Flying in North Cyprus

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 11:50

This thread has spawned from th emessage thread http://www.cyprus44.com/forums/69070.asp



Messages 12,14 and 22

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 11:59

Referring to Message 22 by bigOz at http://www.cyprus44.com/forums/69070.asp

I was surprised to read that there was an active flying club in NC at all !

Where did it operate from?

What was it like trying to organise training for PFLs ?

What on earth did you do for the VFR Navex stages of the training? It must have been a doddle: "Oh look that's the

Beş Parmak range and oh look (!) that's the pan handle....so, let me see...what's that big town right in the middle of the island" 8->



I remember seeing a small airstrip just beyond Boğaz when I was visiting once. I noted the approach was a simple choice: into the mountain or into the mountain

Ridle


Joined: 01/01/2009
Posts: 144

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 12:21

I am interested to do some private flying here in the north. Has anyone got any ideas?

I have two friends who fly commercially in the U.k. They visit the island about 5 times a year & they would be very interested too.



I am sure there must be a few more like minded pilots out there, perhaps we could all meet up.

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 13:12

Before everyone gets too excited it is just worth checking "which way is up"



1. Fixed-wing or rotor flying may be unacceptable to the civil & military authorities.

2. The terrain presents just a "few" challenges for any forced landings (fixed wing).

3. The cost of maintenance - I dread to think!

4. The infrastructure ?

5. Cost? from both the customer and supplier perspective.

martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 13:20

The girl at my bank knows a guy who is in the process of setting up a Flying school in TRNC , I will find out what's what and post any info....

jay76


Joined: 17/07/2008
Posts: 532

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 14:00

Im currently doing my (ppl) private pilot's licence on helicopter solo stage and have 30 hours left to do oh and 6 more exams, would be great to be able to fly in the north but can't see it possible with the flight restrictions in the north part of the islands airspace.

Hoylemiller



Joined: 03/09/2010
Posts: 240

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 14:49

Could be ideal for Hang Gliding?

Ridle


Joined: 01/01/2009
Posts: 144

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 15:58

Hi MartinD41 I would be interested to talk to anyone who is involved.



jay76. They manage to fly in the south, they have flight restrictions too. I was flying a beagle pup only 4 weeks ago & there are cessna 172`s available as well.

Groucho



Joined: 26/04/2008
Posts: 7993

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 16:03

As you won't be allowed to over-fly the Army camps, how are you going to get anywhere?

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 17:29

brother;

My apologies for not responding to your questions earlier, but I shall definitely answer all your questions this evening. I need to rush off now...

martinD41


Joined: 06/09/2010
Posts: 3001

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 17:30

This is a good school, but it is in the south.... http://www.flying-in-cyprus.com/learn_to_fly.html

kiwikid


Joined: 18/08/2008
Posts: 496

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 18:17

The flying school that was to start up has been tabled for the time being, as for any other flying club/school or group they all have to be regisitered with the Cyprus Avaition federation and at persent only the federation are able do any kind of teaching or issue licences. Anyone wishing fly here either by light aircraft or gliders of any kind must apply to the above federation, and obtain permisson from the military. At present there are flight zones for Paragliding which took a lot of work and permissions to get, these again are restricted sites which need proof of insurance, and licences to fly at. (That includes Hang-gliders). As there are so many restricted areas in North Cyprus it is very hard to obtain permission to fly especailly as a foriegner.

If any one would like further information you are welcome to contact myself or my husband Ozgur who is an active member of the Aviation Federation.

You can find all our contact details at http://www.highlineparagliding.com

flightholiday


Joined: 19/07/2007
Posts: 3217

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 18:24

Msg 12 - You can be fairly sure that Angela's information is as good and up to date as you are liable to find.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 19:23

brother; As a flight/ground instructor at the first and only flight school to date in TRNC which expired second half of 1990s, I shall try my best to answer all your questions:

We started our operations from the barracks at the edge of the mainland army base in "Pınarbaşı". As you come down from the mountains towards Lefkoşa from Girne, there is a right turn where the Speed cameras are, leading into the old Girne-Lefkoşa road. If you follow that road, the first turning on the right leads to the army camp some 300 metres up the road. It used to be an old British air base with an earth runway around 20 metres wide & 1.5 km long (I believe 27/09) and a tarmac one 1 km long but only about 8 metres wide! That crossed the earth runway at right angles.

It was and still is, an air base for the army helicopters you see flying over Cyprus now. The earth runway was not looked after and only used in emergencies, so more often than not we had to take off towards the Kyren

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 19:36

The military did not restrict our flights providing we did not fly over the main military fuel and ammunition dumps and/or camps. We also could not fly over the restricted area near Acapulco to the East ,when live ammunition ground to air artillery practice was taking place (once a month or so). I managed to get latest ground maps of Cyprus and personally marked all the "restricted" and "prohibited" zones as well as the high mast spot heights, using coloured ink - a copy of which was made available to all instructors (about 3 at the time). The school was a branch of the then North Cyprus Aviation Association (Kuzey Kıbrıs Türk Hava Kurumu) and was aptly called "Yavru Kuş" (Lit trans. "Baby Bird").

