orams case

Aga Buyers A G


Joined: 04/10/2007
Posts: 488

Message Posted:
16/09/2008 12:12

Can anyone confirm that there is a judgement due today on the Orams Case ?



SSP

ABAG

xxxxx

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
16/09/2008 12:37

yes ,i have read that. but i'm not sure if it is being decided today and then judgment being refered back again to the uk courts system. when it will be announced is anyones guess. if i here anything i will post asap.

gillken


Joined: 25/05/2008
Posts: 521

Message Posted:
16/09/2008 14:36

I read it to be a quick hearing. Everything has been decided prior to "today", the Orams just needed to turn up to hear the decision, it has been given no longer than an hour.

Can I find this link? No, totally lost it.

cooper


Joined: 23/10/2007
Posts: 3386

Message Posted:
16/09/2008 20:56

Any one heard !

doughnuts40


Joined: 27/07/2008
Posts: 98

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 00:07

Any news on this case?

w26kay



Joined: 14/10/2007
Posts: 479

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 00:14

I doubt whether there will be a decision immediately.



From the website, it was listed today at 9.30am., as follows:-



Hearing C-420/07 Apostolides

Area of Freedom, Security and Justice

Interpretation of Article 10(1) of Protocol No 10 to the Act of Accession of Cyprus and of Articles 22, 34(1) and (2) and 35(1) of Council Regulation (EC) No 44/2001 of 22 December 2000 on jurisdiction and the recognition and enforcement of judgments in civil and commercial matters (OJ 2001 L 12, p. 1) - Suspension of the application of the acquis communautaire in those areas in which the Government does not exercise effective control - Recognition and enforcement by the court of another Member State of a decision given by a Cypriot court sitting in the area of effective control and relating to land situated outside that area



We will all have to wait unfortunately.

Lemtich



Joined: 15/02/2007
Posts: 1487

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 00:23

ASBO's have been handed out to the Oram's by the European Court of Justice today for playing opera music too loudly and wafting the smell of foreign food from barbeques on their patio to the annoyance of their Turkisg Cypriot neighbours.



The secondary charge of building a villa on the land of a former Greek Cypriot owner was dismissed the judges got fed up with this short bloke with 2 days stubble who kept waving his arms about and shouting, "bloody Orams! I make a proper kebab innit?" whilst handing out leaflets offering discount prices from the takeaway cafe across the road.



Lem

w26kay



Joined: 14/10/2007
Posts: 479

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 01:26

Oh Lem - you are just soooo funny. I haven't laughed that much since I saw Eric's press release last week.



Peelerrrrr. AKA Pikey. I don't know and at the moment I don't really care! Stop being so sensible.

PtePike



Joined: 20/05/2008
Posts: 2334

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 02:00

peeler's not me!

Aga Buyers A G


Joined: 04/10/2007
Posts: 488

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 11:51

http://www.cyprus-mail.com:80/news/main.php?id=41442&cat_id=1

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 12:13

“Everybody is looking at the ongoing talks [aimed at finding a solution to the Cyprus problem] in a very positive way,” he said, adding that no one wanted a decision that might negatively affect the outcome of the talks.



Hence, the reason why 'The recommendation of the AG is expected on December 18, after which the panel of international judges will make a final decision'.

w26kay



Joined: 14/10/2007
Posts: 479

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 18:54

“Everybody is looking at the ongoing talks [aimed at finding a solution to the Cyprus problem] in a very positive way,” he said, adding that no one wanted a decision that might negatively affect the outcome of the talks.





Well one of the parties is going to be disappointed at the decision, which will go in one or the others favour. So whatever that may, be the losing party has to live with it and the profound impact that it will have for others on the "losing" side. So IMO this statement was quite ridiculous. There is no doubt that the losing side will feel aggrieved as major adjustments will have to be made to accommodate the decision.

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 19:18

i thought the judges had already looked at it and the ruling was on the 16th sept?

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 20:22

Kay,

If ECJ rules that ROC court decisions wrt land outside the aquis cannot be enforced in other EU countries it will be a great blow to ROC and I will put my money on this outcome. So that will be the end of this saga. However if in the unlikely event the ECJ decides that ROC court decisions of this nature can be enforced in other EU countries, it will be a big triump for for ROC and it will make people think before they buy in TRNC exept for those who sell up everything and settle here. Howeer such a bad outcome is not likely to affect Orams case directly because the judge has already ruled that Orams were not given sufficient time to defend their case in Nicosia. Unless the High Court in UK overturns this decision of fact, the ECJ decision will have no effect on Orams.

What do you think?

ismet

Jolly Tar


Joined: 17/09/2008
Posts: 3

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 21:07

Thanks W25Kay for your posting of the hearings terms of reference of the Court's deliberations this week viz:

Hearing C-420/07 Apostolides



Area of Freedom, Security and Justice



Interpretation of Article 10(1) of Protocol No 10 to the Act of Accession of Cyprus and of Articles 22, 34(1) and (2) and 35(1) of Council Regulation (EC) No 44/2001 of 22 December 2000 on jurisdiction and the recognition and enforcement of judgments in civil and commercial matters (OJ 2001 L 12, p. 1) - Suspension of the application of the acquis communautaire in those areas in which the Government does not exercise effective control - Recognition and enforcement by the court of another Member State of a decision given by a Cypriot court sitting in the area of effective control and relating to land situated outside that area



It is good news that the Court is referring specifically to Protocol 10 in which the Greek Cypriots undertook, as part of getting into the EC in the first place, to renounce and not seek any jurisdiction over the North. This is important as it means that when they took Mr and Mrs Orams to Court in S Cyprus, they were doing so in breach of their acceptance of protocol 10 when they agreed terms to enter the E.C..

This leads on to their attempt to have the case heard in London being invalid, as by the S. Cyprus govt's agreement to protocol 10, they agreed that they would seek no legal jurisdiction over the North.



That is the nub of the case and it is good to see that it is central to the Court's deliberations.

w26kay



Joined: 14/10/2007
Posts: 479

Message Posted:
17/09/2008 22:36

Firestarter, no the hearing was yesterday. It does take sometime for Judges to deliberate on decisions, especially in such a high Court, and on an issue such as the one in hand with the wide ranging implications for either the North or the South. This is why the decision will be handed down later (16th December I believe I read was the date), but don't quote me on that.

fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
18/09/2008 15:27

kay

from what i had been reading it had already been looked at by the judges prior to the 16th sept. it was 16th sept to decide the out come.

i think this has been postponed due to the talks at the moment. as it wouldn't be the best time in light of solution talks.

W25Kay


Joined: 18/09/2008
Posts: 1

Message Posted:
18/09/2008 15:47

Jolly Tar



Re: message 17, it wasn't me - it was w26kay



W25Kay