Talat: The possibility of permanent partition is getting stronger

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 19:34

The possibility of permanent partition is getting stronger ,claimed turkish cypriot leader mehmet ali talat

this week.

in an interview with milliyet ,talat said that the solution of the cyprus problem has a huge influence on the

democratization process in turkey.

He stressed that cyprus is in safe hands and no one is selling cyprus ,but warned that : the negotiations

will not last forever .

just as everything has an end ,so to does the negotiations if they are not successful .

He warned that: at the end of this process if there is no agreement ,the process will simply collapse .



not wanting to sound pessimistic ,what is important is that right now,we are a point where a solution

is possible .





musin





long live the kktc

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 20:14

There certainly is a lot more talk about partitian, but would Talat make such suggestions if there were no truth in it.



Very rare to hear anything positive to come out about the talks over the last 12 months so its about time time the world was told what is acutally going on

WAZ-24-7



Joined: 18/10/2008
Posts: 695

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 20:50

I think the playing field is certainly becomming more formalised.

It is clear that the ROC feel their hand is strong. The EU and European law is very supportive of their legal, oppressive litigation and embargo and islolationist stance.

The TRNC have the might of the Turkish army and its political and economic support to drive for a good deal.



Who would win...well neither side. Partition/ acceptance along the lines of the Tiawanese solution seems plausible. The ROC will, without doubt, present opposition to this type of solution but what do they have to bring to the table as an alternative. Military intervention is most certainly not an option. Embargoes upon Turkey are too risky. Turkish influence upon Europe, Middle and Far East and USA continues to increase.

The Turks have several and large shots in their arsenal. The ROC are driving on fumes.



I see some significant steps during 2010 towards a forced settlement.

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 20:51

trevor





myself like most turkish cypriots ,now believe that partition is inevitable and the only way forward.



if and when the gc,s come to terms with this ,then a real rapport can be achieved.



maybe they should ask themselves how we got to this stage.





musin



long live the kktc

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 21:01

Hi All,

If it did come to partition and the north stayed under the wing of Turkey and in turn Turkey where accepted into the e.u. would that meen that trade embargoes would be lifted as the north would be no more.And it would just be Turkey and Cyprus,

Paul.

cypwine


Joined: 09/05/2009
Posts: 177

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 21:05

Musin



"IF" Talet wanted permanent partition why on earth is he carrying on with the talks!!!!!!???? I think your post is just wishful thinking on your part!! What YOU want is NOT what the majority of TCs want... you know the ones that live here!!! the talks are progressing nicely and a SOLUTION will be found, it wont suit everybody on either side but at least the island will be one and will be able to move forward to the 21st century where everyone is an equal.

Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 21:09

cypwine, read post 1 again





It clearly states "the posibillity" of partition it does not say the wish of Talat.

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 21:17

Bonio,

Surely if the trnc no longer existed then there couldnt be embargoes,

Paul.

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 21:34

cypwine



if you take turtle,s advice and read the post carefully ,you may then understand it .



wishful thinking on my behalf ,i don,t think so ,clearly wishful thinking on your behalf .



wake up pike ,www.toplum.co.uk .



musin



long live the kktc

cypwine


Joined: 09/05/2009
Posts: 177

Message Posted:
06/09/2009 21:36

Turtle



I some how can`t see Mr T going down that road ,and dont believe for one minute that he even used the word "posibillity"!

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 13:02

http://www.northcyprus.biz/north_cyprus_FeedRedir.asp?FID=9256



Perhaps there is hope,

Paul.

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 18:54

mess 13 as far as the international community would be concerned turkey would still be occupying part of a sovereign country and un member.

well how come they dont imopse any restrictions or embargos on turkey? is it not turkey whos to blame?



was turkey not one of the first countries that president obama visited after his election to president? as i recall it mr obama was grovelling in his admiration for the US great and powerfull freind , just seems a matter of time before turkey and the TRNC get what they want.

P.S so glad we bought here . . . long live the kktc

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 19:42

bonjo



that has got to be the most inept reply i have ever come across ,more ha ha then anything.





andy-f



LONG LIVE THE KKTC



musin

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 19:44

"Dont be a plonker" says Del Boy!

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 20:01

bonjo old chap pikey would turn in is grave at such a feeble and weak response. .



restrictions and embargos on turkey are such that the US will supply it with the worlds most advanced war plane the x-35 , russia wants to do all sorts of trade and deals the UK and china the same !



you have lost the plot and the north of cyprus



long live the kktc

rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 20:13

draw the blinds , long live KKTC .

exnavalperson


Joined: 22/07/2009
Posts: 224

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 20:27

Cypwine and bonio.







