TRNC wiped off the map

Marvo


Joined: 30/04/2007
Posts: 194

Message Posted:
03/09/2007 15:53

We went to an overseas property exibition at the weekend, just to kill half a day. all the usual places were represented. When we inquired about Cyprus we were shown a portfolio of properties and a map of the island. The north had been completely removed and replaced with the index for the south. We were given the wrong exchange rate to make the properties look a bit more competative, but you still could not get away from the fact that a 3 bed villa without a pool, within walking distance from any beach was going to set you back the best part of £400K.

I think this may be a GC propaganda thing, as they were strongly advertising Turkey, has anyone else seen this.

pilgrim



Joined: 11/05/2007
Posts: 1404

Message Posted:
03/09/2007 18:19

Hi Marvo

Yes when I was setting up my villawebsite I needed a map of TRNC so I could show approx location, so I browsed most of the major holiday company sites and you're quite right the north was just a shape with Turkisk Controlled Area written accross it. I eventually cribbed one from a northern hotel site.

Oknala1


Joined: 11/08/2007
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
03/09/2007 23:08

Can't remember which EEC publication it was, but there was a map of the United Kingdom on the front, with the whole of Wales missing.....we Welsh were a bit upset at first, then cheered up as we realised this might mean no more tax demans, no more EEC rules and regulations - the possibilities were endless . However it was picked up by the BBC etc and soon withdrawn so we are still under the lunatic regime of the EEC.

Oknala1


Joined: 11/08/2007
Posts: 14

Message Posted:
03/09/2007 23:11

As an afterthought, I use this map http://www.kypros.com/Cyprus/maps/Cyprus_map.JPG



Although it means a bit of sticky tape technology required when you print it off.

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
06/09/2007 12:18

Hi all,



You are right- it sounds like the Gs just cant do enough to try and banish TRNC from everything- just proves what their mentality is!!



We are MUCH BETTER OFF without them- Hope the island dont re-unite as this will become NCs worst nightmare and for all who have lived and purchased there!!



Also did you know that people that Gs hate more than anyone even the Ts are actually BRITISH PEOPLE!!



Thats nice to know especially as 300,000+ Gs live in the UK!!!



See ya D

namus


Joined: 23/06/2007
Posts: 74

Message Posted:
06/09/2007 13:47

Davidoff - the reality is that the majority of Cypriots (irrespective of T or G) want reunification and TCs realise that future opportunities in an unrecognised, poor country are limited.



Why do you think GCs hate Brits? Only the ones building on their land surely.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
06/09/2007 14:33

namus sorry to point out you are wrong 80% of greek cypriots dont wont reunification because the majority of greeks who have got houses in the south dont belong to them for example my mums side of the family lived in skella pre 74 which is now larnaca they have no rights to reclaim their houses back look at the vote they had last year the turkish cypriots only want it so it can give them some sort of opportunities via it be work most turkish cypriots i know go and work on the greek side like you said thou there is no opportunity if a country is not recoognised with only Turkey funding them and the u.s and britain secretly funding them. also one of reasons the greeks dont like the british is because the british government support Turkey and the Turkish Cypriots in unification and equal rights (and also wherever the british goes they always mess the country up i.e france-spain) L.O.L

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
06/09/2007 15:55

Hi davidoff



Where did you get your info about GC's disliking Brits?



In May of this year 500,000 Brits entered southern Cyprus for a holiday. This generated over 1 million pounds for their economy.

I understand 70,000 brits live in the south, spending their savings and pensions. Wouldn't have thought it a wise move to candidly publicise a disliking for the British.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
06/09/2007 16:18

even if the greek cypriots did not like the brits they would not come out publically and say that because like what ilovecyprus has just said there is a whole load of brits living in the south side of cyprus and also if you go to london especially north london there is a major greek cypriot population so they would not shoot themselves in the foot and say these kind of things even if they do dislike the british

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
06/09/2007 18:01

Growing up in North London I can confirm that both the GC and TC have large communities in the area. Most of the elder ones left the Island to get away from the troubles from 1974 and before then and settled in London as refugees.