The restricted areas were not half as bad as one thinks, and we had plenty of room from Girne to Mağusa, moving to Karpaz peninsula. We even did our circuit training at Ercan, and/or Geçitkale airports, when the air traffic was not too busy. (cont.)

CyprusNow


Joined: 16/07/2011
Posts: 168

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 19:37

Is that just past the old olive oil factory?

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 19:51

The commander of the barracks was very helpful and a great man! We had a good supply of free fuel for our aircraft (from their own allocation for the light army expedition aircraft stationed there) - an allowance that allowed us to train 7-8 people, an hour or two each every day. But the army and the fuel was the least of our problems.

Things like parts for the aging Cessnas, refuelling, creating teaching material in Turkish, based on U.K. and U.S. civil aviation books, record keeping and a certifying system for flight times of students. Most importantly using the Aviation Law in UK and Europe for defining VFR and VMC requirements. The CAA and the Ministry of Transport in North Cyprus had no published Laws or Rules to guide such an activity!

It was very hectic to start with and required a lot of dedication, but Hey! If you love flying then you are not worried about your time - so I put in my 14 hr a day, seven days a week working on those issues for 3 months lovingly Cont.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 19:54

Cyprus Now - Is what just passed the old olive factory? If you are talking about the earth runway on the coast, East of Girne, then no, that was never used - it had no tower or buildings and was never used...

I must go out for a meal but will continue in few hours time when I get back

Ridle


Joined: 01/01/2009
Posts: 144

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 20:05

Thank you bigOz, very interesting, maybe some hope yet for some flying in the future.



Looking forward to hearing more.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 22:45

Ridle; You are most welcome - meanwhile the saga continues

brother; as for the terrain and forced landings - there is plenty of open countryside for forced landings. It is never a problem, as long as you steer clear of the mountains which really are a very narrow range. The biggest problem we faced was not forced landing but taking off the narrow strip straight into the mountain (I think it was 36 or 34 - I can't remember now). The ground rose alarmingly as we took off, which meant a very sharp climbing right turn at around 200 ft QFE, that brought us flying towards Lefkoşa parallel to left of the main road. If you thought it would have been easier to take off from the other end, the return trip would have been more dreadful because you had no base leg. It meant a descending turn from downwind into final and the ground descending beneath with you - that required a lot of side-slip to hit the runway on the numbers. If you landed slightly further up, it meant a "go around" (con

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 23:00

The tower was manned by the army's air traffic controller, who communicated in Turkish only. That meant Radio telephony procedures in Turkish. Once couple of miles away from the field we would communicate with Eracan using normal RT procedures. When inbound aircraft approached we had to keep below 1000 ft QFE, but the best place to fly was along the north coast shielded by the mountains, which meant we could fly up to 2000 ft above sea level at all times.

Cross country training was done using the Lefkoşa, Karpaz, Girne Triangle. But for serious cross country we had to Fly to Turkey - no restrictions there except clearing customs at Ercan. We had to fly at a safe altitude of 10.500 ft when crossing the sea. On return trips, I often cut power at "Girne" checkpoint, two third of the way into the sea and would glide all the way into Ercan with no power

Must go away now, hope to be back later...

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
21/07/2011 23:32

bigOz, thank you very much for going to the trouble of writing it all up for us.



Im interested to know where you crossed over from Girne to Mağusa with adequate clearance for a sensible set of forced landing options. I remember what it was like having too many choices for a PFL when I went up with "lapsed PPL". I positioned us over the fields west of Thetford in East Anglia at 5000ft and watched until we were at 800ft when he finally spoke up: "I cant' make my mind up"



When you flew over to Turkey did you have anything similar to a "flight following" service for VFR.



If it was all so "home made" in terms of the syllabus you developed, how did anyone get an official NFT and GFT.



Presumably there were no facilities for doing any IR training - unless a suitable a/c was positioned at Ercan. But then again, who and under what rules was any certification tests carried out.



I wish I was over in NC, I can discuss flying until I'm arrested for boring everyone a

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 01:15

brother;

The place is full of adequate fields for forced landing practice between Lefkoşa to Karpaz peninsula with hardly any Telephone/electric lines or any hedges or perimeter fences. We once landed on a country road in Karpaz and took off again after 5 minutes There is no other traffic except the odd army helicopter which never fly above 500 ft. You can see them from miles away anyway.

