ORAMS interesting statement from the presidential press office

macman


Joined: 15/12/2008
Posts: 24

Message Posted:
17/09/2009 15:41

Statement by the Presidential Press Office

President Mehmet Ali Talat has decided that it would be beneficial to hold a meeting with the lawyers of the Orams couple in London.



Accordingly, President Talat will be travelling to London tomorrow morning for this meeting.



Following his meeting with the lawyers of the Orams couple, President Talat will travel from London to Washington.

TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
17/09/2009 16:10

Better late than never that the gov takes an interest.

Reg55



Joined: 07/07/2008
Posts: 110

Message Posted:
17/09/2009 18:03

Hope he (TRNC) offers to buy their property - then things would get interesting!

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
17/09/2009 19:16

The ECHR would ask you, Reg55: 'Do you mean: buy Mr Apostolides' property?'



Now that would set a precedent and 'open a can of worms'!

dizzycows


Joined: 12/05/2009
Posts: 2736

Message Posted:
17/09/2009 23:06

Hasnt Talat got several villas built somewhere that is on 'exchange' GC land? Think I can remember reading something about this in the press back along. ....

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
17/09/2009 23:09

How did Talat get an entry visa to Britain?



Richard

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
17/09/2009 23:45

re msg 6 He is a Cypriot.. he doesn't need a visa !



when is this link - that appears above anything Orams - going to be updated?



http://www.cyprus44.com/property/orams.asp



re msg 3 Reg55



>>Hope he (TRNC) offers to buy their property - then things would get interesting!<<

Hmmm.. the "TRNC" have already "allocated" the land owned by Mr Apostolides... then it was "sold" on to the Orams..

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
17/09/2009 23:51

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm



So all Turkish Cypriots can just pile into the UK without a need for a visa. On what passport, TRNC ID card?!



Richard

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 00:44

Ok guys and gals;

The usual nonsense started again!

msg3;

Why would (TRNC) offer to buy their property?

msg4;

Why would ECHR ask you to buy Mr Apostolides property?Has he got a property for sale in SOUTH?

msg5;

If Mr Talat has got few villas in TRNC built somewhere that previusly belonged to GC,should that not show you how safe it is to buy in TRNC?

msg6,Richard;

Mr Talat,the president of TRNC would hold a GREEN PASSAPORT,doesnt require visa.

msg7,Mark;

The TRNC did not sell a land to Orams family,the person that got it as "esdeger"to what he/she had to leave behind in south DID.

msg8,Richard;

No Turkish Cypriot can enter Uk without visa other then the green passaport holders.



hope the above info helps and stops the nonsense.



The main problem is with the EU member country citizens,inc.myself.

Then again,as multy national citizen I can pick and choose,lucky me,heay!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 00:47

Richard, re msg 8..



If they are REAL TCs.. most of them have RoC passports.... not that constitutes "recognition".. it's just expedient..



Do you think he has a secret RoC travel document" ?;)



Seriously, it would be interesting to know how the UKBA deal with him and his entourage !.

Brinsley


Joined: 04/04/2009
Posts: 6858

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 01:08

Salahi



Are you loosing it too? It was a rhetorical question. Talat travels on a diplomatic passport, no doubt issued from Turkey or as you mentioned a 'green' one, the latter I've never heard of before but that's my ignorance!



Richard

Reg55



Joined: 07/07/2008
Posts: 110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 01:16

If the TRNC bought the property, it would in effect be saying: hey, this is legit, deal with us Mr Mr Apostolides, we are the ones you need to deal with. Lets get the whole thing debated. Lets get the whole history of the situation brought into debate. Don't cruscify the Orams, it is us, the TRNC who should be in court. We want ALL the facts to be known here. We believe we are in the right. This is not about one bit of land, its about what happened 50 or so years ago. Come on, lets talk, lets really talk!!!!

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 01:37

With all due respect Reg55,

TRNC have been trying for "global exchange" for the past 35 years.

In TRNC,what the Orams family or anyone else for that matter have bought is LEGAL.



Regarding,weather this LEGAL TRNC titles are recognised by any other country,only one thing springs to my mind;

WHO CARES!!!

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 09:49

Msg13: 'In TRNC,what the Orams family or anyone else for that matter have bought is LEGAL.'



If you say so, yorgozlu - good on ya, sport!

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 09:49

re 7, Yoguzlu

>>The TRNC did not sell a land to Orams family,the person that got it as "esdeger"to what he/she had to leave behind in south DID. <<



But, that's what I said.. may be I should have made it CLEARER !



