Nurse loses crucifix row claim

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
06/04/2010 18:05

A Christian nurse who was moved to a desk job after refusing to remove her crucifix has lost a claim for discrimination.

Shirley Chaplin, 54, took the Royal Devon and Exeter NHS Trust Hospital to an employment tribunal, claiming that taking off a necklace bearing a crucifix would "violate her faith".

Employment tribunal panel chairman John Hollow found against Mrs Chaplin, who had worn the emblem throughout her 30 years as a nurse. Mr Hollow ruled the trust had acted in a "reasonable" manner in trying to reach a compromise.

He said the damage to her was "slight" and noted that wearing a crucifix was not a requirement of the Christian faith.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
06/04/2010 18:06

In a 71-point statement, Mrs Chaplin, who wore the crucifix to the hearing in her home city of Exeter, said she was "personally convicted" to wear the emblem, given to her as a confirmation gift in 1971.



She said: "I have been a nurse for roughly 30 years and throughout that time I have worn my crucifix. The crucifix is an exceptionally important expression of my faith and my belief in the Lord Jesus Christ. To deliberately remove or hide my crucifix or to treat it disrespectfully would violate my faith."



Last July, she was told she was facing a "disciplinary sanction". In August she was threatened with formal disciplinary action.



She said she received a letter in September telling her the cross was not a "mandatory requirement" of her faith, unlike Muslim headscarves, which "therefore could be exempted".

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
06/04/2010 18:07

The trust said the move was not specifically about the crucifix, but about health and safety concerns about patients grabbing necklaces.



She said: "I view this as a clear discrimination against Christians. The respondent (the trust) clearly regarded themselves as experts on religious manifestations of all faiths."

decanddyl


Joined: 17/01/2009
Posts: 792

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 00:37

When I started my nurse training many years ago we were told the only jewellery allowed was a wedding ring if we were married and very small stud earrings if we had pierced ears no other jewellery would be tolerated. A watch was required but had to be pinned to our uniform. Nowadays in many hospitals the staff trained or otherwise seem to wear whatever they like engagement rings, wrist watches chains around their neck etc. etc.

Personally I do think jewellery worn should be limited for several reasons the main one being infection control and if she trained 30 years ago she surely must have been told to remove it unless she had it well hidden.

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 07:29

Any of the hospitals I worked in would not tolerate jewellery of any kind other than a wedding ring. I totally agree with the Trust that has asked this woman to remove her 'crucifix' it should have been done 30 years ago.



As decanddyl says for infection control purposes, and also from a safety aspect as a violent patient could grab the chain and do her an awful lot of damage.



And the crucifix could be offensive to some people.



Chris

cyberhiker


Joined: 23/03/2009
Posts: 57

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 09:55

While I can just about agree with the 'health & safety' issue, I don't see why peoples' religious intolerance should be used as a reason for banning the crucifix. To turn it on it's head, there are plenty of people who find Muslim dress offensive but I don't recall anyone being told they can't wear a burkha for this reason.

Rottolover



Joined: 21/06/2009
Posts: 519

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 10:39

What on earth is wrong with this nurse wearing the bloody thing under her blouse or uniform? There, it couldn't be seen, let alone grabbed, and she still has the comfort of wearing it.



But, offensive to some people...? Sorry, tough titties.

phylray



Joined: 21/09/2007
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 14:15

The only ones it would be offensive to are extreme bigots.

hattikins


Joined: 17/02/2008
Posts: 2793

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 14:50

Just another case of the UK losing it's identity, to treat someone like this in what is a recognised Christian country is appalling. All other religions are allowed to display items or clothing related to their faith, why not a crucifix ?

Clarissa2


Joined: 12/06/2009
Posts: 1476

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 16:11

Re : Msg.2 ,



..." She said she received a letter in September telling her the cross was not a "mandatory requirement" of her faith, unlike Muslim headscarves, which "therefore could be exempted". "...



