bizonal bicommunal federation

jimbo


Joined: 12/07/2007
Posts: 150

Message Posted:
27/10/2008 21:13

I hear all this talk of a bizonal bicommunal federation for cyprus , as i am politicaly niave what exactly is a bizonal bicommunal federation, is there another country that runs under this system and is this what the politicians are hoping to achieve

PtePike



Joined: 20/05/2008
Posts: 2334

Message Posted:
27/10/2008 23:36

The planned bizonal, bicommunal federation is one country with an international personality (Cyprus) comprising two states, one southern Greek, one northern Turkish, which administer themselves on day to day issues (pretty much the same as now) but come together for the macro stuff. Belgium is one European example of a BBF.

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
27/10/2008 23:42

If Cyprus becomes like Belgium even the Greek Cypriots will leave!



Belgium, a country so lacking in identity that Stella Artois adverts pretend it's French.... Jean de Florette stylie



This is a joke BTW....

biglugs


Joined: 02/10/2008
Posts: 157

Message Posted:
28/10/2008 00:06

i think you will find this exists at present in the UK,the island of Ireland and this is what i think will happen over here in Cyprus.Its working there so why not here?

jimbo


Joined: 12/07/2007
Posts: 150

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 15:19

do both sides ,ie gc and tc agree that this is the way forward or is it being proposed by one side

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 15:34

Hi Jimbo



I think there is agreement on BBF. One of the sticking points for the TC's, is that they want the assurance of political equality, plus they are not prepared to give up Turkeys guarantorship over the island. This has been described as a red line issue for the TC's. The GC's say that any modern state, being in the EU should not need guarantorship. They maintain that the islands troubles all stem from this guarantorship and should therefore be removed.



ps Belgium for some time now does not have an elected government - To my knowledge that is

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 15:37

It is hoped that negotiations between the two sides be completed by next June, in time for the European Parliament elections. Apparently, before this event the Turkish Cypriots have their own general election. Does anyone know the date of this event?



I guess if Talat gets reelected it would indicate that the TC's favour a settlement. If Talat loses then what happens to the Cyprus negotiations?

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 22:29

belgium:

those in the know fear it is in danger of splitting in two



switzerland:

is decentralised and very rich and rather untypical



india: was partitioned and a million died



pakistan: a unitary state but the eastern part broke away



uk: devolution yes please, the provinces grabbing freedom, no thanks



cyprus: bizonalism, bicommunalism, federation etc etc etc:



these are as noble ideals as democracy, freedom and unity

in practice of course worth struggling to attain but the road is long

since both have a good pedigree as victims, therefore both sides' demands

probably cannot realistically be reconciled this side of the thirtieth century...

but I live in hope



andre

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 22:31

good post andre

guinness


Joined: 10/03/2008
Posts: 224

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 22:51

A good post conflict example is Bosnia & Herzegovina. 2 separate entities (plus a small third not often talked about called Brcko) with separate administrations and a rotating presidency. All this is backed up by the UN Office of the High Representative - until a year ago ably administered by Paddy Ashdown. An office that has the authority to fire any member of either government - one day Paddy fired 32 from one administration. So they have to be good boys.



Its a solution that works, although the plan is that one day it will return to one government. There are also no internal borders and a cross border police force and joint army.



If Cyprus goes this way it will be a good workable medium term solution.



cheers

guin

no1doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 22:58

PP. Can you see a BBF working?

PtePike



Joined: 20/05/2008
Posts: 2334

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 23:29

Msg 10 good comparison.



Msg 11 yes, easily.

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
29/10/2008 23:52

re msg 12 commenting on mesg 11



"yes, easily"



how very very sad this statement is patently untrue...



'scuse me I have to go out in the snow to get a box of kleenex



thus branding me a non-resident and perhaps ignorant of cyprus



but I do recognise posturing when it rears up



andre

PtePike



Joined: 20/05/2008
Posts: 2334

Message Posted:
30/10/2008 01:05

andre msg 13,



Hope you managed to reach for the Kleenex in time. ;-)

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
30/10/2008 06:57

Andre,



Well spotted... it gets easier too...

BillyB


Joined: 19/05/2008
Posts: 436

Message Posted:
30/10/2008 08:31

What about the Romans?

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
30/10/2008 10:14

msge 11



Hi Bill



Personally, I think a BBF is achievable under certain circumstances and conditions, however for anyone to say it is very easy, they must have a scant understanding of human nature, likely to be very stupid and possibly even dangerous in the way they think.

aweverard


Joined: 13/07/2008
Posts: 54

Message Posted:
30/10/2008 11:53

Msge 17



If it were easy it would have been done by now.



Not solution is likely until Turkey is ready to join the EU or it has a government structure that will not allow a GC veto if Turkey's EU bid.



This assumes that Turkey will still want to join the EU in 10-15 years.