When flying over to Turkey, you can request radar assistance but we never had the need because the conditions are usually great for VFR flights. One needs to steer clear of Airforce sites and activity, who are very helpful when you contact them prior to flying close to their airspace. I flew many times to Antalya, Eskisehir and Ankara. When you climb to around 5000 ft by which time you cross into the sea from Ercan, you can clearly see the Turkish coastline as if you are at the end of a big lake. By the time you reach the 10,000 ft altitude you are in contact with Turkish FIS. (cont)

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 01:42

They clear you to fly VFR to, say, Antalya and you avoid the restricted air force training region along the coast into the sea, by hitting the mainland well East of Antalya. From then on you contact Antalya Approach who treat you like a commercial airline. The VFR air traffic overland in mainland Turkey is negligible when compared to the crowded skies of UK. All the way to Eskisehir and back, the only other aircraft I saw in the sky was the B737 I had to line up behind, before landing at Antalya International. We never had the need to communicate with the FIS except the routine banter when handed over from one FIS to another

The syllabus I developed was translated from mainly UK PPL training program and Aviation Law. I had actually produced two books, one on Meteorology and another on Cross Country Under VFR. The actual circuit training and initial flight training followed a translated version of the "patter" I learned, whilst training for my AFI rating at Elstree (cont)

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 02:05

We also covered any other areas included in the Turkish Aviation Organisation. But at the time they were using printouts translated from US Flight training books for both VFR and CPL training. Faced with our syllabus and our request to have the GFT by the Turkish Chief Flying Instructors from Ankara (with all expenses paid trip to Cyprus of course), we convinced the Turkish CAA in Ankara to issue our pilots with Turkish PPLs. During the two years of training that went on, we incorporated some IMC flight training into the course but never had the chance to give any Night or IR training. If it got late returning from Turkey, the instructor did the instrument flying and the night landing.

One Cessna 172 we used was fully instrumented for IFR. I had my IR checked out by Chief flight Instructors from Turk Kuşu - Ankara, around Geçitkale Airport. Geçitkale had no ILS, but only NDB, VOR/DME, which were enough to demonstrate successful "hold patterns" or instrument approaches...

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 02:15

Many of the students we trained during that period went on to become Airline pilots (some with KTHY and Pegasus) by completing their CPLs in USA. At least one had his converted to UK PPL after taking a flight test in England.

I also had couple of scary experiences over Turkey and Cyprus during those 2-3 years, but must go to sleep now. Perhaps another time

jay76


Joined: 17/07/2008
Posts: 532

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 11:29

Big oz



You sound like my flying instructor Richard cook currently teaching in Rochester airport in Kent,

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 11:51

Jay76; I take that as a compliment Jay I would like nothing more than teaching in Cyprus again, perhaps one day...

brother; Going back to the problems we faced, one major problem was refuelling the aircraft. Although the base commander allocated us "X" amount of fuel, we had to depend on the military refueling truck being available. We were not exactly on top of their list of priorities. That meant hours of waiting sometime because they had the helicopters and 3 or 4 taildragers that were stationed there at the time, as well as their routine military drills that had to be attended.

Solution; I took one of the students with me to a disused/deserted petrol station and dug out the whole pump. The president of the Association used his influence to get an unused rusty water tank (50 ton one!, I sweet talked the road construction workers close by, to bring their earth digger into the camp, dig a large enough hole close to the end of the runway and bury the tank in there! (cont)

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 11:56

bigOz, at the risk of being accused of sentimental overdose I think you shouls write a book about your account and record the existence (I expect you have some pictures too) of the flying club in NC.



It is a changing world and it would be a shame for this information to be lost for ever.



I and I should think others interested in flying would certainly buy a copy.



Happy to help you edit and review it.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 12:12

We made sure that only the hatch-cover on top was accessible for filling the tank up. BUT when the commander stuck his head in with a torch, and saw the red rust covering inside the tank, he angrily said he is not wasting fuel by using such a tank!

I purchased 10 tins of rust removing spray, 3 wire brooms, some very hard sand paper, lanterns and an electric water pump. For the next one week we took turns with one of the technicians to slip through the hatch into the claustrophobic "tomb" and spray the inside with dust removing liquid, scratch the rust off, using metal brooms & sand paper. We took turns becz it was summertime - airless & hot in there!

We wore just shorts, masks covering our mouths & noses and snorkeler goggles, but still felt very bad during the spraying. No ventilation and just one hatch with not much air circulating. We then used a water hose to clean the inner walls after scraping, but the technician had rheumatic pains so I had to go solo!(cont)

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 12:26

thanks "brother" but maybe in a year or two when I am less busy. However these are just the boring bits, read on and you will find out why

We now had to use the water pump, pump out the rusty water whilst scrubbing and washing the inside with water. The commander watched expressionlessly from a distance. Day before we were about to finish, he came to the hatch and called me. I slipped out of the hatch and realised for the first time how awful I must have looked. The commander asked me who I was! (wet, covered in sweat, red rust and and dirt) He said a stern "good luck" and walked away...

