House Purchase Scams

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
02/07/2009 20:01

It is clear that there are a number of house building scams in place in TRNC, but it is not clear who is involved. ie Ca Sa is one company name many times, is this Cafer Yucelgazi’s former company? I understand that Cafer Yucelgazi also trades as Aspire Trading Ltd, Aspire Contruction and Aspire Construction Ltd. Also, why has no one named their solicitor/legal advisor/advocate. If the advocate is doing his job correctly he should be warning/reassuring prospective purchasers of the: reputations, successful complettion, failure to complete, status of the builder, history of builders work.

It would appear that Cafer Yucelgazi has a reputation for this - is this correct. One of my family has purchased a house in Alsancak and now he says he has no money - this is very worrying for them.

hydrobrush


Joined: 18/06/2009
Posts: 40

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 08:49

www.lcmservices.net

Stewart


Joined: 19/07/2008
Posts: 1107

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 10:32

Up to you..but...Halil at Cypruspropertyconsultants.com is a local TC....he knows everything about everyone in the north....I have always found him both, reliable and trustworthy.



If you are thinking of buying any property, either buy through him...or run it by him.



( His office his opposite the beach just outside the MERCURE hotel )

negativenick


Joined: 10/11/2008
Posts: 6023

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 10:34

i'd proceed with caution - apparently Hitler was a pretty top bloke until he invaded Poland....

Harold2555



Joined: 19/04/2008
Posts: 1139

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 10:57

Nick



Err no he wasn't actually but I'm sure you know that and are just pointing out the hypocracy of some who claimed he was and the similarities between those who have the top builder and advocate until it all goes wrong!



Harold2555

negativenick


Joined: 10/11/2008
Posts: 6023

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 11:13

you are right Harold - like i said, i'd proceed with caution - times are tough and we are in unchartered waters, just because a builder was good a few years ago......etc

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 11:27

Cafer Yucelgazi's email address is: aspire@tourismandinsurance.com

Maybe all these problems should be addressed to him and your solicitors - who have a duty to check out you builder when you sign with them.

keithcaley



Joined: 13/06/2008
Posts: 2521

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 12:52

Hi Kathleen,

I am not involved with this site, or this company, but chanced upon the 'thread', which raises some interesting questions -

You said "Maybe all these problems should be addressed to him and your solicitors - who have a duty to check out you builder when you sign with them."

There are NO 'solicitors' in TRNC - you may be referring to Avukats...

I would be interested to know exactly where you learnt that the 'fact' that '(solicitors) have a duty to check out you builder when you sign with them' - or is this just your personal opinion?

The position in TRNC is that the head of the TRNC Bar Association has been quoted as stating that Avukats DO NOT HAVE ANY DUTY OF CARE TO THEIR CLIENTS.

If you can prove otherwise, it will be of help to many people.

Best regards,

Keith.

cyprusairsoft



Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 2066

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 14:23

there are some excellent advocates



mine has represented the best highly recommend



Arkun Zeka of Oktay Feridun



he does what it says on the tin! very nice man as well

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 14:28

Hi Keith

JEPA NC Property Services UK office (info@jepacyprus.com ) state:

Nazife has asked me to reply to your email as she will be tied up with clients for the next few days. In answer to your questions…

1)Your solicitor / advocate will check the credentials of your chosen builder / developer along with the relevant planning permissions before any documents are signed. We must however point out that there are no further guarantees or safeguards, etc.

2)If a developer runs out of money then the company will probably go in to receivership, as in the UK. The main / secured creditors are always paid as priority then clients / customers. Your solicitor will of course be there to represent your interests but can only work within the statuary guidelines.

3)Your solicitors have the same duty of care as a UK solicitor would, and yes the payment is made in advance. The builder / developer usually presents a draft contract then your solicitor makes any amendments, changes or add

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 14:37

The Cyprus Times stated in relation to a meeting regarding scammy soliciotors/advocats:

'One Turkish Cypriot lawyer, Boysan Boyra, who has been campaigning for Genc TV to expose malpractice among his fellow Turkish Cypriot lawyers had already told HBPG he would be 'very willing' to take on the case. He will advise later on whether action should be taken against the profession's leaders by launching a case against the TRNC Bar Association (Baro), individual lawyers or both. 'We have to gather and collate very specific information regarding the issues and he will then look at the overall situation and advise on how to progress' Ms Stokes told the meeting. 'Regarding the Bar Association it is probably a question of what they did not do rather than what they did'.

Maybe the HBPG needs more support and information in order to try to bring about changes

keithcaley



Joined: 13/06/2008
Posts: 2521

Message Posted:
03/07/2009 15:44

messages 10 & 11,

Thank you very much for the information, and sources.

It is sometimes difficult to separate fact from supposition, and although neither of the sources are part of the TRNC Administration or Legal System, the statements do provide a reference.

Keith.

blackcountryb


Joined: 04/09/2008
Posts: 18

Message Posted:
04/07/2009 22:46

Having purchased from CA SA construction in 2004, all 16 owners are still waiting for the completion of the site, 5 long years of phone calls, meetings, visits to CA SA offices, directors homes , advocates offices all to little or no avail, we are still await completion. As to anyone of us ever receiving our kochans who knows?



