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Going back to the UK for health care

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Hippo


Joined: 02/02/2007
Posts: 2070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 05:06

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Message 1 of 79 in Discussion

I posted this on another thread in response to going back to the UK for NHS treatment, and then I thought this probablly needs more debate.



The health authorities now ,in the mission of saving money are looking more closley at eleigbility.







You may be asked for the following.







Recent utility bill (in your name)



Electoral roll



Your doctors statement. etc etc







There are now more sofisticated methods used by the authorities to check where you are, the linking of HM customs and Income tax being only one.







Just think ' where did I last renew my passport' Nicosia?



Registered as a tax exile?



Where does my pension get paid.







Whether you agree with it or disagree or use the adage of I paid my taxes for all those years, it wont wash.



The fact is non resident for more than six months you are not entitled to health care.



Of course on top of that there is always some jeleous jobsworth that may shop you.



You have been warned.







martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 07:04

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Message 2 of 79 in Discussion

I agree totally..If you choose to leave your country and become an "Ex- Patriot" why should you expect your Ex-Homeland to look after you...?



The best solution is health insurance,and scrap the out dated unworkable NHS which has been abused for decades...



the butler


Joined: 22/06/2007
Posts: 1958

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 07:43

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Message 3 of 79 in Discussion

Sometimes things are not just black and white. We chose live in the TRNC because I have arthritis. In the UK it is bad and I have to take medication for it all the time, I am over 60 so do not pay for it in the UK. Here in the TRNC it is a lot better and if I need medication I pay for it, so saving the NHS money. We also still own property in the UK, which we rent out and pay taxes on, so are still contributing to the government coffers. I agree that private health insurance would be ideal but as you get older and more things go wrong with your body, pre existing conditions are excluded or the premiums are so loaded that you simply cannot afford them. I personally feel that expats have more right to the NHS than new arrivals to the UK, after all we paid into it for over 40 years, newcomers have paid nothing.





The butlers wife



martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 08:02

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Message 4 of 79 in Discussion

msg3 ...It certainly isn't black and white.....you get "Free Treatment" on the NHS in UK, but you have paid into the NHS for 40 years, Being over 60 just means you don't pay for prescriptions...The treatments however have been paid for over the said 40 years...The NHS is not free,but because it is assumed to be free to all,it is abused....It is a system that at the time of it's conception was catering for a much smaller population....



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 08:04

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Message 5 of 79 in Discussion

Well said the butlers wife.









I too must disagree with post 1.







Far too many people from other EU countries entitled to National Health Care.













Far too many people who have never worked in their life,or their parents entitled to health care.













This is why we have such long waiting list for treatment.













If I choose to pay for treatment here or back home '' Its my choice''











My GP has been our family Doctor for many years now.Thats why I go to see him,he know me well and my health problems with my back.











He is always pleased to see me on my visits back home and ask's me how things are going.











Should I give up my right to my GP just because I live here.No way ! I choose to keep him.and he chooses to keep me on his GP list.









I worked all my life within the National Health Service,I have paid my due's and worked hard.











I am an old girl now and as the posting by The butlers wife states the newcomers



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 08:09

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Message 6 of 79 in Discussion

Cont,



Have paid very little and are able to use it !







I am happy to have the choice today and I choose My much devoted GP.advice on my health care.





Far to much shopping around here for care and the right price,









I would not even think of a facelift here







Spider,X



Wibow


Joined: 10/07/2011
Posts: 97

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 08:18

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Message 7 of 79 in Discussion



Butlers wife statement is spot on



I get so angry when statements are made about this subject



N.H.S



Me and my Husband have paid in to the system all our working lives



So why shouldn't we get what we are entitled to IF we need it



Others do and have PAID IN NOTHING Grrrrrrr



magicart


Joined: 05/10/2008
Posts: 985

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 08:26

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Message 8 of 79 in Discussion

MartinD41,



Your argument would make some sense if the UK government agreed not to deduct tax from pensions paid to Brits living abroad.



Why should we continue to pay tax without getting any benefit?



