Syria must be thanking Russia and China

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 09:46

There could have been a resolution that made it clear to the Syrian regime that bumping off protesters was not going to be tolerated..



But.. thanks to Russia and China.. it was vetoed..



WHY?



Well they say the resolution on Libya was used as a pretext to remove Gadhafi



What they forgot to mention was that they benefit the most from the ex-regime of Libya and the current one and would have the most to lose.. ask most Libyans... and they are GRATEFUL for our help...



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-15177114



Sorry, but I think Russia and China have put their national interests before the people of Syria

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 09:48

Like the UK never does that.... :(

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 10:36

Touché, Groucho ..



Now, try and tell us when you heard newly liberated folk on TV thanking 'us' for our help ! ?

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 10:57

What I'm saying is, UK government puts helping others high up the list but only as long as they perceive some short or long-term advantage for the national interest. Otherwise they may say some lovely supportive platitudes that plays lip-service to personal freedoms whilst secretly doing little to make sure change comes about - particularly if we can supply arms to the incumbent.

Funny how we take an interest in countries with oil to exploit whilst ignoring many others who are simply poor and living under despotic rule.... Still you have to pick your battles.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 11:00

Did we know that the Falklands had oil by in '82



It would have been easier to say to the ppl of N.Ireland - the maj. of who wanted to stay part of the UK - 'sorry'.. but we'll let the terrorists win - it's cost too many lives..



For sure, Iraq was a mess..



Seems like Libya was something the Chinese and Russia don't want repeated...

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 11:38

You can say Russia and China are consistent and have acted in line with their own countries policy.



Both countries are autocratically administered. China did what Syria did which was to crush a rebellion at Tinanmen square back in 1989. You can be sure that any similar rebellion would be met with formidable force. Political dissenters are incarcerated. Chinas sees democracy simply as an ideology. Putin has craftily manipulated his position in Russia to be now guaranteed another two terms in office.



Russia and China are unlikely to vote down a regime which mirrors their own. To do so would being giving their own people a cause for rebellion, or a cause for hope depending which side you are on.



Syria is different from Libya. It was quite easy for Nato to take sides in Libya. It was almost a traditional war where two opposing camps occupied two different parts of the country. This is not the case in Syria.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 12:35

Hi ilovecyprus



Libya is NOT that simple... esp in Tripoli - OK, Tobruk and Benghazi, may be.... The old regime has put down political opposition from so called 'friendly tribes', too



Russian and ESPECIALLY China profited very nicely from Libya.. They won't be welcome is NTC pro areas..

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:54

Mark the Falklands is a bit of a spurious analogy being that it is British, lived on by Britishers and therefore not a good example of UK largess.

Pick one that is not a candidate for trade that we've helped out of the goodness of our souls...

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 18:59

Why do you think that Northern Cyprus has been left to fester.This will all change now because of what is going on in the med,



Paul.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 20:04

Groucho, re msg 8



I don't think it {Falklands}WAS spurious as it had a tiny population and limited resources.



>>Pick one that is not a candidate for trade that we've helped out of the goodness of our souls...<<



They 're all candidates for trade .. just not all of 'em had despotic leaders..



I'd have thought you'd thrown Bahrain at me... the worst 'we've' done is not have a GP this year...

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 22:57

So none then...

andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
05/10/2011 23:27

mark,



whatever france and britain did in libya it was to help themselves,

cameron said as much...and that in itself is not necessariy wrong



but syria is a strategic hub in the region whose collapse could prove

very unpredictable or even dangerous, think "failed state"



it is not clear what a new government in tripoli or damascus would be like,

it may be in the image of western countries but could differ in many ways



syria is a divided and sectarian country, much like iraq in fact



as regards syria, I get a whiff of the old colonial arrogance here:

to substantially help the people(s) of syria is far beyond the latter-day

capabilities of "western" powers, that is why the possibility of direct

intervention has been ruled out



but noteworthy is ahmenadinejad's "support" for the syrian people:

teheran clearly expects the assad dictatorship to fall sooner or later

...and is hedging its bets

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
06/10/2011 10:50

Morning Groucho,



Thanks for taking the time to answer my post with a considered response ;)







andre514



Libya is made up of many tribes and there is a power-vacuum after Gadhafi - most of these nations and their national boundaries were created by 'us' ( former colonial powers )





*I* think NATOs intervention in Libya was good thing ( overall ) and how it's people handle the chance to run their nation will be the proof of the pudding...



In Syria, after prayers tomorrow, brave people will try to demonstrate their dissatisfaction with the status quo and might lose their lives ... we should never lose sight of that...