The land was "allocated" by "TRNC"....inference - to someone ... then it was "sold" on.. inference - by the person it was "allocated" to... the Orams...



Me thinks you had a hard day, yesterday ! ;)

Reg55



Joined: 07/07/2008
Posts: 110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 09:49

Yorgozlu: either you are trying to prevoke a response (fair enough) or you live in a a world of your own. Who cares, mmm, well, er:

anyone thinking of buying here

anyone who might sell here

anyone who has an interest in the value of what they have here

the estates and construction industry - no make that the whole economy, ie everyone who lives here.....

Reg55



Joined: 07/07/2008
Posts: 110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 09:57

Yorgozlu: either you are trying to prevoke a response (fair enough) or you live in a a world of your own. Who cares, mmm, well, er:

anyone thinking of buying here

anyone who might sell here

anyone who has an interest in the value of what they have here

the estates and construction industry - no make that the whole economy, ie everyone who lives here.....

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 14:22

msg 11,Richard;

msg15,Mark;

Forgive my "simple" way of thinking.

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 14:31

msg 16;

No,I am not trying to provoke a response nor argument.Just stating "simple facts" if you could understand what I mean.

Until the day that EU and the rest of the world decides to recognise TRNC,in TRNC things will be done TRNC way.When they do,they can start butting their nose in TRNC.

In the meantime selling,buying or whatever else you are involved in;

ENJOY!

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 17:20

Sock it to 'em, man!



yorgozlu for President - yeah!

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 17:34

Welcome to London Mr Talat.



Lets hope the talks are worth the trip.

Reg55



Joined: 07/07/2008
Posts: 110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 17:57

Re: mess 19:



I think the Orams were trying to "enjoy" but, like it or not, and in any case without your permission, someone from outside the TRNC did "butt their nose in". He was called Mr Apostolides!



Simple Facts!

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 18:59

msg 22;

Thats EU for you!

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 19:28

Reg55/ Msg 22: ...and if things get any worse for the (always seen smiling) Orams, and as RoC won't allow land to be 'exchanged', and UK upholds the ECHR decision, Mr. Apostolides could well be living in their civilised, comfy Sussex home, while they're still paying rent for the (imposing-looking!) 'concrete tent' they erected on his land in TRNC.



While so many foreign buyers of Esdeger land did so out of naivety - one wonders, if such a precedent as described above, eventuates; will this type of RoC litigation 'open the floodgates'?



I still maintain, having oft repeated it, that if the majority of GC's voted for Makarios, they should simply and benignly accept their losses in North Cyprus.



The ECHR, realising that EU renegued on its promises to TRNC, should have refused to conduct any property reclaim case (e.g. Orams) on the grounds that only a political solution can be acceptable to the world at large.



Abdication of 'Human Rights' implementation is what - cont'd

Reg55



Joined: 07/07/2008
Posts: 110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 19:32

Hey, Yorgozlu, something we can agree on !!

Now how about a petition: 'TRNC should buy the Orams place, as a matter of support: to the Orams; to all owners of original Greek title property now under TRNC title; and to the credibility of itself as the guarantor of all such title deeds.

Reg55



Joined: 07/07/2008
Posts: 110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 19:37

Tenakoutou

All sounds about right to me.

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 19:39

Cont'd: the EU and UN are guilty of.



Their double standards, as regards TRNC, can only be described as iniquitous, and an abomination of the worst kind.



So, is it any wonder that TC's have adopted the policy of: 'Get what you can, while you can!'



Would not any race of people, from any country in this cruel world, do the same if placed in the predicament that faces Turkish Cypriots?

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 22:45

"So, is it any wonder that TC's have adopted the policy of: 'Get what you can, while you can!'"

Sadly, so have the politicians it seems on both sides.

yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 22:59

msg 25;

As much as I dont know what/who you are refering to by TRNC,

why would TRNC want to buy Orams's place,for what purpose and to prove what to who?

Any property with TRNC titles in TRNC is LEGAL



If TRNC should buy anyones place for a matter of support,it should be mine(I'm broke)!!



TRNC is a guarantor for all title deeds issued in TRNC.If the person(s)mentioned is a EU citizen,should that be made a problem of TRNC government?



The main problem lies within EU.It is being in EU that has given them the courage to try their old tricks on us again.But,heay,I say;



BRING THEM ON BROTHER

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
18/09/2009 23:19

Good on ya, sport - those Turkish jet fighter aircraft are only a coupla minutes away!



