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Unwanted Dogs not just a TRNC problem

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PhilUK


Joined: 31/03/2010
Posts: 236

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 12:33

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Message 1 of 21 in Discussion

Article in today's daily Telegraph, very sad:-



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/family/pets/8739409/Financial-squeeze-sees-345-dogs-abandoned-every-day.html



fosterscan


Joined: 27/02/2010
Posts: 541

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 15:36

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Message 2 of 21 in Discussion

On the bright side they are picked up in the uk not left to roam the streets and fend for themselves.



Visitor


Joined: 19/08/2010
Posts: 492

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 18:57

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Message 3 of 21 in Discussion

Oh well that's OK then! The UK is a big state difficult to compare with the TRNC.



fosterscan


Joined: 27/02/2010
Posts: 541

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 19:15

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Message 4 of 21 in Discussion

it should be easier to sort out in a smaller state, the problem is not the dumping its the policy of releaseing them back on the streets thats the problem. If KAR were aloud to keep them for 14 days then put them to sleep if not clamed or rehomed the problem would disapear in months.As they are not aloud the problem will last for years.



Visitor


Joined: 19/08/2010
Posts: 492

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 19:25

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Message 5 of 21 in Discussion

Well it would also help if people stopped dumping there unwanted pets.



MsGarnet


Joined: 04/01/2009
Posts: 989

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 19:28

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Message 6 of 21 in Discussion

TOTALLY agree with fosterscan - I would never give to KAR for a few reasons, the paramount one being to take an animal in, de-tick/de-flea it, give it food and water and shelter and allow it to feel it is safe at last, to then put it back on the street is the biggest 'mind'f'''k' one can imagine (I cannot think of a stronger expression to get over how I feel - it is after all, only a word - but powerful in this context). Dogs, like many animals, have real and strong emotions and feelings - it is so cruel, it leaves one breathless to think about it, and to me - negates any good carried out before the deed. A tranche of the money given to KAR, to my mind, should be spent on getting the Government to agree to a policy of euthanasia, and at the upcoming AGM, if I was there, the first thing I would ask, is proof of how and in what way, KAR is asking (continually-ongoing) the Government to introduce such a policy. As 'animal lovers' they would want a time limit to re-home, then euthanasia



Visitor


Joined: 19/08/2010
Posts: 492

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 20:47

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Message 7 of 21 in Discussion

You need to get at the core of the problem. Euthanasia may be a short term solution but in the long term it doesn't solve the problem which is human owners of these pets. I would fine those who abandon dogs or cats, introduce licensing. The GCYs have had similar debates recently.



http://www.cyprus-mail.com/animal-welfare/massive-increase-abandoned-dogs/20110812#comments



Tango1


Joined: 19/02/2011
Posts: 1151

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 21:37

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Message 8 of 21 in Discussion

Spaying and neutering pets is the answer, but it's a "macho" thing here not to neuter. One TC said to me "cut my baby's balls off? That would be like cutting mine off" The temptation was very great I can assure you!!



fosterscan


Joined: 27/02/2010
Posts: 541

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 21:57

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Message 9 of 21 in Discussion

i agree the problem is the human owners but you need to get on top of the situation first. There are too many strays roaming the streets and in Kar.When the numbers are down to a manageable level more could be spent on education.



Visitor


Joined: 19/08/2010
Posts: 492

Message Posted:
04/09/2011 23:00

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Message 10 of 21 in Discussion

Its not just TCYs to blame. The head of PAWS in ROC said' that despite popular belief, it was not all local people who were to blame for the practice of abandoning dogs.



She said: I have a great grievance against the British dumping dogs. Over the last two years weve had the problem of British leaving the island and just leaving their dogs without finding homes for them. Some have even been left locked in houses and some people have had to break in to let them out I want to be fair about this. The British have a lot to answer for as well. Im sorry to say.



BizziLizzi


Joined: 02/08/2011
Posts: 855

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 00:55

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Message 11 of 21 in Discussion

Actually there IS Licencing! Legally all dogs must be licenced. You pay approx 12 TL to the Belediye (I think it varies acording to area ) and are given a piece of paper and a round disc with a number for the dog's collar.



Unfortunately however is is not enforced and therefore only the conscientious and resposible owners register their dogs.



There HAVE been instances of the Police shooting dogs - usually when they form a pack of large dogs and endanger humans - if the dog has a disc it indicates it is owned and should not be shot!



To my mind it is worth doing - anyone seeing the dog should know immediately that it is not a stray but there is a caring and resposible owner around - and we all know it takes only a split second's inattention by the most careful owner for a dog to slip out and go walkabout.



Incidentally I though KAR DID neuter animals before putting them back on the streets?



Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 06:13

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Message 12 of 21 in Discussion

"a pack of large dogs and endanger humans"

Is there any evidence to back this up? Never heard of dogs attacking humans here. Just interested to know the facts.

I also don't know why it is that we believe that dogs are exclusively domesticated pets. Why can't dogs live in the wild, surely that's their natural state. We might not like to see them but that's another matter. Some of the dogs seem to live the life of Old Reilly!