Visitor


Joined: 19/08/2010
Posts: 492

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 08:31

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Message 9 of 79 in Discussion

There are many Brits living abroad France and Spain for example who are mainly elderly and who have never paid into their systems and receive free healthcare. In Spain nearly 1 million. Infact most of these ex pats are retired whereas most EU citizens are actually working and contributing in the UK.



sienna


Joined: 09/01/2009
Posts: 1627

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 08:45

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Message 10 of 79 in Discussion

its not a matter of whether you agree... I had to go to A&E recently and there were leaflets everywhere about living abroad and your entitlements, I didnt pick one up as I wasn't feeling too good hence A&E but it looks like the NHS are on the case! I did find this link



http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/Healthcareabroad/movingabroad/Pages/Livingabroad.aspx



GinaC


Joined: 26/11/2010
Posts: 372

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 08:51

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Message 11 of 79 in Discussion

As far as I'm aware NHS healthcare is nothing to do with taxes paid it is to do with residency.



cooper


Joined: 23/10/2007
Posts: 3386

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 09:00

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Message 12 of 79 in Discussion

I think you will find that Hippo Msg 1 is just stating what the authorities are looking at doing, he's not saying if he agrees or not.



martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 09:09

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Message 13 of 79 in Discussion

msg11....Absolutely right, if you are from the EU and are residing legally in the UK,you are entitled to NHS health care,even if you are unemployed/unemployable (that's were the problem lies)

The NHS was originally funded by "National Insurance" contributions from the Employed............Sadly that is no longer enough...The NHS is floundering under the weight of it's own preposterous unworkable policies.



Hippo


Joined: 02/02/2007
Posts: 2070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:08

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Message 14 of 79 in Discussion

Thanks cooper, I am not agreeing with the policy at all, I think that it is unfair, I am just pointing out the pitfalls that you may encounter if you think that you can go back to UK and recieve free treatment.



I hope that my ex gp would support me if the situation was to occur however if he/she was to do so as Spider states would be quite simply fraud.



Agree or disagree the present rules prevail ignore them at your peril.



martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:17

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Message 15 of 79 in Discussion

Hippo, why is it unfair? You chose to become an expatriate of your Homeland and to live outside its rules and regs...The same rules apply to many places.....its all about choices.



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:18

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Message 16 of 79 in Discussion

Hippo I guess you must have given up everything in the UK ?





I live in Cyprus its an EU state.





I do not have an Ex GP.Neither dose my husband he have a different GP than mine and he has not seen him for many many moons.But if he wanted to I am sure he could go and see him again his choice.



Maybe in your case you would need to re-register with a GP and have a UK address ?



Spider,X



martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:36

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Message 17 of 79 in Discussion

Actually Spider you live in the TRNC which is NOT an EU state......slipped your mind did it?. If the rules are as Hippo says,then that's the way it is.....I think Health Care should be paid for,. ie; visits to the GP should be paid for..However, if you are referred to Hospital/Specialist by the GP the care should then be Free



Hippo


Joined: 02/02/2007
Posts: 2070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:43

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Message 18 of 79 in Discussion

Martin I do think it is unfair I have paid my tax NI and are still paying tax but unfortunatly those are the rules.



Spider, you can have as many addressess as you want you can be on as many GP lists as you like but if you reside out of the UK then you are not entitled to Health Care.



Any conlusion between yourself and the GP friend or not is as I said fraud.



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:45

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Message 19 of 79 in Discussion

martin nothing has slipped my mind



And I also know that I do not need to take my passport to my GP every time I see him either.And if my husband dose not see his GP in say-10yrs he is not going to be removed from his GPs list or get asked ''where have you been''



If you have given up everything in the Uk then yes you are bound to maybe find a few problems. But I would advise you to go straight away and register with a GP,asp.



Spider,X



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:50

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Message 20 of 79 in Discussion

Oh and I live in Cyprus...In the North of Cyprus.



I think you will find that only Turkey and the Turkish Cypriots here recognise the North as being the TRNC





Maybe I am wrong ? What dose the South call it North Cyprus or the TRNC ?





Spider,X



Hippo


Joined: 02/02/2007
Posts: 2070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:51

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Message 21 of 79 in Discussion

Spider please read carefully.



IF you reside out of the UK you are not entitled to health care, signing on with a doctor who knows this and gives you treatment free is committing fraud.



nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 10:51

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Message 22 of 79 in Discussion

The NHS is a residence-based healthcare system. Therefore, once you have moved permanently away from the UK you are no longer entitled to medical treatment under normal NHS rules.

