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legal costs re property purchase

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coolkid


Joined: 24/07/2008
Posts: 64

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 17:18

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Message 1 of 27 in Discussion

prepaid 1000 legal costs re Unwins for a Villa which has been changed to another site and solicitor wants another 1000 seems bloody amazing to me do they think we Brits have Twat written on our face or is it quite a genuine practise.I hope I get some responses .and not offended anyone with my language.









ps , you may or may not have offended people , but there is still no need to use words like that , young children use this forum ! -------------- moderator



spook


Joined: 23/01/2008
Posts: 244

Message Posted:
05/09/2008 17:25

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Message 2 of 27 in Discussion

Who made the decsion to change sites and why?

If you can provide further info,inc which "Advocate" then im sure that you will receive sound advice,you should also contact Marion at HBPG.



coolkid


Joined: 24/07/2008
Posts: 64

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 21:09

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Message 3 of 27 in Discussion

nesa changed site due to access problems but would not exoect that much work to have been completed by munir akil all purchasers have been relocated to a better site



wynyardman



Joined: 15/12/2007
Posts: 4580

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 21:46

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Message 4 of 27 in Discussion

Hi All,



Why does it always seem to be Unwins and Munir Akil in these situations, and why does it always seem to be British buyers that fund these additional costs? Is it coincidence or has anyone else had similar experiences?



wyn



simma



Joined: 03/02/2008
Posts: 346

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 22:05

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Message 5 of 27 in Discussion

Hi Guys, my lawyer tried it on so I contacted Marian at HBPG. She was great and gave me some sound advice. The lawyer in question did a u turn and retracted his demands. She has also informed me that we all could have purchased without a lawyer at all and that they just get in the way, a lot of their charges are totally unjustified.

John.



PtePike



Joined: 20/05/2008
Posts: 2334

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 22:19

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Message 6 of 27 in Discussion

"we all could have purchased without a lawyer at all and that they just get in the way"



Absolutely. I've been saying this since 2001. But with so many noses in the trough getting a tasty cut of that needlessly-paid 1000, some people fall strangely silent when the subject comes up.



Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
06/09/2008 23:16

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Message 7 of 27 in Discussion

The advice always seems to be 'get a good lawyer'. Trouble is which if any are 'good' and secondly I have yet to find out just what they do to earn their exorbitant fees. Personally I didn't use one. Next issue is just what qualifications do you need to be a lawyer, sorry I mean advocate, in NC? They don't need to have indemnity insurance it seems. Qualifications?



doughnuts40


Joined: 27/07/2008
Posts: 98

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 09:53

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Message 8 of 27 in Discussion

I agree Hector everywhere you read people are advising to get a good independent lawyer..... can someone name ONE! Its true you do not need to have a lawyer but then who would do the legwork for PTP? Unless postings are made clear re lawyers, PTP, Notar's etc then I think this thread would confuse the person asking. Coolkid hope you get it sorted.



fire starter


Joined: 19/06/2008
Posts: 3401

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 10:17

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Message 9 of 27 in Discussion

come on can you seriously believe that there are any independent lawyers? all the tc community are related, so who is independent. only tc's practice law here i believe.



kibrissibel


Joined: 18/02/2008
Posts: 562

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 11:27

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Message 10 of 27 in Discussion

You can submit your own application for PTP. It does not have to be done through a lawyer. You can apply direct to the interior ministry providing you have the relevant documents. Please see: http://www.hbpg-trnc.net/documents/purchaseper.html

The interior ministry does not charge for this application.

You can do a lot of the leg work youself and make your own enquiries/searches etc with Land Registry etc and have title deeds transferred without the need for a lawyer. (Although you will need to complete forms in Turkish so you may need some help with this.)



come_on_aylin


Joined: 14/06/2008
Posts: 908

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 17:42

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Message 11 of 27 in Discussion

We paid our advocate 1000 upfront in 2005 to cover the purchase of our property and have recently received an email notification of his new charges. 7.50 - 10 for sending/receiving emails, 200 per hour for meetings, etc. He has done little work for the money already paid but seems to expect us to fork out for subsequent work and communications. We will be consulting HBPG.



