Expat exodus

dixie normus


Joined: 22/02/2008
Posts: 820

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 06:50

With current price hikes in utilities, Uk pensions to Lira exchange diabolical, and inflation in the TRNC accelerating out of control, is a life of retirment in the sun costing to much? A pal of mine working at the auctions tells me of many that are now, selling up, pressing the eject button and returning to the UK. Any members know if this does seem to be the case, is the cost of living here, more than the Uk now? anyone out there with thoughts of returning home?



D.N

ilovemydogs



Joined: 20/04/2008
Posts: 514

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 07:12

i think anyone returning home, will find the same problem here. only without the sun.

wettest august on record. and no real summer, i know where i would choose if i had the choice.

mackerel


Joined: 22/06/2008
Posts: 116

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 07:44

Would be interested to know if people really believe that the cost of living in TRNC is actually higher than in UK

joandjelly


Joined: 24/02/2008
Posts: 2953

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 10:10

The only way to know will be to do some analysis. Someone needs to post their UK costs and then try and compare like for like with someone living here.

flightholiday


Joined: 19/07/2007
Posts: 3217

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 11:22

J&J somewhere on the UK govt web site there used to be an "average shopping basket" that compared with the Cyprus Today average (if they still publish it) would give an idea.



But there can be other factors to take into account like taxation local services and if you are rural in the UK the amount it costs even to get to the local shops.



It certainley would be interesting and not just for TRNC but ROC, France and Spain

Stewart


Joined: 19/07/2008
Posts: 1107

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 12:01

I spend alot of time between the UK and TRNC, UK economy is in a mess, oil prices, utilities, little work, banks are not lending, house prices falling sharply, food prices up.

If you have YTL, it is a good time to cash in and buy in the uk ( in about 6 months when house prices will be lower .)

If you have GBP, suggest you stick, perhaps sell out when the "Talks" price increase have taken effect on your property ..presuming you have property ( could be in 6 - 12 months ) to get best value if you really do want to go back!?

If you have no property, perhaps pay a visit before deciding.

shytallknight


Joined: 07/07/2008
Posts: 39

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 12:02

Ha Ha Ha where the ***k did you get that avitar ? it's Borat init, I've only just noticed it, ha ha ha, you should grow a lip catapillar like that Tim, ha ha ha.

By the way the weather is shocking in the U.K. no summer again this year, I'll see you at the end of the montyh though.

brod41


Joined: 29/09/2007
Posts: 26

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 12:19

MORNING DIX,

IS THIS WRIGHT YOUR GETTING A CATAPILLAR,GROW ONE AND YOU TO CAN LOOK LIKE A TOILET BRUSH.WELL I SURVIVE HERE ON A SMALL PENSION AND ALTHOUGHT THINGS ARE GETTING TIGHT I SEEM TO HAVEA FAIR STANDARD OF LIFE ,SHOULD I RETURN TO UK IT WOULD BE BACK TO WORKING ALL HRS AND FOR WHAT TO BE ABLE TO HOLD ONES HEAD UP AND SAY YOUR NOT CLAIMING FROM THE STATE WHEN ALL THE INFLUX OF IMIGRANTS CLAIM FROM THE STATE AND ARE BETTER OF THAN YOU NO WAY ILL TAKE MY CHANCES IN THE SUN EVEN WITH CATAPILLARS EVERY WHERE LOL

Chick-A-Dee


Joined: 16/06/2008
Posts: 342

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 12:27

Our rates in the UK, for a standard, 3 bed house are in the region of £1200 per year.



I have just paid our 'metered' water bill. Average useage - it was £180.00 for 5 months, so on average that would be £36.00 per month over the last 5 months.



Electric for us is around £35.00 per month.



Does this figures help?

guvenen


Joined: 20/02/2007
Posts: 32

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 12:38

Everything in the UK has risen dramatically. Loaf of bread now averages £1.12. We really noticed it when we returned to the UK at the beginning of July after 2 months in the TRNC. Utilities have soared, an example is gas prices. We pay £35 a month gas, we are always in credit because we are not in the UK for 5/6 months a year. British Gas did a calculation of some sorts and decided that to enable us to cover our bill, we have to now pay £78 a month, I had a tiny, little conversation with them and reduced it to £45 a month. Electricity and water did the same sort of calculations. It's estimated that to take a bath would cost around a £1. If you are interested, I will scan my last supermarket bill and post it on here. I looked up national statistics, which shows the inflation rate, but I guess it depends on what your style of living is.