What planet are you two on?

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 20:33

what a tosser you are pikey

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 20:37

DONT BE A PLONKER ALL YOUR LIFE BONIO. SAYS "I"

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 20:40

bonjo



do you read what you write,perhaps not.





youuuuuuu stupid boy.





musin



long live the kktc

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 20:48

bonio:



Lovely jubly,innit.











Guess what I am having for breakfast?



well done,you got it wright.

BUBBLE AND SQUEAK

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 21:09

salahi





sana birsey soylemez ,berki saneder rum sun,sana yorgo der.





musin



long live the kktc

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 22:50

Private "Bonio Pike" andy-f wrote: You just can't stop writing that phrase can you.



Can you please forward the £500 you now owe me, to the "JCB bulldozer training academy" in Larnaca.



A born liar and once alleged to be a member of the armed forces and a special plod.........sums it all up really.

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 23:21

MUSIN;

People like him(bonio)are not worth to waste a breath for.So I just take micky out of him.

Even that,he is not intelligent enough to understand.



I will be in Ledra Road in the morning for my "TURKISH COFFEE"if anyone wants to join me.

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 23:25

Sal,

Enjoy your coffee my friend,

Paul.

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 23:30

Paul;

I do all the time and not one stands to say that they dont do "TURKISH COFFEE"

LOL

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 23:34

as long as the powers that be who run this forum allow these idiots who despise everything about north cyprus and the trnc to spill their garbage on here , we will for ever be arguing with them.

pike the prick for example as had more re-incarnations than dr who!



it is a good laugh though!



long live the kktc

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 23:39

Andy,

Would get a bit boring mate if everyone agreed all the time.Pikeys just a wind up merchant,stay loose,

Paul.

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 23:42

salahi



dikkat ha



turkish coffee is now cypriot coffee and cypriot delight and cypriot hamam,basically anything turkish



is now cypriot unless of course it,s greek cypriot.



even our homes and our lands in the south are now classified as cypriot.



musin



long live the kktc

cypwine


Joined: 09/05/2009
Posts: 177

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 23:42

msg 30



Turkish coffee, Greek coffee, lebanese coffee, etc etc is served all over the island not just at ledra Road... its a shame it is only drank by cypriots... maybe you should introduce it to some on here so they get to learn something of the cypriot way of life! dont forget your bread and helim (halloummi)to go with it.



As for bonio he is right in what he says....... as time will tell!

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
07/09/2009 23:59

msg37;

Dont be a plonker all your life Rodney(whooooops...bonio).......says "I"





Constantinople?TURKISH COFFEE didnt excist.



ISTANBUL?Made to perfection.

try it ,you might get to learn.

like DONER KEBAP,SISH KEBAP or even BAKLAVA?



We dont need to steal those from another language and dress them up as GREEK.BECAUSE, they are already TURKISH.

cypwine


Joined: 09/05/2009
Posts: 177

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 00:05

msg 41



I think you will find that all these items you describe are middle eastern NOT just Turkish!!



Constantinople.. lovely place.

MUSIN M


Joined: 26/06/2008
Posts: 1352

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 00:20

cypwine



are you referring too istanbul ,let,s move forward yeh.





it is a lovely place.



musin



long live the kktc

Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 00:36

guys just come and enjoy a real italian coffee and talk. Where is this all going to get us. Or fate is decided by the polotics. Both sides are so beautifl we must remember that. Peace will prevail. Hope will go on. Charity begins at home. This is such a lovely place north and south. Let them who decide claim our fate we wont xx

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 00:54

Lilli....I may suprise you next month!

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 01:03

cypwhinge....and I bet butter would not melt in you mouth either.

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 01:50

cypwine message 6:



a word of advice from a greyer head: you alice should not accuse others of wishful thinking



because you were the self-same lady trilling that a re-unification deal was "75% in the bag",

barely six short months ago

please adjust your lornettes, you'll see the talks are holed below the waterline and sinking



at least you weren't "90% sure" of a deal by june, as poor boneyard chirupped at the time



but you may be sincere in believing the tc's would be better off under the gcs than the turks,

though the viscious though otherwise pointless embargoes and unwillingness to compromise

are perhaps, just perhaps pumping the exactly opposite message north of the green line?



but then I'm obviously not a cypriot so I wouldn't really have any role in all that argy bargy

...on the other hand, I do have a nose for when the other fella is basically "trying it on",

explaining why your lot will always be losers when sniffing out a workable cyprus solution

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 09:03

it had to be said

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 09:50

The EU/UN should order Christofias to conduct a referendum before Xmas - if the GC's vote 'No' for a second time, which they're bound to; then EU, for their intransigence, should suspend their EU membership and *cut all financial 'aid'.



