Would it be fair to say that prosperity does not depend upon academic qualifications but upon opportunities provided by entrepreneurs who may not be necessarily be highly educated?



Furthermore do successful entrepreneurs benefit from not having academic qualifications, because going to college and taking examinations forces people to learn and think like millions of other graduates?

Pogle


Joined: 28/08/2008
Posts: 1536

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 12:22

If you have the wherewithall you can make it without formal qualifications as many of our leading entrepreneurs have. A university education gives you more choices and opportunities which those without the correct formal qualifications are excluded from. One of my previous employers would only employ Exec Assistants ( PA's) who had attended one the top 5 universities in the UK, I got the job despite the fact I could not even type and my BSc in Anthropology being totally irrelevant to the Logistics industry.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 12:23

Should you tell your child to leave school because if Bill Gates can do it they can also do it?



Surely if you look at a global directory of successful people you might find a few hundred like Bill Gates, but what about those millions of doctors, engineers, IT professionals, lawyers, and advocates who rely upon their formal education?

JohnW


Joined: 23/04/2009
Posts: 601

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 12:33

I think we would describe Bill Gates as well educated: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Gates#Early_life

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 12:56

our son left school when we moved here. dispite our best efforts he would not go to school here.

now he has an online business and earns loads of cash, employs other people from other countries and is happy with what he does.

happiness is up most to me as whats the point of getting up every day to go to a job you hate.?

we never pushed either of our kids into things they didn't want to do, they made their own choices and are both happy.

life is to short.

TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 12:58

I believe that being in the right place at the right time can be more important than academic qualifications.

teatime


Joined: 20/10/2008
Posts: 852

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 13:01

Depends what you class as "Success in Life", I would sooner be happy and poor with no qualifications etc. Than as sad a person as a lot of the 'Higher' educated people I have met.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 13:07

JohnW. Bill Gates did not obtain any qualifications though.

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 13:43

teatime i totally agree.



we worked hard all of our lives for that five bed detached house in the country.

when we got it all i did was moan about the bills, how long the cleaning took ect ect, it didn't make us happy.

sold up and now here renovating a wreck of a village house but we are both happy.

life is to short.

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:11

Qualefekations like wot i hav got did nt help mee 4 sum unown reeson. look at that Hawkins bloke did it help him eh?

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:14

eyem wiv yu ector. Nuffink like 'aving know kwalifikations - neva urt us. and we no wat we ar taking abaht.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:18

The simple answer to the question in the heading is "NO".



Qualifications can be a help or it can be a hindrance to success. A good education helps you to see all the risks and therefore its a hindrance as far as entrepreneurs are concerned. A well educated person will never take the risks that make a good entreprenuer.



What is success? Does it mean that the more you earn the more successful you are? What is the use of earning good money at the expense of losing your health? One cannot measure success with money. So what is it?



In my view one is successful in life if he has earned enough to gurantee a reasonable standard of living for his family and also manages to make people around him happy and if he also has a clear conscience. It is no use earning a lot of money by cheating other people.

ismet

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:20

I agree with elko, money 'does not maketh the man'. Still rather be stinking rich though....

teatime


Joined: 20/10/2008
Posts: 852

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:21

well said Ismet, as always.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:23

We were all born with two ends. One to sit on and one to think with. Success depends on which one you use; heads you win -- tails, you lose. )

sporty


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 685

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:40

Nothing to do with grades,yes a certain amount of education is important,all you need is the will to win,successful attitudes are something that can be nurtured but still has to come from the person within,setting personal goals are a must,also knowing where you want to be in life and what it is you want to achieve,a positive attitude is also good,i'm not talking of success with just the accumulation of wealth either,some of the most successful people i know dont have a great deal,but they stand out a mile and have respect from many people.Life will pay you any price you desire but you just have to know how to ask for it,then be prepared to do "whatever it takes",my favorite saying is- i shall do today as others will not so i can live tomorrow as others cannot. I dont have an exam to my name but i walked out of a job aged 36 and was a paper millionaire at 38.The teachers that gave me an education will work till they're 65!!

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:44

Academic qualifications open doors for you in the employment field. However I believe that success only comes with hard work and commitment.

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:47

Hi I beleive education is important. I managed to get some qualifactions but I have learnt more from the university of life xx

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 15:51

Doesn't appear to be important when getting a civil service or government job in NC.

begonia


Joined: 19/05/2009
Posts: 229

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 17:59

Depends what you want to do and how ambitious you are. Qualifications don't guarantee wealth or happiness but often job satisfaction.Would you prefer to be a doctor or a loo cleaner ? The professions need qualifications. You wouldn't want your doctor or nurse or teacher to have none.

And eduction learns you to spell...dunnit ? Or innit !

Aussie


Joined: 17/06/2007
Posts: 657

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 22:52

The short answer is no. Academic Qualifications can be very useful or essential in many professions etc. but this is no guarantee of financial success to say nothing of life or job satisfaction etc.



I have meet many more wealthy/ financially successful people who had few qualifications and just concentrated on running small businesses investing in property etc . Conversely most doctors and many other professionals I dealt with had few net assets, unproductive lifestyle debts and high expense bases despite their high earnings.