At school and later I befriended Cypriot kids from both communities and met parents that had left the country. I even remenber Bishop Makarios visiting the Greek Orthodox church in Camden Town. (my age witheld) Go to see Arsenal play and you will see both sides of Cyprus cheering them on! The GC government and mainland seem to be more stubborn in moving things on, but the real people on both sides just want to get on with eachother and have a good quality of life.

Now that the south have realised the riches in developement of land and the worth of what is in the north they are not content and want more of it. It is sad to me that references are always made that the GC have come off worse. Plenty of TC lost land that I feel will never be returned. Never an easy solution, but dialogue between both parties is the only way forward. I work with a lovely GC girl(London Born) and she has just gone t o Paphos to see her elders with her British/ GC family. She knows that we have the intention of moving to the island and settling in the future and she has no problems with it. Her family have lots of British ex pats as friends.



A long road ahead, but worth the walk.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
06/09/2007 20:41

I don't know where I got the figure of a million from. It is substantially more than that

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 00:57

Hi all,



Like you have all mentioned- Even if they did dislike brits then they will not openly admit to that as they would have too much at stake and too lose if they were to voice their feelings towards us!!!



I mean brits would stop buying property ,investing in cyprus and stop holidaying there ITS AS SIMPLE AS THAT!!

CYPRUS HEAVILY RELY ON THAT TO BOOST THEIR ECONOMY AND WITHOUT THAT WHERE WOULD THEY BE NOW????

Suffering the same as in the north no doubt!!



Generally I dont have a real issue with either south,north,turks or greek-cyps - But you are right thatt all just want to get on with life and prosper but so far it has only been proven by the south that they WILL NEVER LET THINGS GO AND TRY TO MOVE ON !! So far only the north has shown willingness to move on and try to live harmoniously!!



South will never negotiate as they still want to have the upper hand in everything and will never give in until they HAVE IT ALL!!



Just remeber that greece started this mess in the first place by sending in a greek coupe army to remove the Tcs in an attempt to unite geece and cyprus as one- FOR THEMSELVES!!!



See ya D



P.S- Dont like getting into these political and moral debates but Ive really had enough of listening to the constant badgering of Turks and NC from the greeks- People are wearing very thin of their constant bullish, bullying and slandering techniques!!

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 11:47

i must say i am surprised by your comments davidoff & tiggy i have rarley met people from britain that know the full story of the cyprus situation because in england all you hear is the greek cypriot story how they lost their houses and land and family well sorry to hear that but thats what happens in war.

you dont hear the stories about the greeks trying to start enois by ethnic cleansing for example all my family losing their homes and land the women fleeing for their lives in fear that they will be raped the men including boys that were mostly farmers fighting in the villages to protect their land against the greek army !!!! but still with all this in mind the turkish side of cyprus still want peace in unification.

so all you single one track uneducated people out their read and listen to people like tiggy and davidoff at least these people have got a brain of their own and asked questions and made a choice of their own and not the bulls..t!!! propaganda that the media provide

p.s dont get me wrong i have no malice towards greeks or greek cypriots in fact where i was raised in palmers green north london i know and have quite a few friends that are greek cypriots.

so still with this problem i dont think or it will take a long long time for the cyprus situation to be resolved with people still dwelling on the past but we can still hope god willing!!!!

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 14:41

Hi all,



ukturk- cheers for the comments much appreciated!



Before I ventured in to the NC market I studied the issues in depth and spent months googling and reading articles etc about what exactly happened and you are right!!



ALL PEOPLE EVER HEAR IS THE Gs side OF THE STORY WHICH IS ACTUALLY UNFAIR-Like people say two sides to every story -but because ths south has much more media power than the north then this is why people never get a chance to here the norths story of events!!



And in fact you can not blame the turks from going into cyprus to protect their people in the first because as far as I am aware turkey pleaded endlessly with the usa and england to go in to protect the turk-cyps against the greek army but they declined on half a dozen occasions!