* This may happen, anyway, due to the 'Title Deeds' debacle, which the RoC government has blatantly announced that it plans to take no action on; so much more 'puffed up' with their own importance that they have become since gaining EU membership.



Some 'kicking and screaming' could be on the cards!

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 09:56

john message 49:



"should"? "will"? "order"? "intransigence"? "debacle"? ...just words I'm afraid:



do behave!!!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 10:58

Dear Warren



re msg 3



>> The EU and European law is very supportive of their [RoC] legal, oppressive litigation and embargo and islolationist stance. <<



No.. the UN security Council have rulings declaring "TRNC" legally invalid - and post Annan the outside world knows that TCs were prepared to kiss goodbye to "TRNC"...but the UN resolutions remain...



>>The TRNC have the might of the Turkish army and its political and economic support to drive for a good deal.

<<



Like THAT is a negotiating stance that will "work"....Remember the TCs said they were OK to say "goodbye" the TR army ( save 950)



In the REAL world, the problem is to convince TCs to vote yes again and the GCs that Annan was probably the best deal in town..that their former President was VERY wrong, and the new one was more interested in hanging onto power..at the expense of a solution.

TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 11:02

Hi mmmmmmmm,



Would you care to predict the outcome of the present talks and the consequences of the talks either failing or the referenda returning a negative vote.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 11:17

msge 51



"Remember the TCs said they were OK to say "goodbye" the TR army ( save 950)"



You are a little out of date. The Ceps poll last year showed that 93% of TC's are satisfied/very satisfied with the Turkish army being on the island. Not long after this poll the UBP were voted in to power.

cypwine


Joined: 09/05/2009
Posts: 177

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 15:13

but you forget msg 53 that the polls you are referring to were by settlers who regard them selves as turkish cypriots!!!! The genuine tcs that i know all want a reunified island.

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 16:34

msg 54;

Genuine tcs?????



I am??????



reunified island??????



I'll give that a miss,thank you.



NOW,

Take my advise,and you can be wise.

DONT BE A PLONKER ALL YOUR LIFE!!!!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 17:43

Hi Cypwine



I can't think of many TCs who would be happy with reunification... but 2 autonomous regions - as part of a NEW state - that *might* be a goer..



The problem is TCs and many "settlers" did vote yes in 2004 - and as Mark (ILC) points out - the attitude has hardened.. ( but I'n assured the UBP won on the economy - NOT the CY Q..



As much as I was pro Annan - this is going to be a hard sell.. and I mainly blame Papadopoulos for misleading GCs into thinking joining the EU would mean EU norms of HR would prevail.. some MAJOR HR and property abrogations will be necessary :(



What do *I* see if the latest talks fail?



Sorry Andy-f - you asked this too.. it REALLY depends on who are perceived as the "problem"..I can see an elevation of TC related admin status - whilst still acknowledging that "TRNC" is legally invalid - say ref education, grant aid.. especially if they are prepared to compromise and the GCs aren't..

andy-f


Joined: 03/05/2009
Posts: 1256

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 18:13

interesting times ahead then , thanks for that mark .

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
08/09/2009 18:17

Andre 514/Msg 50:



Indeed, maybe words.....but, everyone can see where the 'talks' are headed - right down the 'gurgler' - so, why shouldn't the UN order an RoC referendum, and simultaneously warn Christofias that, in the event of another 'No/Oki', all UNFYCYP personnel will be immediately withdrawn.



Something must be done to deflate their pomposity, which has already reached 'ad nauseam' proportions long ago.

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
09/09/2009 10:19

john message 55,



take care over your predictions:

you'll start to sound like saint mark if your personal theories warp objective reality



looked at dispassionately there will be no banging of heads together this time around

by the un, usa, eu or any other set of initials...

these outfits have already made it clear they will not do so

and it would not be practical or effective, judging by all past experience on the island



even the wobbliest ex-pat doesn't maintain a referendum will be handed down from on high

but pretends instead cypriots will "agree" one beforehand in some unexplained fashion



the tragedy is that otherwise brilliant minds are selecting facts,

and abandoning all intellectual rigour, desperate to talk up hopes of a cyprus "deal"



myself I'd only see a referendum or deal in the offing if both sides

have come to an informal understanding prior, but if anything they are now diverging,

the gc's in particular refusing to compromise in any meaningful way

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
09/09/2009 10:46

Dear Andre_514



re msg 56





>> but if anything they are now diverging,



the gc's in particular refusing to compromise in any meaningful way<<



How do you come to this conclusion - a cancelling of one meeting ? .. "wishful thinking" perhaps ?;)

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
09/09/2009 17:21

winalot message 58:



maybe cypwine meant this, maybe alice meant that...



