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Re-unification = automatic unavoidable entry into the EU and the EURO

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Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 16:07

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Message 1 of 38 in Discussion

Re-unification of Cyprus must surely entail automatic and unavoidable entry into the EU and the EURO....



Is this a good thing for the TRNC?



Given what a lot of countries now know about the cost of Club-Euro Membership, what benefits will ensue that outweigh the enormous disadvantages?



rocking


Joined: 05/11/2008
Posts: 421

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 16:21

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Message 2 of 38 in Discussion

I hope not. The Euro would be distrastrous for us with inflation such as it can be here. Most ex pats are here because they are fed up with EU and the rules and regulations that tie the hands of business people in the UK. The UK population was asked to vote on joining the Common Market (9 trading countries I think at the time) we were never given a vote on whether we wanted to be 'European'. Whilst filling forms in you cannot (I do) put your nationality as English, well, that is what I am, not European.



yorgozlu



Joined: 16/06/2009
Posts: 4437

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 16:48

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Message 3 of 38 in Discussion

Somehow,I don't think that,the existance of ex-pats would be given any consideration at all in case of re-unification.Besides,this is between Turkish and Greek Cypriots.

However,I'm having difficulty from understanding,why you'd want to deny the Turkish Cypriots from freedom of movement.



Try to be unselfish for a change!

I am an EU citizen,but it is very selfish for me to say "I'm all right jack",how about the ones that AREN'T?



mamachina


Joined: 22/11/2008
Posts: 730

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 16:59

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Message 4 of 38 in Discussion

Yorgozlu - You can still be in the EU and not in the euro - come on, what does UK use! - Im all for open borders but dont want the euro, and I think that is what rocking meant. Id love to be able to go the quick way to the Troodos without messing with a border crossing, planes that come direct and go to all sorts of palces etc etc - just dont want euro!!!! Mind you, if the talks go on for much longer there many no longer be a EU anyway!!



Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 17:09

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Message 5 of 38 in Discussion

I do agree that by taking a piece of the island into europe deprive the tcs of thier human rights< healthcare> freedom of movement etc> none of us want the euro espicially here but to gain the other benefits would be a plus, no permits resident or buisness. this side will never agree to be accountable xxxx



DutchCrusader



Joined: 19/05/2008
Posts: 11281

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 17:30

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Message 6 of 38 in Discussion

Attention all Brits who do not want the Euro - I'll be more then happy to collect them at your home...

Like Groucho says in msg 1: unavoidable, if... (Here's the sign, so you can copy it for future use: ...)



mamachina


Joined: 22/11/2008
Posts: 730

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 17:49

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Message 7 of 38 in Discussion

He actually said ...."surely....unavoidable" Which doesnt actually mean definite! Sirely they can opt out of the eurozone if they wanted to?????? But first we have to get in -either on Turkeys coattails

f they get in, or pushed in screaming and kicking with the south IF there is a settlement!! (and a referendum)



Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 18:05

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Message 8 of 38 in Discussion

mama there will be a referendum rest assured but for what xxxx



Tootie


Joined: 28/08/2008
Posts: 2037

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 18:09

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Message 9 of 38 in Discussion

I wonder if we'd still be short changed or "sometimes" let off the 20 Kurus / Cents at the supermarket?



teatime


Joined: 20/10/2008
Posts: 852

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 18:22

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Message 10 of 38 in Discussion

I would hate to be in and EU, but I do agree with message 3, this is not an ex-pat decision, it's for the TC's to decide. I believe the cost of living in NC would become unbearable for many who live there though.



Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 18:31

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Message 11 of 38 in Discussion

twice today staRLINGS short changed me, second time i questioned sorrry have a sweet, no manager it was 25 kr each time, if they give it to charity no prob, but the reaction of the girl on the till lewads me to beleive they are on the take



ROBnJO


Joined: 30/06/2008
Posts: 1289

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 18:35

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Message 12 of 38 in Discussion

It also, for the Turk's & TC's, as well as Eurozone expats, begs the question,.... what would happen to all the 'Turkish' Banks?



NC could be swamped by HSBC, Barclays, Santander, etc etc.



Cash savings rates would be down to UK/EU levels.



2% interest on your savings anyone???????



That would impact everyone, ex UK, ex EU, Russian, Israeli, etc etc.





Rob



Tootie


Joined: 28/08/2008
Posts: 2037

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 18:45

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Message 13 of 38 in Discussion

Lilli , they gave me some chewy gum before and I thought it was blue-tack



Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 19:19

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Message 14 of 38 in Discussion

I never suggested that ex-pats should be making any decisions on behalf of TC's, I asked what benefits if any, any board members, TC or otherwise, could identify...



