british courts refused direct flights to Ercan

sissy


Joined: 29/03/2008
Posts: 197

Message Posted:
29/07/2009 18:22

I cant believe it, the british high courts have refused an application to conduct direct flights between the UK.

and Ercan. Go into famagusta Gazette, and click on to cyprus politics



What if Turkey banned flights over their land to the south, what a carry on there would be.

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
29/07/2009 19:51

In fact Turkey does not allow Cyprus Airways to use her air space and it costs them a lot of öoney in extra fuel costs. Indeed they blame Turkey for their bad finances.

ismet

charb


Joined: 17/03/2009
Posts: 188

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 03:26

... and as far as I know, they sued Turkey for that...

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 09:02

First time I hear this. Which court?

ismet

sissy


Joined: 29/03/2008
Posts: 197

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 12:00

hi Ismet

Its the british planes that fly over Turkey to the south. I think the brits have double standards as its the British High Courts that have refused flights straight to Ercan.

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 12:14

Found this interesting article about the " issues" of planes flying to and from Cyprus that overfly Turkey





http://www.bcavirtual.com/cyprusatc.htm



When I fly from Ukraine or Moscow to Cyprus - on a non RoC reg'd plane - they fly over Mersin and the Karpas(sa) Peninsula . Now I'd love to know WHO is giving instructions to the plane as it plainly overflies territory that TR would wish a plane to contact Ercan / Tymbou







I'm guessing that UK reg'd planes that CAN overfly TR would also be invited by TR based ATC to contact Ercan/ Tymbou ...



Surely, if this IS correct this is an accident waiting to happen ..

TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 12:28

Hi mmmmmmmmm,



Your link is obviously a GC site as it is overtly political and one-sided. It also refers to "we" in the text giving the game away.

That aside, as only flights to/from TRNC/TR use the A28 northern route, I don't think there is that much chance of an accident with "other" aircraft.

eren2411


Joined: 25/07/2009
Posts: 26

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 12:30

how stupid is that,what is the problem flying direct to ercan,its not like it is a bloody war zone,there is nothing worse than sitting on the runway with kids for over an hour in turkey before we continue our journey to ercan,the whole of cyprus is lovely,so why direct to one part and not the other not fair,i dunno rules and regulations who needs em

xx

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 12:38

Hi "TRNC" Vaughan



Yes, it is undoubtedly written by someone who doesn't recognise the "TRNC" . I noticed that and wanted to add that AFTER I had posted, but I didn't think anyone would try to "belittle" the point of my concern !



I am happy that you explain that A28N is only used by Ercan / Tymbou bound traffic, but still concerned that a internationally recognised ATC would try to hand over planes to a non recognised one, who would give out instructions without working with the next ATC..

TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 13:02

Hi mmmmmmmmm,



No belittlement intended, but GC propaganda abounds and we must recognise scaremongering when we see it. The link portrays the TR/TRNC aviation authorities as being irresponsible and liable to cause an accident. What would be the solution to the dilema, according to the link writer, then? Co-operation? - I doubt it. We all know that the GC's just want flights to/from Ercan stopped, not made safer.

stusimpson


Joined: 06/08/2007
Posts: 178

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 15:44

I regularly fly to Cyprus and the overriding ATC is Nicosia control,however we must also contact Ercan who may or may not conflict with Nicosia,its normally straight forward sorting it out and it really happens.Its why most crew never request altitude changes or direct routings(shortcuts) when in this greyish area just to save hassle.



Interestingly if you ask Nicosia for Ercan's frequency they will tell you its an illegal radio station and they will not give it to you,even though we contact them before talking to ankara.Its ridiculous in my opinion and whats even more stupid is that UK planes will not divert to Ercan but would rather fly 45 mins to Rhodes or somewhere else so if someone blocks the runway at Larnaca I'm forbidden from diverting to Ercan which is easier all round for everyone.



Unless its a dire emergency of course in which Ercan would be my 1st choice,safety obviously over riding any political differences.



Stu

elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
30/07/2009 19:05

Stu,

My understanding from people working at Ercan is that they get the daily schedules direct from Brussels, so there is some sort of recognition.

ismet

stusimpson


Joined: 06/08/2007
Posts: 178

Message Posted:
31/07/2009 00:05

Yes they do I meant to say "rarely" happens not really!!! a typo.Its just that bit of airspace where effectively 2 controllers think they have a say,but neither wishes any incident so therefore its important as a pilot we communicate with Ercan and Nicosia,and resolve any confusion with both,but like I say it rarely happens!