You must notify your former GP so that you and your family can be removed from the NHS register.

You will also no longer be entitled to use your UK-issued European Health Insurance Card (EHIC) to access healthcare abroad.





Chris



http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/Healthcareabroad/movingabroad/Pages/Livingabroad.aspx



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:00

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Message 23 of 79 in Discussion

Hippo.



When I have a former GP and never will have. Your advice is very good though and should help many people who need it.







Spider,X



Allan


Joined: 28/12/2010
Posts: 40

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:02

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Message 24 of 79 in Discussion

Hippo



Thanks for bringing this emotive subject out in the open, I do agree with you, there should be a safety net for receiving medical treatment back in the UK whilst living permanently abroad. But as message 2 states the rules are now in place and it seems to be enforced, perhaps some people slip through the net and get the treatment required. It would be interesting to determine how many British people are actually refused free treatment whilst visiting the UK from their overseas home.



Hippo


Joined: 02/02/2007
Posts: 2070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:03

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Message 25 of 79 in Discussion

Spider I love you dearly but please read what i put



By default you no longer have a GP, you are non resident. it as Chris put it the NHS is a residence only scheme.



martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:04

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Message 26 of 79 in Discussion

"Only Turkey and Turkish Cypriots recognise it as being the TRNC.".............That would be the non EU local Turkish Cypriot population, the TRNC Government and the Motherland......It sounds like the TRNC to me.



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:14

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Message 27 of 79 in Discussion

Hippo, Thanks you for you love Love you back loads too.



But I just have temporary residency here come on even the London TCs get a kimlik card here when they come back,some also go back home for treatment.



My GP must love me a little bit too Hippo.He has always been there and always will.Thank goodness



Spider,X



Hippo


Joined: 02/02/2007
Posts: 2070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:16

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Message 28 of 79 in Discussion

I know personally of two cases one a friend who was given a large bill.



The other was questioned quite aggressively about their status, they were given treatment but warned that they would not receive any in the future.



I personally think it is a travesty of justice that we as ex pats are treated differently than an incoming migrant.



It has similar connotations to like for like.



A TRNC citizen (With a Cyprus passport) comming to the UK can buy a house, have a job,not required to take blood test, recieves free health care etc



Is about time the grey vote stood up and be counted.



martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:19

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Message 29 of 79 in Discussion

How long do you have to live outside the UK to be classified as non resident...Most of us living here,do so on a 1or2 year "Visitor Visa" and are not therefore classified as permanent residents..perhaps that is the loop hole...



Carndi


Joined: 12/06/2009
Posts: 613

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:23

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Message 30 of 79 in Discussion

I worked since the age of 14 and retired when I was 64. In all that time I was unemployed for only a couple of weeks.

In my 50 years working I paid all NI and tax and having served for 27 years in the armed forces all over the world and earned a pension I still pay tax on that.

No one can say that I am not entitled to medical treatment and really believe that.

People who are objecting to expats claiming their right dont complain about the fact that the UK are treating foreign aids patients who came into the country illegally and despite a law court ruling that they could not be treated as UK citizians are still being treated free.

Any foreigner who land in the UK with an illness and says that there is no treatment in their country for their illness has to be treated free of charge.



nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:30

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Message 31 of 79 in Discussion

The rules have recently changed as it used to be after 3 months you had no entitlement this is now 6 months.

The government are trying to stop the abuse by not only ex-pats living abroad but by illegal immigrants etc.

In my experience most of those who abused the system were not foreigners but British citizens who had NEVER worked nor wanted.





http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-190218/Ex-pat-pensioners-denied-NHS-treatment.html





Chris



BizziLizzi


Joined: 02/08/2011
Posts: 855

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 11:59

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Message 32 of 79 in Discussion

I do so agree this is totally unfair. I paid tax and NI contributions all my working life, topped up my NI contributions when I took early retirement and still pay tax on my pensions



I take nothing from the UK Government , dont even get a decent Consular service, but still have to contribute to social and foreign policies which I disagree with. After this year, I will not even be able to vote for the Government that makes those Policies.



Like another poster, health, including arthitis , was was of my reasons for opting for retirement in a warmer climate , I pay locally for routine medical, optical and dental treatment thus saving the NHI a lot of money.