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?ID=19



I know there has been huge inflation in the TRNC but if you have been settled there for a few years, I think returning to the UK would be a huge shock in every way.



Only 2 weeks to go before we are back. It's dark and raining with gales in Eastbourne and freezing cold. Enjoy what you all have over there.

Viv

Coachie



Joined: 29/07/2008
Posts: 2135

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 12:50

i have been retired now for two years,and with my small works pension and state pension we are just about coping. my wife has a part time job which pays for extras ...holiday..emergencies..etc..the way things are going up inprice might consider selling up and moving out there for our few remaining years...sob...sob...sob. believe me stick it out if you can cos theres nothing back here at the moment

perry


Joined: 27/01/2007
Posts: 413

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 14:58

The UK economy is a mess and it is not going to get better soon. The banks simply will not take the risks and it means the money supply is still in short supply - this in turn leaves us with higher mortgage rates and therefore less disposable income. Until the banks globally give transparency to their underlying exposure (mostly through packaged mortgages) it will take a long time to recover. All this woe has been compounded by food and energy inflation spirailing out of control - food prices are up 10% on the year, and energy bills - a further 34% hike is being announced by the gas companies.



During the past 10 years those clever people in government effectively squandered the growth years by ballooning the public sector (without reform) and selling off our reserves. This leaves the coffers empty, so they cannot kick start with tax cuts, and pressure on the exchange rate combined with inflation means little room for manouver (Gordon Brown wonders why he is so unpopular !!!)



Anyway - ramble over - fact is that it has got a lot worse during the 'summer' In the UK it is about to get cold and so heating will be required (kind of reverse to TRNC with demand on summer aircon ?). This will further reduce disposable income. The UK is going to become much more expensive and a much harder place to be.....

dixie normus


Joined: 22/02/2008
Posts: 820

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 15:43

Good info Perry, so depending upon lifestyle £ for £ things are better here and getting worse in the Uk?, They recon property prices are falling, Ive noticed no major shift in house prices in the North east, just an abundance of houses on the market, the Unions dont seem to be asking for wage rises yet we hear of rising prices, has the economic situation bottomed out yet or is the Uk still in freefall?



D.N

orangekazzie



Joined: 31/07/2007
Posts: 1091

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 15:59

Saying all that though with the cost of living in the UK going up and up it doesn't appear to have had much effect on the pub trade. The pubs are still doing a roaring trade with food so the money must be coming from somewhere.

Karen

perry


Joined: 27/01/2007
Posts: 413

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 16:07

I don't think it has bottomed out yet - hopefully inflation may peak at the end of the year as the cheaper oil prices start to work their way back into the economy. On the money supply though - the banks need to figure out a way to bottom it out and build back from there. To do this they will have to give full disclosure on their risks and liabilities, which I cant see happening in the near term. It will be no surprise to see a couple more major banks collapse before it turns around. Sorry to sound negative - it will get better, it will just take some time. Oh and yes - we were over there for 3 weeks in August , and it is still cheaper in N Cyprus then the UK by a fair margin

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 16:09

nearest price comparisons for last week.



UK TRNC



electric/gas 50/50 6.7p kw

all electric (EON) 10.65p kw 20p kw

at £100/month uk 100.00 192.00





lager 500ml 88 88

heinz baked beans 53 88

1ltr milk 80 91

1 doz eggs 1.80 1.27

kerrygold butter250g 1.00 2.67

nescafe 50g 1.34 1.54

1ltr fruitjuice 88 88

toothpaste 2.00 2.72

mince beef 2.00 3.28

chicken kg 3.49 3.09

white cheese 4.48 5.66

washing up liquid 100ml 1.47 1.10

total £20.67 £24.88



total incl electric £120.67 £216.88



The electric is the killer.

If we leave that out then the difference is 20% but you could probably get rid of that by not buying stuff like Kerrygold.If you did that we could say the cost is approx the same as UK , But having to find an extra £100 a month for electric would take a lump out the pension.By Summer the effects of the present reduction in wholesale gas/electric will have filtered thro,tho I dont know how the TRNC purchases fuel it must help. Going by UK guidelines on the electric bill in trnc you would be considered to be in fuel poverty if your income was less than £1900 after tax.I imagine the local people must be really feeling the pinch.



In conclusion, if you live or will live allright in the uk ,then you should be ok in the TRNC ,but watch the electric and use public transport.

ROBnJO


Joined: 30/06/2008
Posts: 1289

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 16:23

Pub closures in UK are now exceeding 30 a week, over 1,500 a year. The highest rate since WW2.



