solidarity

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
02/10/2007 19:11

http://www.hbpg-trnc.net/documents/Press/CT220907_orams.html



I was browsing the HBPG website and I noticed the above posting which is taken from last weeks Cyprus today.



The Orams have filed an application with the European Courts of Human Rights to have their case heard. The outcome of this ongoing saga will impact all of us who have properties built on Esdeger land. The Orams have 30 minutes in which to present their case at the hearing in Luxembourg. To maximise their case they are callling upon all exchange title holders to sign a petition to support them. Obviously we all need the outcome to positively favour the Orams.



Who is up for signing the petition? I am

Does anyone know how one signs the petition? or where it is held?

dodger



Joined: 29/07/2007
Posts: 1895

Message Posted:
02/10/2007 21:05

sounds like a job for ukturk

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
02/10/2007 21:51

What are your thoughts dodger?

dodger



Joined: 29/07/2007
Posts: 1895

Message Posted:
03/10/2007 00:23

i would have no problem at all with signing the petition as an investor in northern cyprus i feel that it is a must that the orams win the case.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
03/10/2007 15:35

hi there i have written this in laymans terms because sometimes i can get all technical sorry (L.O.L)



ilovecyprus good posting which a lot of people should take a intrest in!!!!

my view on this i take my hat off to the orams because they did not cave into the demands of mr apostolides (i use the word mr very losely) who has prob been brain washed by external sources i.e greek cypriot government into the idea of him getting his land back insted of apllying to get compensation for his loss, in the mean time he is prob living on some poor turkish cypriots land (sods law aint it)

Now this apostolides and gc governmnet who are actually funding him with lawyers fees thought they were being clever thinking because greek cyprus is part of the e.u they will get support from u.k but actually it has blown up in their face ha-ha because mr jack straw said that the orams are not in danger of losing their home in n cyprus or will have to sell their home in the u.k and also there was not enuf time for the orams to prepare a defence against apostolides because the writ was written in greek so 1-0 to the orams and they did not realise it would be such a high profile case with then the ex p.m wife defending them!!! (cherie blair)

also the turkish cypriot government have stated whatever the outcome in the court of south cyprus wont make no diffrence because they dont reconise greek cypriot law and they wont allow anyone to come and take their homes again illegally

i defo think that the echr will vote in favour of the orams and once this done case closed because the turk who sold the land to the orams had lost their land in the south and under human rights laws you cant throw a person out on the street (even squaters have rights) and also their is a compensation package in place which has been approved by the e.u (the anan plan) if this was not in place then maybe the gc man would have a stronger case

sorry for the long winded post but i had to get it off my chest



p.s also i could not find the offical orams petition but i contacted no10 and was told to start my own e-petition on this link so whoever wants to start one lets do it link below

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
03/10/2007 16:07

dodger thanks mate for the boost

you make me sound like im the a-team

'sounds like a job for ukturk'

L.O.L- L.O.L-L.O.L

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
03/10/2007 22:53

Hi ukturk



I went in to the link but I could not find a petition with reference to the Orams. I am presuming one of us will have to start a petition. If so, what should the title be called?

dodger



Joined: 29/07/2007
Posts: 1895

Message Posted:
03/10/2007 22:59

how about ukturk for world leader

dodger



Joined: 29/07/2007
Posts: 1895

Message Posted:
03/10/2007 23:01

uk(b.j.barrachus) turk

jmg171


Joined: 19/05/2007
Posts: 183

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 00:19

hi,

I would like to sign the petition but like msg7 I could not find it.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 01:04

I will contact Marian at HBPG to see if she knows anything about the petition

Bradus


Joined: 25/02/2007
Posts: 2641

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 01:14

Title should be something to do with "settlement". As this word seems to typlify everything connected to Cyprus like home ownership, reunification ,annan plan,agreement as to who did what...... and still no settlement. Will attempt to think of something witty based on this theme for the partition.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 01:20

hi there guys

yes we do have to start our own petition and to prob call it let me think yes!!!

the orams case

good luck ilovecyprus on contacting hbpg on a official petition for the orams



p.s also while i was researching i found the petition on direct flights to north cyprus link below

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/NorthernCyprus/

thought this would come in handy aswell!!!!

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 10:49

I was hoping more people would be showing an interest in this posting. It must be a bit of a challenge for the orams, being exposed, facing the media glare and having to do so on there own.

I guess they were the unlucky ones, a GC deciding to take them to court. It could have been any of us in the same position (obviously only esdeger land). If it were you, would you want people to stand behind you or would you prefer your fellow Brits to turn the other cheek. A petition wont influence the court decision but it might help the orams to feel a bit better.



What are other peoples thoughts?

Marvo


Joined: 30/04/2007
Posts: 194

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 12:23

ilovecyprus, good on you for posting this,



I like many I'm sure thought the Orams had won their case and it was now a dead issue. I think every one in NC should support them any way they can, but how.



You really have to admire the greek pr machine though, they started the problem 40 years ago. Then, when the turks invaded to save their own people, they scurried south of the border to live in TC displaced property (ethnic cleansing), and still demand compensation for the land they left.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 12:45

Thanks Marvo for your support

Yeah, the pr machine is to be admired. They won't let it go. I think they have a lot to lose. I read that prior to 74, 78% of the islands wealth was generated through the north of the island.



I think if the Orams have started a petition then this is the one that should be used. So we should sit tight until we know what format it is in.

I have e-mailed Marian at HBPG. I await her reply.

If there is someone on this forum in Northern Cyprus then they might be able to call the Cyprus Mail to see if they have details?



