Cyprus mail: On 21 Dec the Immovable Property Commission expires

greenman


Joined: 16/02/2008
Posts: 526

Message Posted:
12/06/2011 12:36

So who do citizens of the RoC, with deeds for property in the North, trust? The politicians or the lawyers??

http://www.cyprus-mail.com/cyprus/lawyers-or-politicians-who-do-you-trust/20110612

walkerscott


Joined: 13/08/2009
Posts: 901

Message Posted:
12/06/2011 13:28

Don't trust any of them!

The IPC is the only viable solution when all things are considered.

It will no doubt be extended again because it is a good PR machine to show Europe and the world that Turkey really is trying to compensate those who can prove that they have lost lands and property. Most are compensated very well.

Long may the IPC continue and well done Turkey for even providing such a platform which enables descendants of those who have lost property to claim either financial compensation and / or restitution or both. I personally would accept financial compensation because life is too short to wait another 40 years in the hope that something better might transpire!

http://no-deeds-no-money.moonfruit.com/#/i-p-c/4544142510

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
12/06/2011 15:06

Hi Waslkerscott



Let's be honest here... Turkey did not set this scheme up out of the goodness of it's heart.. it had to be FORCED [ ECHR judgements ] into some sort of resolution..



Now, having HAD to do something the GCs have played RIGHT into Turkey's hands as successive 'rump' RoC govts have discouraged it's use..



IF GCs had 'piled in' with claims and given the ECHR the opportunity to judge the fairness of the settlements ... they haven't and they only have themselves and influential politicians, members of the clergy who seem to desire the status quo - as believing there'll be a 'better deal' - when every successive one gets WORSE ( for the GCs ) - makes me wonder if certain GCs WANT the status quo ....

avraham


Joined: 28/05/2011
Posts: 17

Message Posted:
12/06/2011 15:20

Having just finished reading Ahrodites Killers by David Carter there is a chapter called ,Negotiation is not a football match.The Cyprus Mail was quoted in 2009 saying,



It is perfectly acceptable to sell land in Pathos and Larnaca to foreigners,but in the occupied(sic)North,we have a national duty not to sell to anyone-not even other greek Cypriots.

This perfectly illustrates the absurdity of the ultra patriotic parties who,despite posing as champions of the rule of law and defenders of refugee rights,want to deprive refugees of there property rights by law.



Both communities have had to make the best of their changed circumstances .To calculate the amounts owed to each other after such long time would be an incredible challenge for any arbitrator.



Seems to me bu*****d either way they go. By accepting compensation are they in fact selling their Land/Property.

avraham


Joined: 28/05/2011
Posts: 17

Message Posted:
12/06/2011 15:37

mmmmmm I think this applies to both sides of the divide;



Nations and peoples are largely the stories they feed themselves.

If they tell themseves stories that are lies,they will suffer the consequences

of those lies.

If they tell themselves stories that face their own truths,they wil lfree their

histories for future flowerings

andre514


Joined: 05/10/2010
Posts: 763

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 04:15

message 3 mark:



you understand the all-or-nothing gc mentality far better than most of us,

but there is no mystery about the prevailing attitude, which as you hint

is more emotional than rational, and relates to their "cypriot" identity



of course the enemy unfairly took advantage of its military power in 1974

and besides, right is wholly on the gc's side according to their memories of their behaviour

backed up by "international opinion" ...and church beliefs about the holiness of the island



yes, the greek cypriots would have secured a good agreement earlier rather than later

...like the palestinians in 1947 ...and the same parallel applies to the psychological

shock of strangers waltzing in from outside



of course turkey must have been dragged kicking and screaming to set up the ipc,

and I wonder if there will now be pressure to extends its life for another year or two?



but if all possible claimants didn't make proper use of it, it's their loss not yours

mmmmmm



Joined: 19/12/2008
Posts: 8398

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 11:07

re msg 4, avraham



Why do I have the feeling we've 'debated', before ?



Would you be so kind as to give us the link from the CY Mail - sounds like either 'tales from the Coffee Shop, or an article written by LC..



re msg 6

andre_514



>>you understand the all-or-nothing gc mentality far better than most of us,

but there is no mystery about the prevailing attitude, which as you hint

is more emotional than rational, and relates to their "cypriot" identity<<



ACTUALLY, Andre - *you* are suggesting personality traits.. and trying to attribute them to me !.. 'naughty'...



'Right' is / was on the 'side' of those winning landmark cases at the ECHR.. you know.. ones that allowed TCs to be allowed to cross N-S...