Most of the blame is put down to the Smoking ban, cheap supermarket booze and rising costs.



Domestic fuel costs for gas and electric in the UK are currently predicted to rise by between 20 and 40% in the next 6 months.



Today on BBC1 a report stated that many food prices have risen by over 40% in the last 8 months.



A year ago I could fill up my car for £45,... today £74.



I can't wait to move to NC.





I certainly wouldn't move back to Blighty!





rob

PtePike



Joined: 20/05/2008
Posts: 2334

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 16:49

But hopefully you can still afford your £70K director of media and PR, ROBnJO.

saucyboy69


Joined: 09/02/2008
Posts: 111

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 16:53

Girne 29,,



With regard to the electric would the monthly cost be less once the summer is over i:e no more AC and does that include running a pool, ...?which people don't normally have in the UK..



We have a four bedroomed family detached two kids and our electricity and gas are £55.00 and £60.00 per month our water is metered and is approx £30.00 per month and out Council Tax is £140.00 per month..



Electricity per year £660.00

Gas per year £720.00

Water £360.00

Council tax £1400.00



Total £3140. per year or £261.66 per month ..



Our shopping bill has gone from approx £95 to £100 per week this time last year to on average £120.00 now



i was out with friends last night in the midlands and three pints of carling and three bottles of coroner came to just over £17.00 per round...



Fish and chips standard portion from my local chip shop now cost £5.40



Just put diesel in my car cheapest i could find was 122.9p per litre! Tesco average is 124.9p



So i think things are the same world over and can't see an end to the increases at the moment.



Pete,

jakki



Joined: 23/10/2007
Posts: 865

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 17:43

No credit crunch here in Essex (well my part of it anyway). Saw on Leigh Broadway last week (only) two Ferraris, one Humve (correct spelling?) and a brand new Lambougini!!



The favourite of the ladies at the moment is the new Audi (Z7) or something you know the one that looks like the Porche Cayenne.

Saw on the news that Bentley workers have been asked to work a three day week - very sad.

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 19:20

saucyboy

In the cost for electric I was just assuming you would use the same amount.whether in UK orTRNC. more heating required in UK, but aircon requirements plus heating in november on, would balance the difference out.Costs per kw 6.7p for combined gas/electric.10.65p for electric only and 20p for electric only in trnc.



You would have to ask someone who lives the whole year round what the yearly cost is. Savings can be made by not using dishwasher,just use air con to take the edge of the temp and on no account use the aircon for general heating when it gets colder.Basically what we should be doing anyway.

Also one could say that the extra you would have to pay for fuel is paid for by the £1000 or so you would save in rates by moving to TRNC.

I personally would budget on the trnc having at least the same cost of living ,but I am presuming no car.



Couple of comments---

In the UK a lot of people are having to cut back.I heard somewhere that more people die of cold in UK than in Russia.,and thats before this years rises.



As I have mentioned before, the trouble we have at the moment will be as nothing if we cant cure the food problem ,as desperation in the third world will breed more violence and terrorism.



I dont really see an end to price rises all over,however why is food inflation in Europe only 5% and in UK 10%.Is it the case that as always in rip off Britain, we get charged what the Supermarkets etc think they can get away with.Its certainly not the farmers who are making the money.



Just heard that some utility company or companies has increased the dividend it pays to shareholders by 90% compared to last year! .Its now 16%. Not a lot of fuel poverty there!

trishyj


Joined: 07/08/2008
Posts: 77

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 22:56

If you have not been back to the UK for a while you will be shocked at the overheads. Further to previous posts my monthly costs in UK are as follows:

Council tax £121

Gas £78

electric £36

Water £31

These are the costs for a modest house lived in by 2 people who work full time. The figures are my monthly direct debits so averaged out over the year. I don't know if this helps but before moving back anyone should do their homework.

There has been no summer in Uk this year, everyone is depressed and despondent, far more so than I have seen in recent years, so if you can live at for the same amount or less in TRNC, I know where I would rather be!!!

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 23:15

I don't think the pub trade is a good barometer of the state of a nation's economic wealth... the one thing people seem to manage to enjoy in spite of all adversity is a good old pint of beer...