If the island is re-unified I don't see that there is any alternative, the north could not opt out if the currency is the Euro. As the south is already in and in the Euro, you can't honestly think there is a way to avoid the north becoming part of the EU do you? I think this bit's a given.... It might make the referendum a bit different as last time it wasn't a given.



waddo


Joined: 29/11/2008
Posts: 1966

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 19:21

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Message 15 of 38 in Discussion

Yes let TRNC fully in the EU, they can always leave again later in the week when they find out the truth! But why must they also take up the Euro? UK is kind of in the EU but has the still, can the TRNC not stay with the Lira - best of both worlds?



Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 19:24

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Message 16 of 38 in Discussion

Because the south is already in the Euro, that's why.



Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 19:26

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Message 17 of 38 in Discussion

grouch then they will say why havent we got real fakes xxxxxxxxxxx



Lazy days


Joined: 24/07/2008
Posts: 847

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 21:57

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Message 18 of 38 in Discussion

Imay be wrong but I believe the TRNC government have already agreed to adopt the euro as the currency of the country in the event of a SETTLEMENT



andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
21/03/2010 23:33

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Message 19 of 38 in Discussion

groucho,



I think what you describe is at least theoretically possible, but vanishingly unlikely in reality



the two communities were at each other's throats for ten years already,

when the greek cypriots had their civil war, and turkey stepped in as guarantor



don't be misled by cosy statements from the un or foreign officials:

this most intractible of the world's disputes grows ever more bitter

I remember when greek cypriot manoevers stopped most trnc exports for good,

and even as their reliance on the echr decisions has just crashed about their ears,

the south cypriots still refuse to compromise on the security guarantee



they would be the first to admit their vision for their cyprus is what they want,

despite a lot of self-delusion about caring for turkish cypriots: history proves they loathe them



am I telling cypriots what to do? I hope not!

indeed should this chalk-and-cheese island ever unify, euro and eu membership will have to be acknowledged



Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 06:48

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Message 20 of 38 in Discussion

Ah! But once property claims have been settled via the IPC and everyone knows that where they are is where they are, there is little further to agree save the power sharing mechanisms and constitution of the civil and other services... then re-unification is a real and proper possibility. The major stumbling block will be gone.



Think ahead, not backwards... Put aside your own possible gains and losses and think of an island as one.



Then, what does the EU and the Euro bestow?



gillken


Joined: 25/05/2008
Posts: 521

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 09:06

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Message 21 of 38 in Discussion

Southern Ireland Euro, Northern Ireland 's, so why can't it be the same in Cyprus?



TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 09:44

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Message 22 of 38 in Discussion

Because they are two different countries.

1.Republic of Ireland

2.UK



Troodo


Joined: 12/06/2008
Posts: 1002

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 10:06

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Message 23 of 38 in Discussion

Why not ask the GC's if they are happy with the euro.



Troodo


Joined: 12/06/2008
Posts: 1002

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 10:07

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Message 24 of 38 in Discussion

Why not ask the GC's if they are happy with the euro.



fiendishpaul


Joined: 18/05/2008
Posts: 1720

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 11:04

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Message 25 of 38 in Discussion

Methinks that entrance to the EU will be a double edged sword. Adoption of the euro will see prices increase but at least the TRNC will start to see a fair share of EU money which hopefully will be spent wisely on upgrading the current 3rd world infrastructure. Entrance to the EU may also 'demand' stronger governance of certain sectors in the TRNC - construction being just one of them.



Just a thought



Paul



mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 11:25

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Message 26 of 38 in Discussion

Groucho



It is important to recognise that :



1/ ALL of Cyprus is IN the EU - already..



2/ Cypriots have rights of freedom of movement via a RoC passport..



3/ The rule of EU 'law' is only suspended in the area where the recognised govt does not have effective control.



4/ 'TRNC' doesn't figure in this equation.. any time the TCs come to an AGREED settlement with GCs.. this can be part of a bi-zonal, b-communal, federated state...



5/ TCs could keep the Lira AND accept Euros... effectively they accept them now...



scootex



Joined: 03/03/2009
Posts: 908

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 13:24

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Message 27 of 38 in Discussion

FORGET THE ARGUMENTS BETWEEN NORTH & SOUTH if the north ever becomes part of europe I'm off to Moroco or India or somplace else infact where that the euro gravy train does not run



Stubs


Joined: 01/07/2008
Posts: 641

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 13:43

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Message 28 of 38 in Discussion

Mark



You are spot on with your evaluation.