Why should I not be able to return to the UK and use the NHS if I need to in old age ? Mind you,I hope and pray I never do need to . If only on "lesser of two evils" basis I would rather stay here!



Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 12:26

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Message 33 of 79 in Discussion

It really should be based on past contributions, it seems a much fairer system. The rules state that everyone is entitled to free emergency treatment. After this even if you then have to attend an outpatients appointment you are charged. In my experience, nurses and doctors don't do too much probing and get involved in who should and who should not be entitled to treatment. However this is about to stop because of the abuse on the system which costs the NHS millions of pounds every year. They are about to go over to a computerised system which will identify peoples airport/ferry entries.



Clearly this will stop any form of abuse of the current rules not just for NHS treatment but also benefit fraud which the Government has also identified as being problematic.



Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 12:39

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Message 34 of 79 in Discussion

This article sums up the existing problems and why people should have some form of health care insurance for those emergency situations. It is often those that arrive by air ambulance that just can't hide the fact that they are no longer resident in the UK. Obviously as you get older you do tend to fall into this category.



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/4249316/British-woman-who-moved-to-Turkey-forced-to-pay-for-NHS-treatment.html



nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 12:46

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Message 35 of 79 in Discussion

Message 34,



Surely the lady would have been better to stay in Turkey and have the treatment as the cost of air ambulance is approx 20,000. The ambulance bill I would think is a bit over the top 800 for 3 miles but her hospital bill is very reasonable.



At the end of the days most of us knew that when we left the UK that we would not receive free health care again in the UK, those are the rules whether we like them or not. And was our choice to move here.



Chris



philbailey


Joined: 17/01/2011
Posts: 3534

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 12:50

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Message 36 of 79 in Discussion

I often see on here that people

are moving back to the UK

due to ill health

do they all get free health care ?



Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 12:53

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Message 37 of 79 in Discussion

Totally agree message 35. She would have been much better taking out Turkish Health Insurance which I am told is very reasonable. Not just because of the financial cost but the stress and worry involved. She will now have further problems with charges in UK for ongoing treatment but also getting adequate insurance because of her new health history in Turkey.



dippersgirl



Joined: 04/05/2010
Posts: 795

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:15

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Message 38 of 79 in Discussion

this might have been an interesting worthwhile post, but I will not read over SPACED COMMENTS.It's stupid and does not make me want to read it.

What is the point in this please??????????



Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:17

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Message 39 of 79 in Discussion

What do you mean by SPACED COMMENTS please?



Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:22

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Message 40 of 79 in Discussion

Sorry,



just looked back through the thread. See what you mean now. Yes why do people space their comments? It does make it difficult to read.



nurseawful



Joined: 06/02/2009
Posts: 5934

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:26

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Message 41 of 79 in Discussion

message 36,



You are entitled to free care if you can prove that you are returning to the UK on a permanent basis, to prove this you have to show that you are bringing back all your wordly goods and have sold or selling your property abroad.



Chris

p.s. I know this as I e-mailed the Minister for Health in the UK last year to get this information for someone with health problems. If I find the e-mail I will post on here.



Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:30

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Message 42 of 79 in Discussion

That is very reassuring.



scruff


Joined: 15/07/2008
Posts: 1070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:37

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Message 43 of 79 in Discussion

msg 36



My understanding on this is that if you say you have returned to the UK. & it will become your place of residence again, then you will get treated. It's clearly though a bit of a fine line, especially if you arrive back in the UK. terminally ill. I haven't heard yet, of anyone in this position being charged, but that may well change. I'm sure this would cause an outcry, even amongst British Residents (or maybe not).

At the end of the day, this situation isn't new. There has always been no entitlement to use the UK. NHS once you become non resident was 3 mths & recently changed to 6 mths). Right or wrong.

National Insurance contributions haven't been earmarked for any contribution to the NHS for donkeys years. It would be better to use the Taxpayer argument than the National Insurance contributions one. Anyone in receipt of anything other than basic State Pension will be paying Income tax.