Tinker


Joined: 14/08/2008
Posts: 156

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 00:25

Hi trishyj



Council tax £121

Gas £78

electric £36

Water £31

£266 if my arithmetic is correct



Last months electric bill £300 alone,,,



Tinker

rtddci


Joined: 29/12/2007
Posts: 842

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 00:36

Council tax £200 a month

Gas £300 3 months

Electric £175 3 months

steelman550


Joined: 06/01/2008
Posts: 41

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 01:32

Orange kazzie,



There are hundreds of pubs closing every week.

More and more people are staying in with friends.

Take away and carry out from the local supermarket is a lot cheaper.

Pub prices have gone throught the roof.

Regards Sam.

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 15:22

Will the same happen in NC?

flightholiday


Joined: 19/07/2007
Posts: 3217

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 15:32

Eating places and bars always have a hard time in North Cyprus unless they are stars.



The trade is too variable with the seasons, the rents can be high so they change hands or management, the clients can be fickle too and the staff hard to keep.



All in all, possibly more than usual might close some to never rise again.

Pipie


Joined: 05/01/2008
Posts: 5499

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 16:17

Also the latest news re



There is also a residency income crackdown. One 62 year old pensioner, who only has her £395.00 monthly old age pension, has been refused renewal of her residency as it is considered insufficient to live off here and there is of course no state welfare system for ex-pats.

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 16:32

When did this start? What is 'sufficient income'?

Pipie


Joined: 05/01/2008
Posts: 5499

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 17:20

Thiis is what she was told , not sure what amount of money is now ruled as sufficient . will try and fine out .

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 17:34

Can maybe see the lady not being allowed in to live in TRNC ,many countries make you show how much you have if you are staying for any other reason than holiday.However , this lady is in the situation of having residency given previous ,and now just renewing.

Its a shame ,yet another worry at a time of life when one should be relaxing.

Hope it works out for her as its her home we are talking about.

Keep us posted Pipie if you find out about this limit. I will check TRNC govt site .

Pipie


Joined: 05/01/2008
Posts: 5499

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 17:38

will do girne 29 . Cheers .

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 18:14

Can they just throw her off the island? Where does she go? Throw herself on the mercy of UK Social Services? Who looks after her NC home? Pretty heartless. Another example of expat bashing?

w26kay



Joined: 14/10/2007
Posts: 479

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 23:00

Geoff, I don't know about the pubs, I have certainly seen a few close down in my area, or boards up saying Lease for Sale. The credit crunch (as they are calling it) or the knock on affect from a few negligent lenders in the US is (according to the news today) set to be with us for the next 18 months. The people I really feel for are the elderly and disabled. How on earth are they going to cope with the steep increases in food and fuel prices? I don't know whether you watched a programme I did this week where a pensioner of 70 was forced back into part time employment in ASDA just to make ends meet.



This UK Government have a lot to answer in letting down the most vulnerable members of society with their "sit on the fence" mentality. Get off that fence and DO something, anything, even if it's just to say "goodbye". Good riddance as far as I am concerned, but what next? Who is any better? It's a complete disaster for anyone on a Pension, or limited benefits in the UK. Oh sorry forgot to mention recently the over 80's got an increase in pension - 25 pence per week. Can you buy a stamp with that. No. Insulting. These people fought wars for us and are not being looked after. Heat or Eat? Why should anyone be forced to make that choice?



I fear for this little old lady who has "insufficent income" to remain in TRNC. What is to become of her? What is to become of other little old ladies or men in similar circumstances. There is nothing in the UK for them, because of this Government.



Rant over. Debate open to all........

wynyardman



Joined: 15/12/2007
Posts: 4580

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 23:06

Hi Kay26,



Right to the point! absolutely shameful.



Its a pretty sick situation when a country as wealthy as the UK cannot look after its own

senior citizens, and less fortunate.



I wonder how many elderly are sitting there in dread and fear over how they are going to cope this winter.



wyn

Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 23:08

Interesting Daily Telegraph article today re economic gloom



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/2008/09/06/cnshares106.xml

w26kay



Joined: 14/10/2007
Posts: 479

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 23:43

Hi Wyn, you can call me Kay you know, or "Mam", either will do!



I just hope we can debate this on here. I know its not a TRNC problem, but it is when this lady is involved. She will either stay or come back to the UK.



BTW I know you have not mentioned this, and I apologise to you for bringing it up here when I am addressing your points but can I just say that I am not a VO reject. Sometimes I like coming on here. It would be even better if you could get rid of the Slipper1 person IMHO.

wynyardman



Joined: 15/12/2007
Posts: 4580

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 00:19

Hi Kay,



I do not usually rely on formal titles, but The Lady Wyn, does see things somewhat differently.