As for Brits leaving... maybe that's because they are being made so welcome by Cypriots north and south? Just a thought.... If you shatter somebody's dream they are likely to leave.



snd1966


Joined: 10/06/2009
Posts: 353

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 06:19

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Message 13 of 21 in Discussion

Education and a government scheme for people to have their animals neutered are probably the first step. After seeing several male dogs (7) this weekend hanging around a house where every year without fail the bitch has a litter generally 2 is the maximum so I assume the owners do reduce the litter at birth. Unfortunately a small part of me understands why the male dogs had shoe laces and were tottering, its cheap and solves the immediate problem but maybe education and a subsidy to spraying their bitch might of saved these dogs lives especially if their owners had castrated them. If your male dog has been missing since Saturday, remember they can smell a bitch on heat for miles this could be why he hasnt returned home. Yes before anyone says anything I am a coward drove passed looking straight ahead, as I do not need to get involved with local ways I strongly disagree with.



snd1966


Joined: 10/06/2009
Posts: 353

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 06:26

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Message 14 of 21 in Discussion

Forgot to add the subsidy would be abused, as it seems to be human nature not to pay for something that one does not financially gain from. Maybe the government could encourage a fund for people to donate to let the not so well off people neuter their animals.



blade


Joined: 19/06/2010
Posts: 1286

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 09:49

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Message 15 of 21 in Discussion

My thoughts on the issue are that all dogs that are strays should be rounded up. They should be taken to KAR and assest by a person qualified to judge as to their fitness of being rehomed.

Those fit for the purposed should be found new homes, those with issues should be put to sleep kindly.



If you bring a dog here or take one on, take it with you when you leave. Would you live a child behind?



Never take a dog on if you can't afford to care for it properly.



BoTanica


Joined: 22/12/2009
Posts: 714

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:22

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Message 16 of 21 in Discussion

Grouch message 12:



Thats an interesting observation Groucho. I recently saw a programme on the rescue of abandoned pets after the dreadful "katrina" hurricane in the US. The dogs that were found to be the most healthy, were those that had escaped their houses and formed packs. The rescuers weren't attacked by these packs either.



BizziLizzi


Joined: 02/08/2011
Posts: 855

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 12:17

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Message 17 of 21 in Discussion

Groucho



Ten or fifteen years ago you did get wild packs of large wild, or more probably feral, dogs. I dont know if any actually savaged a human but they certainly went for small dogs on leads and anyone trying to protect their pet was in danger of a nasy bite at the least. They would also jump up at anyone carrying food and could easily knock down a child or elderly person, who wer terrified of them.



I havent seen any large dogs in packs recently - but that may because my own movements are now restricted -,



I have only seen small packs of smaller dogs recently - not perhaps much of a threat to someone who knows dogs, but still a problem if you have a semi trained puppy on a lead, or are very small, frail or just frightened of dogs



BizziLizzi


Joined: 02/08/2011
Posts: 855

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 12:50

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Message 18 of 21 in Discussion

I have often wondered about the point Groucho makes about dogs in the wild! Would they be happier with freedom?



Well I have a garden for the dogs to play in, with lots of toys and the door is open. The old lady dog is privileged and stretched out on the sofa with a smile of blissful contentment on her face. Faithful adult male (dog!) is lying protectively by my side and new puppy is curled on my feet. Which do you think they prefer.

Dogs need people..........and they also like full tummies and freedom from nasty things that bite.



Also wild/feral dogs are a danger to crops and livestock and thus to farmer's and shepherd's livliehood. And that is when you start getting poison spread around........



blade


Joined: 19/06/2010
Posts: 1286

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 14:19

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Message 19 of 21 in Discussion

The last pack in our village were exterminated by the local gov after getting into a fenced area and killing many sheep. Thankfully we were on holiday at the time.

Its not the dogs fault they were just hungry.

When we got back they did come and accuse my black dog of being part of this, not that he had ever been let out in the street. We did smile as he had been dead for over a year!

Imagine the look on their faces.



Years ago dogs were happy to live in the wild, in a pack, with a pecking order. Over the years we humans have domesticated them . They are always happier with human company but can quite easily resort to the instinct of pack behaviour. Are they dangerous? Well i think it depends in the pack.



BizziLizzi


Joined: 02/08/2011
Posts: 855

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 20:08

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Message 20 of 21 in Discussion

It may have been well enough for wild dogs living in a pack in wild places with plenty of wild game away from human habitation. Problem is when hunger drives them to residential or agricultural areas.



As Blade says "not the dogs fault, they were hungry".



Any dog (even the gentlest , best trained of pets ) can be dangerous if wrongly handled, hungry, frightened or driven mad by pain. And dogs, just like humans, are more dangerous when driven by the pack instinct. The larger the dog, and the larger the pack, the harder it is to cope.



But what we have here are not wild dogs (does anyone know if wild dogs are indigenous to Cyprus?) but feral dogs that have direct or ancestral memories humans, and may react according to how they were treated.



Feral or wild dogs also carry disease and parasites which can infect other animals and humans. I frequently disagree with KAR and their policies, contd......................



BizziLizzi


Joined: 02/08/2011
Posts: 855

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 20:20

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Message 21 of 21 in Discussion

contd..............



but give credit where it is due - at least when animals are put back on the street diseased ones have (I hope!)

have been treated or put down, and the others wormed and treated for other parasites. If anyone from KAR is reading this I should be grateful if they could confirm if I am right that they also neuter them. At least that is a step in the right direction.



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