My Turkish pal in Aussie had a 'T' shirt with the logo: 'Last time we made you run - next time we'll make you swim!'



His other 'T' shirt was a beauty - logo was: 'What's a fart between friends?'



The cartoon picture was: him with a big smile on his dial - two of his mates were hanging on to him - one with a green face - the other chundering a big 'vegetable rainbow'!

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 01:35

one useful thing the trnc could do is offer to fund the orams

should this ever become necessary

it would guarantee that any losses would be made good,

while this in itself would help the struggling trnc economy



next thing you know is one of the gc readers of this forum

and with the usual breathtaking sensation of going nowhere at light speed

will pop up out of nowhere (an inspiration for the "nowhere man"?)

and ask us why the expats don't particularly like them



of course you can't condemn a whole people to stalemate,

but they are making a pretty workmanlike job of that themselves

...at least according to leaks from the un

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 13:22

message 15 mark:



you put inverted commas around the word "sold"



you can do this quite easily for two reasons...

firstly it is two touches of the keyboard and your parenthasis key has not yet worn out

secondly in the fullness of time, what was supposedly sold may not really have been sold

although the de facto buyer bviously took immediate possesion



...then your parenthasese may have some validity on the ground, as it were



personally I doubt it, and suspect in your heart of hearts you do too

but it is certainly one particular slant on the cyprus "problem", as defined by your good self



("oops")

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 13:28

Dear Andre_514



"sold" as in not internationally recognised as "sold".. de jure .. legally, as far as international community are concerned .. OK?

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 16:28

"one useful thing the trnc could do is offer to fund the orams



should this ever become necessary



it would guarantee that any losses would be made good,



while this in itself would help the struggling trnc economy"



Please accept that I'm not having a pop. I just sigh and ask the questions. How will it help the struggling economy? Why hasn't the TRNC government done anything until now? If they guarantee any losses will that apply to anyone who has bought a property on 'exchange land'? Just what would that cost the TRNC economy? Would that simply spark a free for all amongst GC's affected knowing there is Turkish money (the TRNC couldn't fund it) forthcoming? Just what does President Talat hope to achieve by flying to London to speak to the Orams lawyers (he could use the phone)? Will he use the opportunity to speak with UK politicians?

Just my thoughts.

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
19/09/2009 22:30

Talat's timing for his (luxury!) trip to London could not have been concieved under more propitious circumstances - viz-a-viz the RoC suing the British Government, as per the story in 'Cyprus Today'.



If Talat can manage to ingratiate himself with the 'right people'; possibly, the UK Government, currently likely to be both slightly aggrieved and a tad embarrassed by the malevolent tactics of these presumptuous GC's, give him a, hitherto, unprecedented sympathetic ear.



If he 'plays his cards right', he could come up 'smelling of roses', and the TRNC's predicament could well be soon re-assessed in a different and more beneficial light by 'the powers that be'.

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
20/09/2009 02:51

mark message 33:



you put "sold" in inverted comments

and referred to the International Community, as you call it



with the passage of time the legal currency of "former refugee properties"

becomes less and less tenable, while the current occupants feel ever more secure

at first in a defacto sense but eventually with international acquiesence



you doubt this or claim to discount it?



think american indians, silesia, craina serbs, scottish settlers in ulster

think english possesions in france, the japanese kuril islands and maoris



a single cyprus had a "best before" date: 1974

and a sellout-by date of around 2050



whatever the rights and wrongs of the cyprus question

if you care about your unique vision of cyprus,

do have a quiet word with your greek cypriot mates

and tell them to get their finger out compromise-wise



but they didn't really listen to you in '74, and probably won't in 2009

and the un too seems to giving up any hope of change from that quarter

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
20/09/2009 11:44

re 36 Andre_514



As you VERY well know, my stance is that there are ways to sort this out, and currently this is to TRY Turkey's IPC - the local remedy, and see if you get a result.. All aggrieved parties should be piling in to test it



Also, an agreed solution voted on by CYPRIOTS..



You will find that TR has had to pay out for "loss of use" as there is/ was nothing "former" about ownership...



Now, if CYPRIOTS can't agree, I believe the ECHR approved remedy will strengthened as the approach to take ..



Wise Cypriots should use it NOW...



The rest of your comments are highly subjective, or can only be "proven" after an an event..