This issue is no different to the unfairness whereby pensioners retiring to a whol



Trotsky


Joined: 30/08/2011
Posts: 51

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:40

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Message 44 of 79 in Discussion

Once you return to the uk you must pass the hrt test |( habitual residence test ) could be 1 month could be 12? you are not told.



martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:47

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Message 45 of 79 in Discussion

msg41 if you/we live here on a "Visitor Visa". and have a Valid UK/EU passport, how can they assume that you/we left the UK permanently in the first place? It would be different if you had taken TRNC citizenship...But it doesn't change my opinion that the NHS is an outdated Dinosaur clung to by those who are unwilling to except the facts..



scruff


Joined: 15/07/2008
Posts: 1070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:48

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Message 46 of 79 in Discussion

contd. to a whole raft of Countries are not entitled to State pension Increases, once in receipt of Pension. This includes Australia, New Zealand, South Africa & loads of other nion commonwealth countries.

For years, groups of Pensioner expats have been challenging this iniquity the Courts & getting nowhere.

Whether you like it or not all these rules are clear & the best way of getting them changed is clearly to lobby politicians.

I do think that UK. Taxpayers, living abroad should be able to continue to use the NHS in a limited way, caused as a result of overseas residence, but unlike some on here, I am under no illusions that this is not allowed & do not live in cloud cuckoo land, thinking that things won't change.

Btw. I lost my right to the use the NHS back in 2004, despite the fact that my GP had said he would continue to treat me if I wished. I visited him, just once, after I moved here in 2002. IMO, the Practice Managers had something to do with taking me of his list.



Trotsky


Joined: 30/08/2011
Posts: 51

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 13:49

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Message 47 of 79 in Discussion

the Practice Managers had something to do with taking me of his list. same here told by the inland revenue i am informed.



scruff


Joined: 15/07/2008
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Message Posted:
05/09/2011 14:23

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Message 48 of 79 in Discussion

Deffo not the Inland revenue. The timing was completely wrong for that. It was August 2004 I was removed from the list & I wasn't in receipt of any UK. taxable income then. I was by October 2004 though.

Probably due to a summons from the GP or a ladies type test that went to my old address & I didn't get. Probably sent back as return to sender & that blew the whistle.

I accepted this because I knew the rules.

So do most of the Expats living here who continue to visit their GPs & use the NHS from time to time. Some still own Property in the UK. & some use relatives addresses if they don't. They kid themselves that they are acting legally, when in fact they are not.

If access to Primary health care starts to be dependent on producing a passport, as may very well happen, to enforce the rules, then things will clearly change.

IMO It's far more sensible to try to get the rules changed, than to continue to flought them ?



dalartokat


Joined: 14/04/2008
Posts: 734

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 15:11

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Message 49 of 79 in Discussion

Scruff, well said. Its always been the same in NC because years ago people were going back and forth telling people that if they had a UK address or put down their relatives addresses then they could get treated and that seems to have carried on by people passing down the information, then thinking its the norm.



One thing to clear up is the NHS has a duty to any person whose life or long-term health is at risk that emergency medical treatment must not be denied and also people must be protected from the spread of infectious diseases. Its secondary treatment that is paid for. Anyone that is proven to conceal a prior intention to use NHS facilities as a short term visitor will be challenged with misuse



martinD41...message 45...If you return to the UK for treatment you would use your European Health Insurance Card, but you are in North Cyprus and there lies the problem.



Hippo


Joined: 02/02/2007
Posts: 2070

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 21:04

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Message 50 of 79 in Discussion

Sorry to have opened a can of worms but an interesting and I think a valuable debate that may change some people's way of thinking.



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 21:31

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Message 51 of 79 in Discussion

Hippo you sure have and you have been helping Mr Spider achieve his dream.



We will be going for permanent residency ASP as he is always saying that the UK has gone to pot ! and he never intends to set foot there ever again !



Oh dear Oh dear poor me,with my back and this blooming heat !





Spider,X



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 21:33

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Message 52 of 79 in Discussion

And he is now shouting at me Hip.Hip,Hippo..................







Men !







Spider,X ps well I take it you are as I have never looked lol xx



Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 21:45

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Message 53 of 79 in Discussion

spider. Do you tell your GP you can dance your butt off in North Cyprus?



spangles


Joined: 22/10/2008
Posts: 411

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 21:45

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Message 54 of 79 in Discussion

Message 43 sums up the problem, for pensioners anyway, in saying "you are in North Cyprus and there lies the problem". The letter which confirmed my UK State Pension benefits final paragraph says "The UK is responsible for your Health Care abroad. Details are sent with this letter." The letter enclosed two E121 forms to register for health care under EC regulations. These needed to be registered with the Sickness Insurance Office in Cyprus in Nicosia. However, they need to see the equivalent of a Kimlik Card for the South in order to register.