We chose to use a independant advocate to the one recomended by the estate agent selling the property. They did check out the builder (at our request) and reported that "They are a good builder,completing a lot of properties in your area"



As you said Cafer has many company names that he is or has traded under over the past few years, some are now dormant, and others trading on a much reduced scale, the site you refer to in Alsancak appears to have come to a stand still, with no one working on site for some time now.



The appartment blocks in Lapta appear to have a few workmen on site from time to time, no real progress being made.



Brian

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 00:03

Hi Brian

My family are a couple of years behind you. Cafer gets away with this because no one takes him to court and the advocats/solicitors check the legal records. However, Cafer has a reputation now so there is no excuse for the advocats not to warn potential buyers. My relatives bought through Re-max who have been absolutely brilliant in all dealings and they have provided a lot of support. Cafer sold one plot 3 times to different people and as I understand it Remax had to sort the mess out and following the uproar about that Re-max also dropped them like a ton of bricks.

What I feel should be done is name the Advocats. If anyone on your site had problems in 2004 then contiuned to sign up new purchasers in 2006 the advocats we ill advised (incompetent) in recommending others to sign up for the purchase and should have warned people. Then we would have more respect for the Advocats - WHICH CLEARLY NO ONE HAS AT THE MOMENT.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 00:22

When my relative asked the question about Cafer being bankrupt, they were told by their advocate: Bankruptcy Laws differ to the UK in the sense that individuals cannot be declared bankrupt. If the contract of sale was signed by Cafer as an individual, not a company, this means he cannot declare himself as bankrupt in the TRNC . The term 'bankrupt' is used loosly in TRNC to indicate the severity of the situation. Cafer has however openly admitted that he does not have any money left to finish the site. They can sue Cafer and proceed to get a ruling in the courts to return the money spent. However if Cafer does not have any assets 'AVAILABLE', the courts can rule that he HAS to pay them a monthly amount that he can afford until the monies are fully returned to you. Note the word - AVAILABLE he has obviously put his assets into a company or other names ie moved them to a position where they are unavailable. Has CA SA been declared bankrupt? it would appear not.

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
05/07/2009 13:08

Interesting article in Cyprus-mail.com today click on news on the left and read the 4th article about an interview with Lord Jones of Cheltenham it is about South Cyprus properties but rings lots of bells about property in North Cyprus. Maybe people having buying problems in NC should join in this debate in the House of Lords.

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 00:22

It appears that Cafer has left development sites in the past and buyers are left in the lurch.

I know of:

- CaSa and Karsiyaka - which appears to be ongoing since 2003/4

- Cafer Yucelgazi - Incesu/Alsancak - appears to be ongoing since 2006

- Lapta Flats (don't know under what name or when they started think it was 2008)

All work ceased and no money left to continue

Are their any other developments which are in the same boat?

How does he get away with it, why are advocats not warning their clients?

Aga Buyers A G


Joined: 04/10/2007
Posts: 488

Message Posted:
07/07/2009 09:51

We are seriously considering another protest (last one was Feb 08 covered by GAK TV - see youtube)complete with media attendance at the TRNC Offices, Bedford Square, London in the coming months. The new government has to reaslise that we Brits will not be ignored any longer and that house purchase scams, scamming lawyers and the corrupt behaviour that seems to cover the island just cannot continue



Anyone interested in assisting/joining us should email - the more the merrier. Photos and videos can then be posted in the web FOR ALL TO SEE !!!!!!



agabuyersactiongroup@yahoo.co.uk



Suz, Pat & Sandra

Aga Buyers Action Group

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 16:58

If the TRNC governement and media are not prepared to deal with this then maybe the British Media would. There are TV programmes over here about all these problems. I have only seem one on TRNC. Maybe if we bombarded the British Media to warm other purchasers maybe something will get done.

They will loose an awful lot of revenue if the Brits (and others expected) start publicising at home what they are doing.

Aga Buyers A G


Joined: 04/10/2007
Posts: 488

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 17:28

Protest Organised



http://latchfords.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!AED4FE7679CA3C33!2031.entry

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
08/07/2009 21:27

Hi Aga Buyers AG

Sent your link onto other purchasers in our group who are experiencing problems.

Good luck

Katy

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
09/07/2009 20:40

I noticed on the HBPG website that they have a 'name and shame' section. Whilst I think this relates to builders, it would be useful if it also listed advocates who dealt with the problems.

If a builder fouls up in 2003/4 and the advocate is still processing and recommending the builder in 2006/7 then once again they are raking it in. If they were named as the advocate dealing with the purchase along with the builder building the property - maybe this would make the advocates more accountable if new purchasers can find them named on the list along with the builders.