I think you miss the point the GCs have HAD the 'best' agreements they were ever going to get.. and voted them down.. mainly due to the fact that they simply didn't believe that the Denktash era was finished.. Sadly they had elected their own 'Hawk'

andre514


Joined: 05/10/2010
Posts: 763

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 12:27

message 2 walkerscott:



"most are compensated..."



many greek cypriots have always been very lukewarm about compensation



at the start of the present talks years ago, christofias was banging on about restitution,

not cash-for-peace, but given enough money, that could change,

ie the 20 billion euros demand, vehemently denied by all those involved I hasten to add!



a vox pop interview in nicosia following the depressing 2004 referendum result,

featured an angry woman complaining that "$5000 dollars per house" was ridiculous



no, greek cypriot patriots, taken at their word, want "their" homes back above all else,

some european union partners sympathize with this demand, others prefer them "paid off"



but the gc strategy never hit pay dirt, and the reunification momentum is running out of steam



I'll say this for claimants: the kulak mentality, very shrewdly distrusts all apparent cash offers

but the results of this attitude have now "come home to roost"

walkerscott


Joined: 13/08/2009
Posts: 901

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 13:31

Andre514

it is a complicated and emotionally loaded subject ... i have many good greek cypriot friends and personally know that many of the women in the families wish to try to reclaim lands and property or failing that, claim compensation in lieu. However, in many of the cases they are threatened and made to feel as if they are committing treachery ...

they are bullied into not proceeding which i feel is sad.

andre514


Joined: 05/10/2010
Posts: 763

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 14:04

meesage 9:



try as I might I have never been able to picture any circumstance where turkey

would actually leave the island, if anything its embrace seems to be tightening



i can only think of it happening if that country disintegrated like the ussr,

but that's verging on the impossible especially since their economy is doing well



or as a result of the dangled carrot of eu membership, assuming france, germany,

austria etc would ever permit it, however much many cyprus 44 members fantasize



perhaps with the clock at 23:59 hours there could yet be an accommodation

and a 2004-style compromise agreement procured, but as even mark 6ms says,

any deal done now would be even less favourable to the republic of cyprus side



so after all the breast beating... where does this poor old lovable, maddening,

proud, dependent, unique, turkish republic of northern cyprus go from here?



"left hand down a bit mr phillips"

walkerscott


Joined: 13/08/2009
Posts: 901

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 17:10

Msg 10

There is actually nothing to be gained from EU Membership these days, the money has run out and it will get worse, much worse without ever improving.

I suspect that Turkey will give the TRNC one more chance to sort its own affairs out before Annexing completely and running it as a Turkish Governed Zone. I also believe that the TRNC with its Turkish Cypriot Leaders will find it extremely difficult to manage their own country, never mind balancing the books!

The Turkish Government have one huge trump card which they can use and that is they are NATO's largest member in the most important region ... they could for example leave NATO ... Things can change and they are changing slowly as always in all ways!

andre514


Joined: 05/10/2010
Posts: 763

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 19:16

walkerscott,



eu accession has proved pretty disasterous for the united kingdom



but if you can wriggle out of joining the eurozone,

there are huge membership dividends for "emergent economies"



massive regional regional funding available

farming cash support and kickbacks

projection of national aspirations if it doesn't upset the big boys

free movement of workers and individuals to go where they like

greatly assisted export prospects

financial help if you get in an economic fix

enhanced prospects for inward investment

a filip for national prestige, and boosted world status

the politicians' gravy train, etc



so will turkey get in? nope!

will they be angry when the truth finally hits home? yes, very!

and would they then turn their backs on the west?



not exactly...

they'll keep the yanks on edge about nato, trade with all and sundry,

lead in the moslem world, and join the *brics



*...a loose grouping of brazil, russia, india, china, south africa

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 20:32

It must be frustrating for Turkey watching what is happening within Syria. Its policy has been to develop friendly relations with its neighbours, so it has markets to sell to. If its Arab neighbours ever got its act together Turkey would really make a killing.



The European court of justice has just ruled that the EU parliament must release details of a 2008 report which documents the way that MEP's can manipulate allowances to pocket more than 1 million pounds from a single five year term, in addition to their salaries.



Abuses include:

*claiming up to 180,000 in annual staff allowances without having to keep any proof

*awarding themselves bonuses of up to 1 and half times salary and diverting public money in to front companies



Not bad work if you can get it.

ilovecyprus


Joined: 08/05/2007
Posts: 2880

Message Posted:
13/06/2011 20:40

ps



Forgot to mention that the EU parliament is trying to overturn the court ruling