So the UK does provide medical cover for ex pats - they are happy to send out the forms and say we are covered once we get them registered. We just can't get them registered.



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 21:58

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Message 55 of 79 in Discussion

woodspeckie....



He know's I like to have a good time and a laugh He also told me from my MRI scan that I have arthritic of the spine and other places !



Thank goodness its a day at a time because on a bad day I am in tears needing Valtarol injections and Tramadol meds.............



He also knows that I worked for the Mental Health Team as a therapist..I needed to send him client evaluation letters...



Spider,X Thank God for the good days



TRNCvictim


Joined: 17/08/2010
Posts: 1417

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 21:59

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Message 56 of 79 in Discussion

Why should you all be worrying about the NHS? you all call it enough names! If the UK has gone to pot, why not get a Private Health Insurance Policy in the TRNC! most people say they are as good if not better than the UK!



I'm off to Spain again next week my European Health Insurance Card at the ready just in case as I'm an elderly lady! :-(



Just as anyone from Spain can have treatment in the UK completely free of charge!



"The Times they are a Changing" as Mr Dylan would say!



rejela


Joined: 09/02/2011
Posts: 293

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 22:42

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Message 57 of 79 in Discussion

OK so ex pats are not entitled to free health care back in the UK. So why don't the government credit these people with their NI contributions to put towards health care where they now live.



Surely a portable system would offer the hard working people some help towards health care. After paying tax and NI contributions all their working lives surely they deserve something better than being cut loose at their time of need. Come on, where else could you take someones hard earned money all those years, then deny them treatment. The system should cover those who served the motherland, in preference to those who never did or are never likely too.



Ballyboffin


Joined: 25/08/2007
Posts: 903

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 23:04

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Message 58 of 79 in Discussion



TRNCvictim,



Be aware that your EU card will only cover basic medical attention and not prescription charges. You will still need Travel Insurance. Also, even if you have your Travel Insurance you must inform them if you need any medical treatment BEFORE you appoint to have it, otherwise you may not be covered.



I take it that you know that you have to inform your Travel Insurance company about any existing medical problem that you may have and if the medication changes and they are not informed, your policy will not be honoured.



TRNCvictim


Joined: 17/08/2010
Posts: 1417

Message Posted:
05/09/2011 23:10

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Message 59 of 79 in Discussion

Ballyboffin,



I do know believe me I have been going to Spain for many many years! everything covered! even my High Blood Pressure! which has come about after my skirmish with the TRNC (shame it didn't protect my late husband)!



Tatum1


Joined: 23/03/2009
Posts: 337

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 07:50

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Message 60 of 79 in Discussion

Hi



I totally agree with you.

We like you have paid all of our lives from the age of 16. Never had any benefit as we have always worked and paid our taxes.

In fact both my husband and I are still paying taxes in the UK on our Pensions ..... like many others who don't reside there!!!

What a nonsense. We are ok to pay taxes to the UK even though we don't live there .... but Oh MY Goodness if we needed medical care.

However the 6 month thing is not entirely correct as there is the issue of age and the length of time that someone has reside in the UK in the past i.e 25 years if I remember correctly. This is from information given out in Lefkosa at a venue there attended by UK GOVERNMENT REPRESENTATIVES.



martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 08:17

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Message 61 of 79 in Discussion

msg57 "Cut loose at their time of need"



They weren't "Cut Loose", they chose to leave the the safety of the UK "nest.".....NI is an insurance like any other,once you stop paying your dues,and leave the Motherland, you fail to be covered...Tax has little to do with it...



pemos


Joined: 13/11/2008
Posts: 626

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 09:33

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Message 62 of 79 in Discussion

msg 6, spider



Hi Maria, sorry to disagree with you but I think you should source more information before putting comments like this on the forum. I recently had a heart attack and ended up in near east hospital which was probably the best hospital i have ever been in, and i have been in a few. They carried out a quadruple bypass, the surgeon, professor Charles, is rated as one of the top heart transplant and bypass surgeons in the world. The operation was a total success and my recovery has been amazing, I put this down to there expertise and totally proffessional care planning. I believe I received the best care possible, any less and i would notbe here to talk about it now.