However, this is another area where buyers need to be on guard. Do not assume that what the advocate initially demands will cover all expenses, get them to commit in writing what the expenses will be before you engage them. After all, they should know what is involved. Obviously, there may be some additional charges but it would be wise to get a list of all charges in advance and inform the advocate that you will not pay any that have not been agreed upfront.



Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 17:54

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Message 12 of 27 in Discussion

If only one could rely on ones lawyer and their advice. It appears they tell you one thing, then when found it's not correct they just shrug their shoulders and claim 'its Cyprus'. They charge whatever fees they think they can get away with, perhaps thinking of UK fees unfortunately they don't give UK service.



They survive on ignorance on the part of their clients (I wonder just what legal 'knowledge' NC lawyers have), lack of law and court precedent i.e. stated cases to follow (is it UK law they follow as so often claimed or is it made up as they go along?), lack of a supervising body i.e. like the UK Law Society and lack of professionalism. They also lay themselves open to suspicion of corruption and collusion through their links either through family or business with builders.



They have no indemnity insurance to protect their clients. In short they can have their cake and eat it.



Turtle


Joined: 28/05/2007
Posts: 2669

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 18:06

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Message 13 of 27 in Discussion

Perhaps its time for Law firms to either be paid on completion or like builders be paid in stages when the customer is satisfied ?



elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 19:03

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Message 14 of 27 in Discussion

It is the same old story again and again. You do not need a lawyer to apply for PTP and you do not need a lawyer for the transfer of title deeds, indeed it is the vendor who does the transfer. All you have to do is to make sure that you are having the same property transferred into your name as the one you actually bought.



However you do need a good and independent lawyer to prepare or check the Sale Agreement for you and have all the necessarry safeguards in place. If you go to a lawyer recommended by the Estate AGent or the Developer, it means that the lawyer is not independent. You might as well accept the readymade agreement with the blanks filled in and save yourself the lawyer's fees. I am not suggesting for one minute that you do this. My strong recommendation is that you go to a truly independent lawyer who is prepared to bargain on your behalf to have the safeguards written into the contract.



Unfortunately many people recommend lawyers without much reason, they will recommend anyone they happen to know. I know the expats are at a disadvantage becaue they do not know who to ask. The locals know much better. Hence I suggest that you ask any Turkish Cypriot that you may happen to know and you also ask them about the lawyer you intend to use. People do not hesitate to comment good or bad and finally you make your own mind.

ismet



cocos


Joined: 04/04/2008
Posts: 129

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 19:24

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Message 15 of 27 in Discussion

The problem is that the law society here do nothing to regulate the lawyers. There is no come back on the lawyers who have misled people or given them false information to get them to sign a sales contract that they wouldnt have signed had they known that there was no protection here for buyers. The PCO and the committee of contractors union and estate agents union that were supposed to sort out the complaints have no power and have done nothing. So basically many people are getting away with everything that they have done to the buyers and the many problems they have caused. So the question is why is the government etc etc not doing anything? Why arent they providing buyers with security? Surely there must be economic advisors within the government who can predict that in this worlds climate the building sector here is one of the only contributors of coffers to taxes and the governments purse. That is going tokeep the economy here alive in these difficult times.



Hector


Joined: 26/08/2008
Posts: 2352

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 19:29

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Message 16 of 27 in Discussion

You have to ask, who has their fingers in what pies?



elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
07/09/2008 23:54

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Message 17 of 27 in Discussion

Cocos,

You asked, I quote "So the question is why is the government etc etc not doing anything?"