I'll say something about juliet,

she is one of the very few to declare honestly a personal interest in the cyprus issue,

she hopes her children or grandchildren will occupy properties north of the green line



and if you are honest with yourself, this is what "talking up the talks" is really about

while even suzanne would concede she needs some kind of agreement first,

since the roc obviously lacks the military muscle to do anything other than bleat



by the way I think I made a spelling mistake earlier, it should be "lorgnettes"

exnavalperson


Joined: 22/07/2009
Posts: 224

Message Posted:
10/09/2009 09:01

Message 57





There are none so blind as those that WILL NOT see.

AlexF065


Joined: 07/09/2009
Posts: 271

Message Posted:
10/09/2009 09:23

The GC's have got quite rich and very greedy it seems to myself since they "fled south with only the shirts on their backs" and Joined the EU along with Greece.



I cannot see any resolution at this time or for a good long while yet Turkey have a few more problems than just the TRNC to deal with before they will be allowed to join in the gravy train that is the EU



And frankly I think the North would be better off with Turkey than joined back together y with the greedy south cyprus who have not moved from the position as they thought it should be in 1974

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
10/09/2009 10:22

message 60 david,



agree



especially in this guy's case when he's clearly so well-read...



but then I have been saying until I'm blue in the face that any settlement,

if it were ever to fall from the sky, that is,



a) does not really appertain to me as a non-cypriot

b) arguably, should deliver a modest bonus, on balance, for the typical expat



regarding the eu, and turkey's much-hyped accession "prospects"

if only on cyprus 44, and any real relevance to the cyprus issue,

please allow me to quote from michael palin's recent book "new europe" (2007)

quoting one yusuf yavas, a turk of greek-muslim descent and local archeologist:



"turkey is ninetyeight percent islamic country...unemployment rates are quite high...

european people think... all the turks will come to europe and take our jobs...

they have an image in their heads of an arab country... turkey is not arabic...

we have democracy for eighty years... they should learn a little more about turkey"

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
10/09/2009 15:38

Dear Naggie



re msg 63



Wait for it.. you will be told Hitchen's is biased - as he married a GC. ;)



An American might tell you that he is a "commie"..!

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
10/09/2009 16:21

so mark,



no reply to my comment as yet

about the chances of a cyprus settlement falling out of the sky?

oops! my "ulterior motives" are showng again...



darn'

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
10/09/2009 23:13

alex,



you are correct

south cyprus is relatively rich: ask mark since he has "business interests" there



but I don't believe that is why they are so inflexible on the cyprus issue

...from different people's points of view they may be "right" or "wrong" in such tactics

(and that's not my concern really!)



but one of turkey's questions for the future is what to do after its supposed eu bid

which predictably was met with a solid wall of hostility by the eu leadership ( see 62 above),

while sadly, the whole farcical process is now grinding towards its endgame



but turkey is a young and vibrant country, and has many other irons in the fire

including, surprise surprise, a burgeoning working relationship with russia...

unlike the unfortunate greek cypriots whose attempt at art has them painted into a corner



in some ways they themselves are responsible for the partition become permanent

whatever motives, beliefs or interests I or any other person has, has not, or whatever

rdsteve


Joined: 01/03/2009
Posts: 187

Message Posted:
11/09/2009 08:39

The Cyprus problem for Turkey to get into the EU is only a small. Germany & France plus human rights are Turkeys biggest problems about getting into the EU. Sarkozy & Merkel are anti Muslim you only have to see what Sarcozy did with banning the berka so these 2 will back the RoC all the way. In a perfect world i would like to see a reunification of the Island. Co-operation between Turkey, Greece and the Island on oil and gas exploration, just think what jobs and wealth it would bring to the island. It would also set a president for perminant peace in the middle east if this problem was sorted out. Yes the GC Cypriots are gready but so are the Turkish Cypriots at the end of the day they are Cypriots it is in there nature to be gready. If it was put to them that how much wealth is in that sea and that they were going to earn money from it they would soon put all things aside to get to it. Turkey cannot keep bank rolling the TRNC forever.



Steve