And the only reason the turks invaded was to protect their people as the usa and brits did nothing and turkey couldnt just sit and watch their people being raped, tortured and murdered!!



SO PLEASE PEOPLE READ SOME ARTICLES DO SOME RESEARCH AND ENSURE YOU HAVE THE FULL VERSION FIRST-THEN YOU ARE IN A POSITION TO MAKE UP YOUR OWN MIND ON THE MORAL ISSUES OF WHAT ECTUALLY HAPPENED??



I also too always had the impression that turkey were completely wrong and immoral in what they did but that was til I knew the real story!!



See ya D

Marvo


Joined: 30/04/2007
Posts: 194

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 15:26

When I started this thread I wasn't expecting it to go down this road nor expecting this response. I must admit my interpretation of events were clouded as when Turkey invaded my neighbours were in Famagusta and we saw them on the news running along the beach with their suit cases in hand to be evacuated from the 'terible Turkish invaders'.

You are absolutely right Davidoff, if you look back, even in our lifetime the UK, USA and NATO have stood back and in some cases watched as thousands have been brutally killed in conflicts around the globe, and it's still going on.

I believe in hindsight Turkey should be gived the credit they rightly deserve for going it to protect there own people.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 17:21

hi there

you see britain have always had an intrest in cyprus ever since after the first world war when the ottoman empire was dismantled and cyprus became one of her colonies following the treaty of lausanne in 1925. then in 1960 cyprus gained independence and the treaty of zurich was signed which was supposed to protect the right of the minority turkish cypriots with britain turkey and greece being the guarantors. then in 1963 greece tried to change the constitution in favour of the greek cypriots e.g disarming the turkish cypriot police and forming a national greek cypriot guard, which resulted in civil war the u.n sent troops in and divided the two communties in the green line to create some sort of peace. Then in 1974 the greeks with the help of the greek national guard attempted a military coup to achive enosis which in result on the 20th of july of the same year with much consultation with britain they decided to intervine to help the turkish cypriot people from being killed-raped and ethnic cleansed this was legal on turkeys behalf after they signed the treaty of zurich (anyone can look on the internet at this treaty

so in a nutshell this is what happened so again all the media propaganda which says turkey invaded cyprus is BULLS..T!!! hope this clears things up for people who only know one side of a story!!!!

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 17:31

again it is a breath of fresh air to read peoples posts i.e marvo - davidoff - tiggy who are not 100% correct (are any of us 100% right all the time) but at least they have read and listened and not kept their eyes and ears shut to the greek propaganda (i salute you all) lets face it whoever is cypriot we all lost family - homes - land lets try and get over it and build a cyprus in peace without the BULL!!!!!!

lovelife


Joined: 07/07/2007
Posts: 231

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 17:38

A point of interest, I read Frank and Joans adventures in N Cyprus and read his daily diary. (available via this website)

Frank has received an email informing that the BBC may make a program regarding property/agent problems, however Frank had drafted an email in response suggesting that there is another side of the story of the troubles and should be heard, as it is the GC side and their view of events that is always dominant in peoples minds.

If enough people contact the BBC (email address is in Franks diary dated 23rd August) then perhaps some thing may come of it to address this one sided story, no harm in trying.

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 19:45

Hi all,



thanx again ukturk for the praise!!



But yes the just of it is that all have lost in many ways both have lost property,land, businesses friends and family along the way!!



BUT the reason I say dont re-unite in my personal opinion is that greece has always openly tried to take all! UNite cyprus with greece to have for their own, they will not negotiate peace and resolve issues, they still attempt to use every trick in the book to stop NC from even trying to breathe and even more so now they are in the EU!!



Our biggest mistake was to alow south into the EU until final settlements were made as now they feel they can use the power of the EU behind them to vindicate the illegal issues surrounding NC!



Greece and cyprus use the powers of the EU against NC every step of the way- banning football games, stopping direct trade and flights etc!!