I say that the starting point must be to change or repeal the Specific Performance Law so that people can take the vendors/developers to court and ask for their title deeds. My contention is that the government is not really aware of this situation. At least I told them so but telling them is one thing, getting them to understand its gravity is another thing. Have we managed to get the Buyers to understand this? After a years campaign with the petition, the number of signatures tonight is standing at 1162 and I can assure you that not all of them are buyers. Insteaad of just blaming the government for not doing something, we must blame the buyers too or ourselves for not being able or successful to explain it.



ismet



elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
08/09/2008 08:54

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Message 18 of 27 in Discussion

No comments so far, it must be as clear as mud!!

ismet



The butler


Joined: 22/06/2007
Posts: 1958

Message Posted:
08/09/2008 11:11

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Message 19 of 27 in Discussion

Hi ismet,



Like you I get frustrated with the lack of interest and general apathy amongst British buyers to change anything. For the last 2 years myself and a couple of neighbours have been battling to improve things on the site where we bought, the other owners will complain about things whilst they are out for a 2 week break but as soon as they go back home it is forgotten about. I think that the specific performance law should be changed and wondered if there was any way we could get signatures by going round our site and collecting them and handing them in? Not everyone is connected to the internet, so not everyone knows about it.



The Butlers wife



mackerel


Joined: 22/06/2008
Posts: 117

Message Posted:
08/09/2008 11:27

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Message 20 of 27 in Discussion

I am a bit confused.i thought that GBP1,000 was the standard charge for lawyers fees on a house purchase.Has anyone had it cheaper.Worries me to see Munir Akil's name mentioned as I was led to believe that he was one of the good guys.



elko2



Joined: 24/07/2007
Posts: 4400

Message Posted:
08/09/2008 11:36

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Message 21 of 27 in Discussion

Butler's Wife,

It is a very good idea, please go ahead. Sibelle will have more to say on the subject.

ismet



kibrissibel


Joined: 18/02/2008
Posts: 562

Message Posted:
08/09/2008 12:19

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Message 22 of 27 in Discussion

The Butlers Wife - I agree. There is a lot of apathy here and the only way we can change things is if we all act together pro-actively. There are still not enough names on the petition and the specific performance law must be changed or repealed to provide protection for buyers. If anyone is able to collect paper signatures, please email me and I will send you a blank template sheet and a copy of the petition to print out and collect them. If people don't have access to the internet, I can print copies out for them and I will be at the Pia Bella, Girne tommorrow 12pm - 3pm and they can collect them from me so please let me know.



sibellehodge@hotmail.com



Sibel



manko


Joined: 14/02/2009
Posts: 13

Message Posted:
26/05/2009 11:31

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Message 23 of 27 in Discussion

Reply

wynyardman{6/9/'08}. Any success with your problem? Any feed-back appreciated.



Agnes


Joined: 11/04/2009
Posts: 81

Message Posted:
27/05/2009 01:31

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Message 24 of 27 in Discussion

Re-message 1



'Im sorry in my language twit and twat mean exactly the same, most if not all Scottish people will agree.



brend


Joined: 20/01/2009
Posts: 149

Message Posted:
27/05/2009 01:59

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Message 25 of 27 in Discussion

Hi

we must be one of the lucky ones (VERY lucky when I think about it). We have just got our Kokan and we have not had a lawer at any time. We bought on Bufavento and our estate agent got our permission to buy and charged us 200. We then went to the builder and Jepa Estates (who looks after our villa) did the rest for us

Brend



ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
27/05/2009 17:51

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Message 26 of 27 in Discussion

Agnes wrote: "'Im sorry in my language twit and twat mean exactly the same, most if not all Scottish people will agree."

No way! Twit is acceptable and non-swearie meaning silly person - but tw*t is an obscenity and slang for a part of the female anatomy, it's a bit like calling someone a c***

BTW how many people realise "scumbag" is slang for a used condom?



ilovekibris


Joined: 18/05/2009
Posts: 394

Message Posted:
27/05/2009 17:53

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Message 27 of 27 in Discussion

ps i bet that matelot at msg 6 knows all the swear words the lower-deck swab



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