In any case, if people are not able to sign a petition (for whatever reason), perhaps they could visit the orams at their property in Lapta to give them their best wishes and support. (not sure if the orams are in Lapta right now or are still in the uk)

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 13:10

ilovecyprus it just shows you dont it either most posters dont know the important things that concern north cyprus or they would prefer to post threads like where can i buy cheap beer from etc.

as long as there are posters like us to discuss everything concerning good and bad in north cyprus to keep people aware and for more people to join this forum this is a start belive me because it can only get bigger (i hope)

You see the problem with most of us brits that i learned living in london for over 25 years if there is a problem that dont concern them we may look like we are concerned but really deep down they dont care!!! UNLESS something really bad happenes to them and then they expect everyone to help which is a shame we should drop this 'Out of sight Out of mind' attitude and we should help one another not just when things are down and out!!!

i think the best thing is for all foreign nationals that are connected one way or the other with n cyprus to stand up and be counted to show the gc government and outside world we are concerned with human rights in the country we love because thats what it boils down to with the orams case their civil liberties and human rights which again the greeks are trying to take away!!!

p.s marvo please my friend choose your words carefully turkey did not invade cyprus they interverned to save their people from getting massacared!!!!

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 13:26

Steady ukturk. marvo was saying the right thing. Words are very important but ones intention is more important



ukturk, you are right, we need to stand up and be counted. We can make a big difference.

I am skeptical about the impact of petitions as I remember being part of a group handing in 10,000 handwritten signatures to no 10 as part of a local campaign. The government completely ignored it as they had already made their decision. Their attitude is 'well you put us in power so we can do what we bloody well like until you vote us out'.

I must admit getting those signatures was tough. It was a big issue impacting the health of the community. Most people just prefered to turn a blind eye and pretend the issue was not happening. It was a real eye opener for me.



NC can be the paradise that we all long for. We can live joyfully and blissfully, our investments can rise but before that happens there is perhaps a little bit of fighting/diplomacy to be undertaken.

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 13:50

hi

ılovecyprus dont get me wrong, marvo is saying the right thing and the intention is true but i just dont like the word invade because it reminds me of all the stories my gran my grandad and their friends have told me over the years how the fled for their lifes from the greeks (still brings a tear to my eye)

and the rejoice of the turkish army landing to help save and liberate the turkish cypriot people

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 15:35

I understand ukturk

lovelife


Joined: 07/07/2007
Posts: 231

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 15:39

Having read the article, Linda Oram states that they will be organising and circulating a petition in the next few weeks, now how we will sign it remains to be seen.

As Linda clearly states it is no use people burying their heads in the sand and ignoring this issue,and the attitude of 'its not happening to me' if the Orams lose then it potentially 'will happen' a lot of people who have bought property in NC, so we need to stand up and be proactive.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 15:45

Well said lovelife and thanks for the extra clarification

Marvo


Joined: 30/04/2007
Posts: 194

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 16:12

ukturk, re message 17, thats exactly what I said, they intervened, but like you I couldn't spell it either, so i said invaded, still pals ?

Susie


Joined: 06/06/2007
Posts: 87

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 16:18

More than happy to sign any petition and offer support

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 16:31

marvo no probs

of course we are still pals l.o.l

i think we are all on the same page

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 16:50

good post lovelife

like i said before thats where some brits go wrong (if it does not concern me then why should i bother) wrong attitude because this concerns us all not just brits but turks like me

personally i think the orams wont loose this case because the 'echr' reconize their is a compensation package for people who have lost land so this gc man can go and get his compensation money and on top of that can still live on turkish cypriot land that his family has occupied!!!!!

guys you know what we should do is send a e-petition direct to the greek cypriot government complaing about their action concerning the orams

lets see how far that gets us!!!!

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 18:49

Marian from the HBPG has just contacted me. She has said that the petition will be going up on her website as soon as it is available. So please look out for it and sign it. Perhaps when you have signed it then let us know on this posting. That way it keeps the posting towards the top. Her website is http://www.hbpg-trnc.net



Marian is passing on my personal e-mail details to the Orams so they can contact me if they so wish for moral support. If you want to do this too, then contact Marian and she will pass your address on. Her e-mail is marian@ayza.net

dodger



Joined: 29/07/2007
Posts: 1895

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 21:58

good luck to the orams, the case is massive and to say there is a lot riding on it would be a massive understatement i have e mailed marian to pass on my support.

dodger



Joined: 29/07/2007
Posts: 1895

Message Posted:
04/10/2007 22:05

sorry for overdosing on the word massive.

davidoff


Joined: 21/04/2007
Posts: 438

Message Posted:
05/10/2007 12:33

Hi all,



When are the exact dates etc for the orams appeal etc???

As Id heard it was in october mid to end??? Is This right??



Also your right turkey only intervened in 1974- and according to the EU, UN and ZURICH agreement that was signed in cyprus between 1958-60 they were guarentors for the safety of the turk-cyps and had every legal right to step in protect their people from ethnic cleansing and "ENOSIS" Which was a process introduced by the Gs to unite cyprus with greece- which was in breech also of the zurich agreement!!



The international community acknowledge it was only a "INTERVENTION" Where as its only the Gs and the GCs that label it as "ILLEGAL INVASION"



I could go on forever- but thats just a snippet of what happened!!



So dont believe everything the G propaganda tells you- as its not true- its their version of events ONLY!!!

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
05/10/2007 14:21

hi all

davidoff i have been told the orams case is to be heard end oct

but i have just been surfing on the echr website and nothing has been written about the case link below

http://www.echr.coe.int/echr/

dodger



Joined: 29/07/2007
Posts: 1895

Message Posted:
05/10/2007 20:23

had a reply by email from marian regarding the orams

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
05/10/2007 20:39

what did Marian say?

ukturk



Joined: 01/09/2007
Posts: 1974

Message Posted:
05/10/2007 23:21

dodger

did you get a reply from marian what did she say???