After reading many of the posts on this and other threads it just highlights the ignorance of many ex-pats who have a proported interest in North Cyprus.



I have stated many times before that too many ex-pats have a very selfish interest in Cyprus and for years have went under the guise of having a sympathetic view of Turkish Cypriots.



As Groucho points out in msg 20 the major stumbling block has always been property and now there is the possibility of that providing the means to solve the majority of these issues.



Re unification is not as far away as some people would have other believe.



MarkVPiazza


Joined: 14/08/2008
Posts: 530

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 13:44

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Message 29 of 38 in Discussion

If/When the North joins the EU, there will be so much money/building work going on as the infrastructure is upgraded and internation businesses move in, 2004/5 will look like a warm-up.



Locals who still own land will sell at big profits, others will get squeezed by Euro inflation



To be honest, the TRNC will be in a right state for a few years - remember how busy the roads were, the noise from construction and the dust everywhere?



Mark



Clarissa2


Joined: 12/06/2009
Posts: 1476

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 13:49

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Message 30 of 38 in Discussion

Re : Msg 27,



You can also take all the Europe-hating brigade with you to either of these destinations.



TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 14:01

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Message 31 of 38 in Discussion

mmmmmmmmm,



How do you see the transition taking place, assuming there is a settlement?

I cannot see the TRNC waking up one morning and finding itself with a new name and fully fledged EU membership, with all the rules and regulations that this will entail. There has been a degree of change here in the name of EU harmonization, but in no way is this place ready to be an EU country. As to the Euro, I'm not sure it would do the economy here any favours, either.

What I can forsee are the drawbacks and disadvantages of EU membership without any of the benefits for some time, if ever.



andre 514


Joined: 31/03/2008
Posts: 1163

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 14:44

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Message 32 of 38 in Discussion

grouco message 29:



"once property claims have been settled by the IPC..."



just who are you kidding?



firstly gc claimants want former properties returned "somehow" not parlying with a board in the trnc

secondly there is a cut-off date of december 2011 for claims sent to the IPC

thirdly there is still no useable remedy for tc's too scared to go "back" to south cyprus

fourthly the government of (south) cyprus is agin' the process and sabotages amicable exchanges

fifthly the south is a state of near-panic since their echr efforts are shown up to be in vain



yes, a wonderful outcome for north cyprus but will not resolve what some call the cyprus dispute,

any more than the european court would have...

permanent partition is the inevitable way to go, not more day-dreaming about the eu and euro



andre



Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 15:03

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Message 33 of 38 in Discussion

You are all missing the point... I'm not asking if this or that happens to prevent a solution , I'm saying IF the island is united AND the EU and the Euro become de-facto status quo, then what does the EU and the Euro bring to the table for the then erstwhile TRNC...



You would have failed your school exams if you read a question and answer a different one.... Please don't answer the question I'm not asking! Andre, if the thought is too much for just don't bother answering... I'm not day-dreaming I'm asking for views as to impact given that most people on this board will have experienced the same in more countries than just the UK.



TRNCVaughan


Joined: 27/04/2008
Posts: 4578

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 15:18

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Message 34 of 38 in Discussion

The EU will bring straight bananas and the Euro will bring inflation without rising wages to compensate.



LOvegod


Joined: 22/03/2009
Posts: 161

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 19:44

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Message 35 of 38 in Discussion

Sooner or later the Germans will say enough is enough and revert to the DM as their constitution allows. sarkozy is taking a beating in the polls, greece is demanding a bailout now. Portugal and Spain could follow. Unemployment in Spain is at 20%. The Turkish economy is gaining ground under their emerging market status and the TL is holding steady and giving investors a healthy 8%. Why would the Turkish nation sacrifice that to belong to a corrupt and dying EU. Even the GCs hate the Euro.



AlsancakJack



Joined: 14/08/2008
Posts: 5762

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 21:17

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Message 36 of 38 in Discussion

Paul

Message 25:



' Entrance to the EU may also 'demand' stronger governance of certain sectors in the TRNC - construction being just one of them.'



Just like what has happened with the ROC.

AJ



Lilli



Joined: 21/07/2008
Posts: 13081

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 21:55

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Message 37 of 38 in Discussion

AJ you could be so right, we were over there today and I have never seen so many shops empty for rent also many appartments in the centre, it was so quiet apart from the restaurant we went to for lunch. they had 170 people in x



No1Doyen


Joined: 04/07/2008
Posts: 16617

Message Posted:
22/03/2010 22:04

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Message 38 of 38 in Discussion

AJ. Spot On.



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