QUITE FRANKLY THEY ARE VERY CHILDISH AND NEED TO GROW UP AND TAKE RESPOSIBILITY FOR THEIR ACTIONS AND ACCEPT THAT THEY HAD A HUGE PART TO PLAY IN THIS MESS AND STOP BLAMING EVERYONE BUT THEMSELVES!!! ALL A SMOKE SCREEN DONT YOU THINK?? cOVER UP THEIR TRACKS??



NC will prosper and the tides will change so with a little more EU and UN support Im sure all will be fine in the future- Direct flights would also be MUSIC TO MY EARS!!



See ya D

dy1259


Joined: 10/08/2007
Posts: 357

Message Posted:
07/09/2007 21:06

To Davidoff and UkTurk excellent posts. One further point I'd like to add: The Turkish military had to remain in N Cyprus in order to continue protecting the TCs and they should never leave even after partition or (hopefully not) renunification. Greece and I think the GCs state that Turkey was right to intervene/'invade' in 1974 but their issue now is that the military remained and should not be in Cyprus. I would never, ever trust the GCs, therefore, I repeat the Turkish military must remain.



Lovelife: I hope posters write to the BBC protesting against the bias the programme will no doubt contain against the TRNC. The fact that the BBC are making such a programme in the first place is evidence supporting the GCypriot point of view and propaganda.

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 00:23

Hi all,



I know someone should protest- I mean whenever the tcs get a little attention the gs protest against them for example the latest hotel property expo that they protested saying that property in NC is illegal!!



Just proves who are the calmer and more rashional ones!

This cant go on forever and I would be patient and not retaliate for now- pure and simply because I believe that Gs are starting to create bad images for themselves and infact alot of smart people are starting to realise the deeper issues in all this and are able to make up their own minds based on actions at the end of the day -all things said and done!!



Did I hear right that the usa have said that regarding the outcome of the latest negotiations that if cyprus Gs wont negotiate and play silly games again then the USA have said they will still go ahead and support NC ????



Shame brit cant say that too!!



See ya D

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 00:25

thank you dy1259 have we not spoken somewhere before L.O.L

maybe im being selfish but im speaking from my heart I DONT want unification for the pure reason i dont really trust the greeks!!!! im not worried about the greek cypriots because they are just puppets to greece.

In one of the issues the greek cypriots wanted from turkish cypriots was they wanted karpaz and surrounding waters back in greek power!!!

Now think if turkey and north cyprus agree to this, turkey and north cyprus will be open to attack from the far north of cyprus and the far south of turkey if this is not a unfaithfull motif i dont know what is!!!!

Plus we will never get support from the e.u they will always side with greece and south cyprus (another fact turkey will never get e.u membership) because of the pure fact the e.u is a pure christian club i know dy1259 you mite not agree with me on this bit but they still think turkey is a muslim country!!

(ohh no!!! we cant have them muslims join our club!!!!)

and in turn this boils down to new world order their famous saying Divide and Rule and if you dont belive in new world order and world peace we will invade and kill you or let you kill each other coming from the biggest puppet of them all the u.s and their lap dog u.k.

We are in a better and stonger postion than most people think because all turkish waters around turkey and north cyprus hold the back door key to all of the middle east and all the black gold (oil) and too keep an eye on them all aswell (u.s and u.k want that BAD) anyway im getting quite deep here so i will stop. Sorry for waffling!!!!

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 00:49

davidoff you are right about the example of the holiday expo they complained,

also another unbelivable story my friend who works for c.t.a who operate holidays with kthy told me i think last year the north cyprus tourist board had loads of flyers - bus stop adverts and underground station adverts in and around london had to be taken down because the greek cypriot government complained that north cyprus was unreconised!!!!

Whats that all about then!!!!!!!!!

dy1259


Joined: 10/08/2007
Posts: 357

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 00:54

UkTurk I absolutely do not agree with reunificaiton-it would, I agree, be a death sentence for TCs. Keep Cyprus partitioned and recognition for the TRNC is the next positive step. Long live the TRNC.