I do not consider you a reject from VO site. I have read and enjoyed many of your postings there.



I agree that we seem to have inherited some less than helpful members from that board.



I consider the state of the UK is a legitimate debating point for this site, as many members



appear to be trying to compare day to day living costs, with The TRNC, and I suspect some



may be considering, moving back to the UK and are trying to ascertain the current situation.



My view would be anyone that has been out of the UK for more than a year would hardly



recognise the prices in supermarkets, not to mention utility costs.



I am afraid I blame Gordon Brown. He and he alone imposed a series of stealth taxes and



in so doing has overburdened the system. Add to that the PFI debt we have inherited, and



he has pushed matters to the brink. I accept that there are International forces at play



which are outwith our ability to control, but it is Mr Browm that has left the Country wholly



unprepared and without reserves to cope with a rainy day.



In my opinion he should leave and do so now, and allow someone more able to try to save



the sinking ship.



I am afraid the only man that generates any confidence in me is Vince Cable and he is not



likely to cross the benches, and get voted into the top job.



I personally see David Cameron and Osbourne as of little use in the current situation, other than to impose further green taxes, and God forbid have us all riding bikes.



WE need someone who can restore some balance to our economy, but I cannot see a



suitable candidate, who would be stupid enough to put him/herself forward.



I despair for the plight of the weak and aged in the UK over the coming 2 years.



Just my thoughts, thats all.



wyn

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 00:33

Oh, I wouldn't worry too much about it. End of the Mayan calendar and all that.



You've only got to about 11:30 am on 21/12/12 anyway and then its all over!



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlcPWa6SomE&feature=related



Mind you, you might have got your kocans through by then!



I was thinking of taking the day off..



Lem

w26kay



Joined: 14/10/2007
Posts: 479

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 00:46

So that's sorted then Wyn/Kay/Kay Wyn.



Hmm, no. The only person I object to on here is Slipper1. Can't he/she be moderated? Please?

How offensive is this person?!? He really lets the BB down.



i really don't think Gordon is to blame, you have to look "out of the box" at his predecessor, the man in the middle east now (he and his wife made his millions from legal aid - you and I's tax contributions) to pay for the lifestyle they have now. He just left Gordon to pick up the pieces. Poor Gordon, and actually I really like him. If he had taken over 1/2 way through from the (smiling goblin-gobshite) stop it Kay!!! I really think with Gord's frugality - maybe it would have been better?



Sorry you lost me there - PFI debt. Help?



The reserves or family silver were sold off a long time ago. Gordon had nothing to do with it. When he got there, the cupboard was empty.



I will have to have a look at Vince Cable and let you know what I think.



I despair too for the very same reasons as you.

Kay.

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 01:00

"It's the fundamental tragedy of a man who's wanted a job for so many years and has got it and found out he can't do it"



Paul Merton about Gordon Brown



Lem

wynyardman



Joined: 15/12/2007
Posts: 4580

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 01:01

Lem,



You worry too much! While you are studying The Mayan Callender and Lord Pacals

sarcophogus lid, you will be too late.........(one of my favourite subjects)



Next Wednesday when CERN turn on The Hadron Neuclear Collider, we are all going to dissapear down a black hole, or for the more optomistic, the world is going to be turned into grey mush, over a four year period................Check it out Lem!



Any more Jokes before you enter cyberspace?



wyn

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 01:48

Hi Wyn



Now this Efes thing, there is too much rice water in their brewing!



Its an old trick that we home brewers were taught to get rid of the yeasty taste in home brew years ago.



Efes have gone overboard with it and it makes my teeth itch!



Now, Strongbow............



Lem

w26kay



Joined: 14/10/2007
Posts: 479

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 03:11

Wyn had a look. Twickenham is no-where near you!

I'm lost now but geography was never my strong point.

wynyardman



Joined: 15/12/2007
Posts: 4580

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 09:54

Lem



I note, with interest, your comments on Effes (or is it Efes)



I remain unconvinced by your argument, but I am more than happy to put it to the test, on my upcoming visit!



Now if you survive next Wednesday The Hadron Neuclear Collider,.... then The Mayan Prophesies of 21/12/2012,..... if you listen to Zacharia Sitchen (who has checked his dates) you have a further 60 years to wait for the return of Nibiru...... At that point you should be enslaved by the returning Annukai, and you will be grateful for a glass of Efes, after a hard day in the goldmines!



Personally I am 63 years old(middle aged I am told) but how many 126 year olds do you know?



Cheers,



wyn