P.S I know this is private health care however I would like to point out I received my treatment at one quater of the cost of the same treatment in the south or england. I would strongly recommend near east hospital for all forms of treatment, they have the facilities to deal with all illnesses. Sam Bray K RUS



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 13:14

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Message 63 of 79 in Discussion

Hi pemos.



re;message 6 I was just jesting about both my age ! and the face lift !



I have not needed to receive treatment thus far here but agree whole heartedly with you comments of high class good treatment,and if and when needed of course we would'' pay here and seek the best''.The debate was if we are entitled to obtain care back home still and it seems not !



I am please you survived you treatment and very well done to all involved.I too have heard that treatment here is second to none in all fields.We never know what round the corner just waiting for us re health !



Best wishes. Spider,X



rejela


Joined: 09/02/2011
Posts: 293

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 18:08

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Message 64 of 79 in Discussion

NI is an insurance like any other



We paid volantery NI contributions whilst living in N. Cyprus. However, the HMRC wrote to us and informed us that we no longer needed to pay, as we had paid what was required by the system and they cancelled our direct debit. How does that resemble insurance, premiums are always due year in year out?



nicola


Joined: 06/09/2011
Posts: 246

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 20:11

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Message 65 of 79 in Discussion

As long as you have an aderess in the uk you get treatment, I havent lived in uk for years but still get my treatment.



scruff


Joined: 15/07/2008
Posts: 1070

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 20:31

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Message 66 of 79 in Discussion

It seems some posters are still living in self delusion about this issue. Maybe they didn't do their homework about this issue before they came to live here ? You may not agree with it, but once you leave the UK. for more than 6 mths, then you are no longer entitled to NHS treatment.... end off.

The argument about NI contributions is irrelevant. NHI contributions entiltled you to unemployment benefits (means tested) & Maternity benefits, but largely provide a State Pension, however they are not actually ringfenced & put into a personal pot. They just form part of Taxation.

NI does not & hasn't contributed to NHS healthcare for donkey years.

Please read msg Nos. 1, 41 & 43 to 50. There's no point in going on about the fairness of it.

Lobby your MP by all means, but expect to get absolutely nowhere with a UK. Government that's trying to save money.

The fact that up to now, this hasn't been seriously enforced is no reason to suppose that this state of affairs will continue.



scruff


Joined: 15/07/2008
Posts: 1070

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 20:34

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Message 67 of 79 in Discussion

Msg. 65.

Nicola. You do not get treatment legally.

Have you actually read earlier postings ????

One day soon, your GP practice &/or hospital could well ask to see your passport.



scruff


Joined: 15/07/2008
Posts: 1070

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 20:36

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Message 68 of 79 in Discussion

Nicola. I also see or assume that you live in Portugal. Sorry, what's that got to do with Northern Cyprus ?



wynyardman



Joined: 15/12/2007
Posts: 4580

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 20:37

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Message 69 of 79 in Discussion

I wish you lot would all bugger off.



I pay my taxes to benefit residents of this Island.(UK)



Where on Earth do you find a right to live off the Good tax paying people of the UK.



You wish to avail yourselves of the benefits of offshore living. Pay the bill! We are sick of tax fiddling Ex Pats.



Get a life! and pay your way!



wynyardman



dalartokat


Joined: 14/04/2008
Posts: 734

Message Posted:
06/09/2011 20:52

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Message 70 of 79 in Discussion

On the news this morning in UK it was discussed about the new reforms for the NHS, one being handing over more responsibility to the GP so he can handle his own budget. This could affect the likes of the ex pat going over(as well as others)for treatment, if that GP wants to run a tight ship.