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 11:18

Hi guys,



SEEMS TO ME LIKE WE ARE ALL ON THE SAME WAVE LENGTH HERE- ukturk you took the words and thoughts right out of my mouth!!



DONT RE-UNITE as the greeks cant be trusted there will never be settlement and Tcs will never be treated fairly thats obviously clear!



TURKEY are in an extremely powerful position right now like you said EU membership for turkey they dont really care either way it not the be all and end all for them- theyll do just fine anyway with or without it!!



BUT the rest of THE EU need them and are desperate to get them on board as they have the largest army in europe a gateway to asia and they need there natural resources to supply the EU as supplies are running out and turkey are sitting vertually on a gold mine!!



RECENT news articles still state that TURKEY SUPPORTS NC REGARDLESS AND WILL NOT ENTER INTO THE EU WITHOUT NORTH CYPRUS AND UNTIL FAIR NEGOTIATIONS HAVE BEEN MADE AND THE NORTH AND ITS PEOPLE RECOGNISED!! TURKEY WILL NOT ABANDON ITS PEOPLE AND PLACE IN CYPRUS!!!! And that came from turk Prime minister!! WELL DONE!!! Keep up the good work!!

Like Ive said before EU need turkey alot more than turkey need tne EU- So they can just sit and wait and negotiate!

Eu are impatient and need them onboard as soon as possible- whereas turk can afford to just sit and wait until they get what they want!!



I mean personally by the sounds of it turkey will be much more valuable than many other EU (Gs) country!!



See ya D



P.S-PATIENCE IS A VERTUE MY FRIEND!!!

ttoli


Joined: 24/03/2007
Posts: 1172

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 15:34

ukturk

The GC high commision complained about the advertising to Ken Livingstone, it was removed but a court overturned his decision.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 15:59

hi ttoli

that might be the case but it still shows the menatality of the gc high commision dont it!!!! i dont know if they put back the adverts because i have not lived in london in over 8 years im only going on what my friend told me last year

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 16:02

The earths tectonic plates are constantly shifting and moving, slowly but subtely changing the geographical landscape. Eventually catastrophic seismic shifts take place which can make the landscape unrecognisable.



The tectonic plates of Belgium have been ebbing and flowing for nearly the last 200 years and are about to rupture. It is hard to believe, that Belgium who is at the very heart of the EU, is moving towards separating and becoming two countries. Many political commentators are now saying this is the only way forward. The North will be made up of Flemish speakers and the south made up of French and German speakers.

The country has long been united by the Royal family but this love affair is waning, and now the two sides are finding it hard to find a political solution.

If the divorce happens, it is not likley to be as acrimonious as the divorce between the North and South of Cyprus, but with any divorce, like the shifting of the tectonic plates there is normally no turning back. In fact how can you return the landscape to how it once was. Is it not impossible.

For me, the North and South divorced many years ago, but even though they are divorced and separated, unlikley to be united, they can still be friends and trade with each other peacefully for many years to come, but doing so from different sides of the island.

The only part of the divorce that needs to be reconciled is the settlement, the distribution of wealth. This of course the land issue. Once the GC's claim their compensation from the property commission then the two countries can live as hospitable neighbours.



So if the EU can recognise Belgium as two countries, which it sounds like they would do, it is only a matter of time before they recognise the TRNC. It is the only way that they can integrate the nation in to the whole.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 16:40

im sorry to say i lovecyprus you are sadly mistaken if you think the greek cypriot people will ever be friends and trade with the turkish cypriot people after a messy and bitter and not forgeting bloody divorce!!!! and all you hear from the greek side is want want want, moaning and complaining and why can only the g.c claim for lost land not meaning to be rude have you not seen or understood that the turkish cypriots lost houses and land too, so why is it as you say gc can claim for lost land then everything will be ok and we can live as friends i say NOT BLOODY LİKLEY!!!!!

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
08/09/2007 17:54

Hi all,



I love cyprus that was a great speech and dictation and I believe you are right- but also ukturk you are also right!!