Cheers Stu

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
31/07/2009 00:16

Msg 10. cyprus-mail.com/news. Parties welcome direct flights ruling. The British High Courts decision to reject a request to allow flights between UK & NC was met by a chorus of approval by Cypriot politicians and diplomats."We need to note with satisfaction the extremely positive findings of the British Court and the fact that it ruled that the Cyprus Republice enjoys exclusive sovereignty on the entire land and surrounding sea & air space, independent of whether or not it exercises exclusive control over them".

cyprusairsoft



Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 2066

Message Posted:
03/08/2009 13:59

mmmmmmmmmmm didnt you know it was a ufo

cyprusairsoft



Joined: 22/06/2009
Posts: 2066

Message Posted:
03/08/2009 14:05

dont seem surprised we all knew the outcome of this one.



no one in the uk dare make a unique descision because of greek paymasters

clarets



Joined: 08/01/2009
Posts: 752

Message Posted:
03/08/2009 14:09

Woodspeckie.....which "parties"........RoC ones at a shrewd guess?

newlad



Joined: 02/03/2008
Posts: 7819

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 21:20

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/n.php?n=first-round-of-cyprus-talks-completed-2009-08-06



The rules and regs.

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 21:35

Msg 17. Cypriot politicions and diplomats.

Woodspeckie


Joined: 25/01/2009
Posts: 2263

Message Posted:
06/08/2009 21:39

www.cyprus-mail.com search by date 30th July 2009. article there.

ROBIN HOOD


Joined: 26/05/2008
Posts: 238

Message Posted:
07/08/2009 18:26

My brain (what's left of it) can't get around the following problem. The world does not rcognise TRNC. Cyprus is as a whole in the EU. Only a bit of it doesn't have EU laws. I know it sounds like a sylogism, but if Cyprus is in the EU the Ercan is also in the EU. Why is it not possible to fly directly to Ercan, surely this is an infrigment of Human rights. Under the German Constitution Article three it's a major thing. The guarantee of Freedom of Sperach, Mobility and thought. I find the arguements contra are a bit self negating. Still, as I say my brain hurts when I think.

rowlo



Joined: 12/10/2008
Posts: 4796

Message Posted:
07/08/2009 23:10

hi robin hood , easy answer for you , UK turned its back on TCs when most of cyprus were UK citizens ,qoute, we cant be seen to be taking sides , unquote ,all go cypriot , we,ll protect you , ok they say , then greek malitia start killing UK troops also , omg , what happens next , paddy threatens the british main land ,uk troops pack up kit ,go home to their uk bases to fight a political war ie, same as what they left behind in cyprus ,next up turkey deployed its forces , the rest my friend is history

karakum5c



Joined: 18/03/2008
Posts: 1021

Message Posted:
07/08/2009 23:17

The Labour party has always been against the Turkish Cypriot population historically, maybe a conservative victory at the next election will allow a more balanced approach from the UK

ROBIN HOOD


Joined: 26/05/2008
Posts: 238

Message Posted:
09/08/2009 09:50

Hi Rowlo Msg 22. Yes I agree. Plus the duplicity of the Americans in `64 and `74. Have you read the Cyprus Conspiracy? Put a whole new light on many things for me. The Americans reportedly paid the Greeks to stay out of things (`cos they had a communst Govt at the time) and Subsidised the "military excursion" for Turkey. Afterwards they deny erverything, tell everyone what bad people they were to do such aweful things and retain the use of the sovereign bases which was what they wanted all along. All because they didn't believe Harld Wilson and a virtually bankrupt UK could afford to hold them (the bases) and also suspected Wilson of being a Russian Spy. As the saying goes "sh*t happens"

girne 29


Joined: 06/12/2007
Posts: 1488

Message Posted:
09/08/2009 22:23

while maybe accepting that the ruling was correct by the letter of the law, what is not acceptable is the constant gloating and victory dances when ever the trnc lose out .There is no way these politicians in the south want any sort of settlement.Laugh at my misfortune and then tell me you want to be my friend!

Much better if they just say "we dont get any satisfaction from these decisions but you have to accept thats the way things will go until the settlement".Even if they dont mean it.

Analyst_CY


Joined: 10/08/2009
Posts: 11

Message Posted:
10/08/2009 13:36

girne 29: "There is no way these politicians in the south want any sort of settlement.Laugh at my misfortune and then tell me you want to be my friend!"



You could say exactly the same of the TRNC and the misfortune of displaced GCs, July 20 victory parades etc etc. Neither side has much to be proud of when it comes to genuine reconciliation and confidence building.

No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
11/08/2009 09:34

message 26. Then what's the purpose of the current talks?

HildySmith


Joined: 02/07/2009
Posts: 1708

Message Posted:
11/08/2009 12:48

In view of the Oram's case, they should play tit for tat. - Maybe the Turkish/Cypriots who 'own the land' which Larnaca airport stands on, should make a case.

If a few TC's demanded access to their land (Larnaca airport) being just one, then they may get somewhere, even if it just scares a few GC's - it may make them think about things!!!!

Cyprusraider


Joined: 08/04/2009
Posts: 99

Message Posted:
11/08/2009 13:10

AS far as I'm aware there was a case brought by TC's in RoC for land and the decision of the RoC court was that no decision or compensation could be made until after a political solution was reached.



Could someone else please confirm this?