Also said that patients are increasingly sent out to Local Providers and in that case, they, may be even more stringent as to whether you are entitled to that treatment for free. Local Providers will not want to lose lucritive contracts.



honestie


Joined: 22/02/2009
Posts: 468

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 08:39

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Message 71 of 79 in Discussion

if you retire to spain france etc and obtain residency then there are the necessary form torms to complete and submitted which are then transferred to the equivelant spanish authorities. this then enables you to full state medical care and only emergency treatment in the UK.



there is no such aggreement with TRNC or Turkey as not being in the EU and the residency obtained for TRNC is not the same as Spain France etc. The residency here is to allow you to stay over the 90 day period you can stay as long as you want in the EU.Subsequently you can have a residencey stamp for TRNC in your passport it does not mean you live in the TRNC permanently and out of the UK for more than 6 months



Visitor


Joined: 19/08/2010
Posts: 492

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 09:30

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Message 72 of 79 in Discussion

Message 71 Actually that is no longer the case in France and Spain. You are entitled providing you paid NI in the UK to receive 2 years Health cover under reciprocal agreements, but after that it depends on your circumstances. Many expats because of there numbers are creating resentment in these countries. Nearly one million in Spain mainly pensioners. In France some Expats what is termed early retirees have to take out private insurance which often provides inadequate cover especially for long term illnesses.



Tango1


Joined: 19/02/2011
Posts: 1151

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 09:34

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Message 73 of 79 in Discussion

Msg.60 What a rude person you are. Were you born that way or do you practice in front of the mirror each morning? For your information, the vast majority of ex-pats who live here permanently are retired. As such our pensions are taxed at source, be they private or state (unless you worked for a foreign company). As a result of which we pay for schools, hospitals. roads, the police, the fire brigade in the UK.



I would also like to point out that living in the KKTC is NOT offshore living (i.e. Guersey, Jersey, Grand Caymen etc) I know a number of people in the UK who invest their money in off-shore acounts - I only know one here.



It seems to me that we are actually subsidizing the likes of you - not the other way round).



dalartokat


Joined: 14/04/2008
Posts: 734

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 10:18

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Message 74 of 79 in Discussion

Tango do you mean message 69....and not 60



Tango1


Joined: 19/02/2011
Posts: 1151

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 17:54

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Message 75 of 79 in Discussion

Msg. 74 I'm so sorry, yes you're correct. My apologies to Msg. 60 I shouldn't try to type without my Specs. on!!



If you are still out there Msg. 69 then please read my comments back to you.



Carndi


Joined: 12/06/2009
Posts: 613

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 18:22

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Message 76 of 79 in Discussion

wynyardman. I think tango1 is a very nice lady as she only called you a ' rude person ' which is very mild.

As I said on msg 30 I paid into the system for 50 years, 27 of those in the armed forces serving all over the world and no one but no one could honestly say that I have not earned what ever is going in the UK.

I also pay tax on my service pension as well as a private pension. Do not hear you say anything about those people living here who still pay tax in the UK. Should the government refund the taxes paid ?

My wife had a bypass operation in Adana,Turkey all paid for by ourselves, all tablets are paid for by ourselves and all other visits to doctors have been paid for by ourselves.

See that you are 66 so would assume you are receiving a pension. Well sir if you have paid into the system for 40 or 50 years then I hope you have a long and happy life because you will have earned it and should receive your pension no matter where in the world you live.



Jeannie


Joined: 04/08/2009
Posts: 3283

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 21:32

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Message 77 of 79 in Discussion

Just a thought. If some ex-pats are returning to the UK for medical treatment, should we assume that at least some of them may have been in receipt of some sort of Invalidity/Incapacity benefit before they left the UK? If this is the case, can we assume that at least some of them are still in receipt of this?



I suppose it's very possible, since some seem to be able to return to the UK for treatment with no questions asked?



I am not arguing the rights and wrongs of ex-pats' entitlement to healthcare in UK whilst they are domiciled abroad, just wondering how 'easy' it might be to continue claiming benefits?



spider


Joined: 03/01/2009
Posts: 5527

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 21:35

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Message 78 of 79 in Discussion

jeannie.



Would you be going off topic now Maybe another thread....



jesting





Spider,X



Biggles


Joined: 14/06/2009
Posts: 165

Message Posted:
07/09/2011 21:49

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Message 79 of 79 in Discussion

I tried to read all of this, got totally confused, but the bottom line is:

The TRNC is a non EU country, so we are not entitled to EU/UK benefits and that includes health care. I have paid insurance contributions to the UK most of my working life, but I am now offshore. I lived offshore before in Guernsey, but still paid tax on UK income. Because I have an income in the UK, I still pay tax there, but I am not entitled to health care, so I have medical insurance, why should other folk take up the benefit when they live here??? It is not right. When you move to a foreign country you must do your homework before you move.



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