I know one advocate who was telling customers that Cafer Yugelgazi 'is an honourable man' in March 2009. How many of you would agree with that statement - and how many buyers will believe him, after all, he is an advocate (solicitor to us???)

katy

Aga Buyers A G


Joined: 04/10/2007
Posts: 488

Message Posted:
09/07/2009 20:49

tks Katy



lets rattle the cages and stop hiding afraid to rock the boat - time to make the North Cyprus Regime feel uncomfortable - after all that is what they have subjected us to over the pst 6 years or so !!!!





xxxxxxx

KatyMcM


Joined: 12/07/2009
Posts: 46

Message Posted:
13/07/2009 22:11

The Bellapais auction has proved that we are all in the ****

the builder Cafer Yucelgazi is trying to buy the land that British buyers are having houses built on in Incesu. He announced the he has no money to finish the houses, but now has a new partner and is trying to buy the land?

What are your thoughts on this??? does anyone know who the new partner is (is it an old one who has resurfaced)

KatyMcM


Joined: 12/07/2009
Posts: 46

Message Posted:
14/07/2009 12:16

Can an owner of the land sell the land when contract of purchase have been completed on it.

Molly


Joined: 30/08/2008
Posts: 299

Message Posted:
14/07/2009 15:06

Not if the purchaser(s) stamped and registered their contract(s).

KatyMcM


Joined: 12/07/2009
Posts: 46

Message Posted:
14/07/2009 20:52

Hi Thanks for that Molly - will check it out

I am following up every lead and putting pressure on the advocates, estate agents, builders etc

Don't let the B*******s get you down - so they say!!!

the butler


Joined: 22/06/2007
Posts: 1958

Message Posted:
14/07/2009 21:07

Hi KatyMcM,



Don't forget that this facility of stamping and registering their contracts came in to being in January 2008.



If you purchased your property in say 2006 and paid monies in full. There was no encumberances on the property at that time but when you went to register in 2008 found the developer had taken a mortgage out on your property. This is where the problem lies and where most owners have come unstuck, there was no protection for owners before 2008. These builders were in breach of their contract but what can the owners of these properties do about it? Absolutely nothing but pray their builder does the right thing and pays off the mortgage. If the builder was in difficulties and needed to take out a mortgage in 2007, what chance is there in 2009 with the economic climate of that debt being paid?





The butler

KatyMcM


Joined: 12/07/2009
Posts: 46

Message Posted:
16/07/2009 13:23

Hi

Thanks for the advice Molly.

I copied your comments into an email to my advocate and he has replied and assured me (in writing) that this has been done. Also regarding your comments 'the butler' he has constantly checked the register to see that no mortgages etc have been made on the land to date.

many thanks for the info.

Katy

Molly


Joined: 30/08/2008
Posts: 299

Message Posted:
17/07/2009 14:46

KatyMcm



His choice of words is a little strange. He should not have to constantly check the register. At the time your contract was registered (ask him for the registration number to be sure) any mortgage already on the property would have required a signature from your lawyer acknowledging the fact. Thereafter it should not be possible for the registered owner to obtain any mortgage without your consent.

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
17/07/2009 15:29

katymackem.

You say.

'3)Your solicitors have the same duty of care as a UK solicitor would, and yes the payment is made in advance. The builder / developer usually presents a draft contract then your solicitor makes any amendments, changes or add.'



This would give potential purchasers the idea that purchasing property is safe in TRNC as the safeguards and legal protections are the same as in UK.



In UK duty of care would mean one could sue solictor, if for example, property you purchased has a mortgage on it. I dont believe any advocate has been sued where this has happened in TRNC. They dont even appear to have a duty of care in the very basics such as contract enforcement. Matter of fact has any advocat ever been successfully sued for anything relating to property purchase in NC.







As keithcaley points out "The position in TRNC is that the head of the TRNC Bar Association has been quoted as stating that Avukats DO NOT HAVE ANY DUTY OF CARE TO THEIR CLIENTS.

stevie-d



Joined: 13/07/2007
Posts: 1420

Message Posted:
26/01/2011 15:39

Has anyone had any luck with CA-SA Construction Ref. Kochan or any other contact with them recently????

stevie-d

nostradamus


Joined: 15/04/2008
Posts: 557

Message Posted:
26/01/2011 15:57

Friends of mine have gone through the courts with Cafer and his erstwhile partner regarding their Karsiyaka house. They won the case about 15 months ago. Cafer and the partner were ordered to pay 300TL a month each (debt outstanding, something like 22K Stg). Amount received to date: 300TL! This case had been ongoing for almost 3 years before they got judgement - after about 25 court appearances. Both Cafer and his partner had no assets (transferred to their wives/families or whatever) and told the court they couldn't pay any more due to them making repayments to a bank. Complete and utter waste of time not helped by their dilatory advocates.

deputydawg


Joined: 30/03/2010
Posts: 1727

Message Posted:
26/01/2011 17:08

I used to think that Advocates here did not bother with indemnity insurance but simply rely upon the statement that they have no duty of care towards their clients. I am now advised that it is worse than that. They seek such insurance to be able to entice more clients into their lairs (oops offices) but to date their notoriety precludes them from finding insurers gullible enough to take them on.