The divorce has happen and should remain and that a settlement needs to be reached and everyone who have lost be it south and north compensated and then the cases closed so all can get on with life!

But Gs wont let this happen- they are going for all and will not rest until they have their OWN WAY!

The cyp and GC government are actually stopping cyps and GCs from caiming from the commission in and attept of stating its still illegal and you can not do this and any found doing this will be prosecuted in CYPRUS!!!



Yet again another classic case of not allowing people to move on, seek compensation and get on with life!

They are saying that by using the property commision you are comitting a illegal offence and breaching the ROC law!



ROC yet again reject any kind of suggestions or solutions for the issues- they are trying to bide time an edemand back land and compensation for their people only!



TC s have too approached the ROC for land returned or compensation in return and they have rejected this too!!



THEY ARE BITING OFF MORE THAN THEY CAN CHEW- AND WILL SOON GET BITEN ON THE A**E BY SOMEONE ALOT BIGGER THAN THEM!!

WAIT AND SEE!!!



See ya D

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
09/09/2007 13:50

Hi ukturk



You are right ukturk it is/was a bloody divorce (bit of an understatement), and there has been lots of hostility, and there continues to be much 'bad blood'. There may yet be many many years yet of hostility between the two sides to come. For this reason I believe it is right for the Turkish army to hold it's ground in Cyprus to keep the peace.

Many divorcees never see their partners again but as neighbours it may be more useful for cypriots to eventully find ways to work and live together. That doesn't mean they will and at this present time this seems a million miles away.

Of course, I cannot predict the future, as the future is being created and is unfolding in the moment. It is up to the cypriots to choose their path and destiny.

I think though there are two types of people. Those on both sides who want to perpertuate the hostility and those who want to work towards an amicable solution. (of course there are shades of gray in between)



ps you are right the TC's also have land issues in the south. Apologies for not mentioning this.

pps I may not have made it clear but I also think that the two sides should be recognised as two separate countries.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
09/09/2007 15:42

hi ilovecyprus

i hope and wish to something will be resolved but thats coming from one person which dont count for nothing. like i have said in previous posts the when they had the vote the turkish cypriots voted yes to some sort of solution no matter what backlash that intailed i.e(given more rights to the greek cypriots) but still the greek side said NO!!!. i think you are right the only solution is for both sides to be recognised as seperate countries let everyone get compensated for their losses (both sides of cyprus) then get on with their lifes and like in a bitter divorce they dont have to talk to each other ever again!!!

p.s dont get me wrong im not a right wing turk and i hate all greeks (i just dont bloody trust them)

p.p.s This topic has been very informative in the respect of hearing the views from turkish cypriots and english people now all we need is a few greek cypriots to post their views on what they think!!!! im going to look for some on any south cyprus forums and invite them to discuss their views on this topic!!!

i bet you i dont get any response or will get rude responses!!!

dy1259


Joined: 10/08/2007
Posts: 357

Message Posted:
09/09/2007 16:28

It is so refreshing to read posts from people (who seem to be in the majority) who agree that Cyprus should remain partitioned and officially become two separate countries. It is the best way forward for everybody-Turkish and Greek Cypriots.

Dusterbruce


Joined: 03/08/2007
Posts: 1125

Message Posted:
09/09/2007 19:52

Lets face it, the 33 years since 1974 has been the longest period of peace in the island's recent history.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
09/09/2007 19:58

It's really great to have the views of the Turkish Cypriot people on this site. ukturk - let us know how you get on with the south Cyprus forums

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
09/09/2007 20:43

Hi all,



I think thats yet again if you invite the GCs or Gs onto this forum it will get nasty and strike up an aggressive debate!



I think the only fair solution for all in cyprus is compensate ALLwho have lost and start fresh but keep north and south seperate and for north to be recongnised also!



At the end of the day there are more than just cypriots involved here now as there are TCs,GCs, cypriots, Gs, Turks and the large english presence on the island- so to be fair to all this is the best solution!!