What a load of rubbish! Headscarves have got nothing to do with FAITH and they are not "mandatory requirement" either.



I wish Employment tribunal spend their time on something really useful. But then again what would you expect after 3 terms of New Labour...



Meanwhile British economy is in tatters...

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 18:10

If the nursey feels so strongly about the whole deal, she should get a big cross tattoed on her forehead - not much the Trust could do about that one!

measey


Joined: 07/02/2009
Posts: 1037

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 20:46

Tenakoutou. Briliant problem solved.



Measey.

Dusterbruce


Joined: 03/08/2007
Posts: 1125

Message Posted:
07/04/2010 22:09

Tattoos look terrible on women, so council estate!

littlejohn


Joined: 09/03/2009
Posts: 316

Message Posted:
08/04/2010 01:24

Messages 6,9 and 13 Get a life!

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
08/04/2010 07:25

The other thing nobody has mentioned it looks totally unprofessional to be seen on the wards with jewellery on.



Just visit Girne hospital if you don't believe me as the nurses there wear just about what they want, old cardigans, make-up way over the top and bangles and chains. I may be old fashioned but I still think there should be standards kept.



Chris

Tenakoutou



Joined: 27/07/2009
Posts: 4110

Message Posted:
08/04/2010 08:00

I think I'm craving for a bed-bath!

cyberhiker


Joined: 23/03/2009
Posts: 57

Message Posted:
08/04/2010 09:34

Message 14:



I have a very good one thanks!

And thankfully free of the religious bigotry you are obviously comfortable with.

hattikins


Joined: 17/02/2008
Posts: 2793

Message Posted:
08/04/2010 10:11

Message 14,

and so do I, I also have an opinion which you obviously disagree with hence your usual arrogance.

hilda


Joined: 10/09/2009
Posts: 80

Message Posted:
08/04/2010 10:20

Nurshawful

Someone might find the crucifix offensive,so whats your view on burka etc worn in hospitals

Dusterbruce


Joined: 03/08/2007
Posts: 1125

Message Posted:
08/04/2010 11:35

Speaking clinically, I would think a burka would harbour more infections than a crucifix

hilda


Joined: 10/09/2009
Posts: 80

Message Posted:
08/04/2010 20:48

My thoughts too Duster,but i am sure nurshawful will post her thoughts on this matter

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
09/04/2010 00:19

Ok Hilda and Dusterbruce,



My thoughts on the Bukha are easy as I have never seen one worn in a UK Hospital have you??



Chris

Codger


Joined: 03/04/2009
Posts: 153

Message Posted:
09/04/2010 12:43

Seen lots of Bukha worn by visitors have also seen many Turbans and skull caps worn by medical staff, are these washed and changed each day?



Anyway we digress, this issue was about H and S matters ( probably to disguise the real reason! ) whereby the cross on a chain could be grabbed by a patient.

No mention was made of the pens in the top pocket of the uniform or the watch pinned to the uniform which patients could also grab.



So if the cross is designated as jewelery and is unprofessional is it not therefore also unprofessional to wear a wedding ring under which a multitude of germs probably live?



Codger

nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
09/04/2010 13:05

Point taken Codger but you will find the majority of nurses not only take their ring of to handwash but they then also wear gloves.



Also if someone grabs a pen from your top pocket there is no real danger to you if they grab a chain round your neck they can do a lot of damage.



Chris

hattikins


Joined: 17/02/2008
Posts: 2793

Message Posted:
09/04/2010 13:49

I worked for many years with young people with learning disabilities and challenging behaviour, yes a chain around your neck could cause a problem if someone pulled at it but eventually it would break, it certainly wouldn't strangle you.

But a pen is far more dangerous in my opinion, that can be used to stab you in the eye, I've seen that done and it's horrible, or can be used to stab you in the throat.

So I do not accept that this ruling was on H&S grounds, this was just another example of rules for one but not the other.