The value of qualifications is continually declining as university standards drop and you have to spend many years obtaining them when you could have been working, investing etc. Taking the example of the TRNC many professional jobs now ask for masters degrees and in some cases PHD's as well as undergraduate degrees carry little weight any more.



Aussie

begonia


Joined: 19/05/2009
Posts: 229

Message Posted:
21/08/2009 23:01

Yes I agree. The government is so keen to fill the Universities that A Levels have become one a penny. Therefore those who get to University on 2Bs and a C get nowhere and many drop out. So a PhD is now = to a degree. So why don't they provide more apprenticeships for those who shouldn't be at Universities ?

Money doesn't = success.

sporty


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 685

Message Posted:
22/08/2009 02:20

if your OUTgoings exceed your INcome, then your UPkeep will be your DOWNfall, if accumulation of money is what you wish to achieve, get hold of a little book on amazon,its by george classon,called The richest man in babylon, it could be the best few quid you ever spent,its written as a story but it has success principles on money management that could if followed literally change your fortunes!

Cyprusraider


Joined: 08/04/2009
Posts: 99

Message Posted:
22/08/2009 09:16

Problem is there are too many "idiots" walking around with superb academic qualifications. There are also many "idiots" walking about with no qualifications. The qualification in itself does not automatically mean success, however the route to gaining it may be what is needed for a broader "life" education. A "good" qualification may be considered as a sign of dilligence and determination. Both admirable qualities.Most fraudsters seem to possess these traits and so they cannot be a measure of "character". This seems to be an innate quality nurtured by family, environment, teachers and friends. Of course Luck plays an important role, however this is often considered to be a by-product of hard work.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
22/08/2009 22:46

Having worked in Adult training with the unemployed for 30 years and can tell you No!

What employers want is

- Commitment, no clock watchers -good personal skills - people who can work in a team, people who can work unsupervised, people who can get to work on time and do what they are paid to do - not stand around waiting for the next instruction - someone who can use their initiative, think on their feet, are loyal to their employer, people who respect their customers as it is the customer who keeps them in work.

HOWEVER - combine all of these with a/some qualifications and they are flying.

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
22/08/2009 23:16

Katymackem. I had no qualifications but I had everything you say an employer wants. I started work at 15 and retired at 58 having worked for three employers, I worked my way up by sheer dedication, hard work and belief in myself that I could get on, my last job was in management in Local Government 24 years service managing a Home Care Service with 400 old people as clients and 75 staff. I now have an adequate pension and have a good standard of living, I am proud of myself.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
25/08/2009 10:10

Woodspeckie. Messgae 31. You should be proud of yopurself. Well done.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
27/08/2009 18:26

Hi Woodspeckie

Too right - you should be proud of yourself. I too left school at 15 with no qualifications - only took the 11plus and failed that. I worked my way up from office junior to Company Secretary and then went into teaching the unenmployed and assisting them to again NVQ's in Administration, Customer Service, IT and a lot of other skills. Whenever I put a trainee/student into a placement where they demonstrated the above skills (see 30 & 31) they were employed very quickly and established themselves within their company.

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
27/08/2009 18:35

My grandaughter got her GCSC results today 1 A* 8 A's 2 B's & 1C. I hope she makes a success of her life, difficult these days.

yrys88


Joined: 08/08/2009
Posts: 1140

Message Posted:
27/08/2009 18:44

Most people do definetly judge you at first yes I believe so and know so!



And no they do not grant you success.. Succes is only something you create in your own mind. If you believe surviving 9 months of labour after being chosen out of millions of sperm is success, then you are already a success my friend...

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
27/08/2009 21:17

The government is keen for achievement of A'levels to be raised because the expectations of the person is also raised -They then want to go to university to continue this theme - this takes them off the unemployment figures -the more students in universities and full time higher education the less youth unemployment is recorded. I have interviewed many granduates who have come to me to go on 'government training schemes' and their view of their position was heartbreaking. They had got the degrees etc etc but still could not find work because employers found that they were older than other applicants (have gone to uni for 3 or so years), had no experience and high expectations. They then came to me with their tails between their legs as failures. I then had to boost their moral and confidence and get them into placements and get them jobs. Another problem I found is that they were classroom orientated and could not cope with 9 - 5 in a work role and tried to return to the classroom

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
27/08/2009 21:17

I started off with nothing and I've still got most of it left.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
27/08/2009 21:19

I started off with nothing and I've still got most of it left.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
27/08/2009 21:21

We had 23 year olds who had never done a days work and only knew classroom/study environments. They also thought that they should not be asked to make tea for other staff etc.

It is common now for graduates to come out of college/uni with a management qualification and expect a company to put them in charge of their staff. They do not realise that without some experience, work ethic, work committment and having demonstrated managment skills they will not get the jobs.

Enrico


Joined: 07/12/2008
Posts: 209

Message Posted:
27/08/2009 21:31

A wise man once said that if you die with 20 million in the bak, you are a failure.

But die owing 20 million then you are a success.