From a moral issue side of things I do not agree with the settlers and soldiers receiving land and property as way of payment for there work and support in the divide crisisand have remained there ever since- but yet again some had no choice given the circumstances- and without them settling and helping defend their people lots more blood would have been shed!



Catch 22 situation isnt it?



See ya D

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
10/09/2007 16:03

hi there all

i have done much research over the weekend tried to get involed in some south cyprus forums i put up a post invitting greek cypriot people to have a debate on this post i got one response telling me to f..k off their forum and go back to the north cyprus forums i read some of their posts i could not belive what they were writing and this is their youths speaking out, their interpration was so misinformed and this is what they are getting told!!!

anyway i found this video made by a greek cypriot man who used to be a right wing greek who hated the turks thru propaganda but then he done some research and learned the truth!!!! now he is wanted by the greeks and has a bounty on his head!!! watch this video guys and you will get to hear what he has to say it is made in greek but has english subtitles trust me YOU Wİll BE SHOCKED happy viewing

video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-7695688617775364591&q=voice+of+blood&total=893&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
10/09/2007 20:16

Hi ukturk,



Really SAD MADE ME CRY!!



How they tried to say that the mass grave was GCs bodies -when in fact it was TCs women, babies and elderly that they tortured, raped and murdered!!



They tricked the children and women into letting them go back to their villages saying they would be safe and ok but in fact they let them go so they could do this to them and they only held the men caaptive so they could use them as barganing tools for when the turks came!!!



They have no moral I mean to kill and dimember a 16 day old baby-They are pure evil and BARBARIC- Who does this to a small defenceless baby!!!



Also I read an article yesterday and learned some more about what has happened!!!



That papdoplous- made open statements saying even before the invasion "IF THE TURKS LAND WE WILL KILL THEM ALL- WE WILL EXTERMINATE THE TURKS"

And they allow this man to run ROC- How twisted and immoral is that!!!



Found out that also the reason this outbreak started was because popadopous would not allow TCs equal rights and wanted rid of them!

pAPADOPOLOUS HAS REFUSED SETTLEMENTS AND NEGOTIATIONS ON 7 DIFFERENT OCCASIONS!

The main reason for this is that he does not want to allow TcS THEIR BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS AND SAYS THAT THEY ARE ONLY A MINORITY AND SHOULD ONLY HAVE MINORITY RIGHTS!!



JUST PROVES THAT HE IS RACIST AND DISCRIMINATES THE TCS AND DO NOT CONSIDER THEM EQUAL REGARDLESS!!



I mean could you imagine if any other leader around the world said and did this openly- there would be uproar and he shouldnt be in leadership[ position- he should be striped of him title and banished as far as Im concerned!!



TRNC To be internationally recognised and independant is the ONLY SOLUTION to a peaceful and harmonious future where all are equall!!



See ya D

dy1259


Joined: 10/08/2007
Posts: 357

Message Posted:
10/09/2007 20:49

LONG LIVE THE TRNC!

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
10/09/2007 23:59

hi davidoff

i told you it was shocking!!! and the thing is no one can say that was turkish propaganda because it is directly coming from a greek cypriot who was involved in the war (ive found loads of these videos but i dont want dwell on this, just show people so they can learn like i did!!!) also i got an answer to your question about direct flights would be a step forward link below

http://www.number-10.gov.uk/output/Page11602.asp

have a read!!! see how the u.k government dont want to push it because of some chicago convention (yet again the u.s's lap dog)

Tiggy


Joined: 25/07/2007
Posts: 1994

Message Posted:
11/09/2007 03:25

Hello all,

It seems as if the GC propaganda has affected a lot of it's citizens. opening this forum up to the south I feel would bring is some real good and twisted views. Ukturk is a brave person for attempting to try and reason with the people and try and open their eyes to what rally happened and their is a way forward, he proved he was prepared to listen and debate.



The TC people were brave in voting Yes to accept a solution and have been quiet open in debates. If the other side are reluctant in treating all people as equals then it may be better if NC remains a seperate country. You have a beautiful part of the world and the people here will prosper. Good luck.

ps. Im working on nights this week!