When we finished the work, he came for inspection, stuck his head in through the hatch, and got up to address us. His very words were "Oz, I am impressed beyond words can say, well done indeed! As a reward this month you can have twice the ration of fuel you would have got" and ordered the captain next to him to make sure the tank was filled up immediately! Now we had to fit the fuel pump. (cont)

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 12:47

I asked my neighbour, the retired electrician, if he could handle such a job for us. Convinced he could, he came to the camp and fixed the pump 20 yards away from the tank and next to aircraft parking area. From then on, we taxied the Cessnas next to the pumps and refueled as we pleased

But on our first cross country to Turkey with a student, we ended up flying through an air force restricted airspace without clearance, because the DI failed without us noticing. Apparently the vacuum pump's bobbin had snapped. Got back to Cyprus to discover, a replacement vacuum pump would cost us around 1000 USD (we did not have) and approx 2-3 weeks to be delivered from America to TRNC. No DI meant no training!

I asked the engineers to open up the pump and take the spindle out. It was a small bobbin made up of some hard plastic material. I took it to a lathe shop in Lefkoşa Industrial Estate (Sanayi Bölgesi) and asked the guy if he can identify the material used and cut out the same shape (

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 13:10

He could & did! It cost me 3 USD. We weakened the bobbin structure intentionally so that it would easily snap, if there was a power surge that would force it to revolve too fast, causing damage to instruments. MORE THAN 20 YEARS ON THE SAME CESSNA IS FLYING AT GEÇİTKALE, EQUIPPED WITH THE SAME DI AND BOBBIN

Towards the last days of the F. School, I had my toughest test yet from this tiny airfield (officially called KARTER airfield). It was a hair raising rescue mission that required every ounce of learning and flying experience in UK, under extreme weather conditions. Lives of 3 people depended solely on the old Cessna, and me convincing my colleague, we were their only hope & had to fly under whatever conditions. An adventure that had made the front page in Kıbrıs Gazetesi at the time (I kept a copy). One of the saved, owns/runs the "Boat cafe" anchored at the Eastern End of the Old Harbour. The boat he is using as the cafe, is the one we saved from sinking

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 14:29

Great story so far bigOz.



I assume you were spotting for the rescue boat(s) ?



Re. ..."THE SAME CESSNA IS FLYING AT GEÇİTKALE,..." I assume it is not able to fly nowadays due to the restrictions. If not, what is it being used for please?

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 14:32

Just on the "...we ended up flying through an air force restricted airspace without clearance..."



Did you end up in formation with a couple of F16s?

even if not, I expect there was a little bit of "telling off" when you landed Something along the lines of "should always know where you are..." ;-)

kiwikid


Joined: 18/08/2008
Posts: 496

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 15:04

The NC Aviation Federation is based at Gecitkale, and they fly the Cessna, though not often as it has had a lot of mechancal problems in the last 6-7 years.

flightholiday


Joined: 19/07/2007
Posts: 3217

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 15:21

bigOz - keep them coming even though I can't pilot (I would love to) it's fascinating reading rather like the pictures of Nicosia airport etc.

Ridle


Joined: 01/01/2009
Posts: 144

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 15:43

I have seen a Cessna 172 standing outside at Ercan is that the same cessna & does anyone know who operates either of them if there are two.



I have seen a cessna flying occasionally and a motorised hanglider using the strip at Catalkoy.



bigOz. Good story & looking forward to hearing it to the end.



Denis

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 16:09

The Cessna at Geçitkale flies occasionally, because N.C. Aviation Federeation owns it. It must be at least 35 years old now. One of my x-students is supposed to be flying it, but with no flying school activity, there is not much point in flying round in Circles. The current employees are bums at the desk happy to earn a wage - they are not doing this for the love of Aviation! Also the current Head of the Hava Kurumu in Cyprus is inexperienced in aviation, with little academic qualifications - he was a bank clerk at the busted Cyprus Credit Bank, and one of our students back in 1990, ending up to be the head with a lot of help from an influential relative. The system of electing the head of the Aviation Association is open to both debate and abuse. But because it is not really functioning as a flight school, no one (including myself) has bothered to change anything.

The Cessna you saw was probably the privately owned one, usually stationed at Ercan.

Next the rescue mission

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 16:29

17 November 1993, dying days of the successful Yavru Kuş, just after the last graduates, I was too busy running a Hotel, restaurant, club complex in Karmi (Karaman) region. One of our regulars was a friend whom I had known for many years, and who often cheered the place up by playing the piano. He had not turned up for couple of days when I got a phone call from a crying lady just before midnight. She was mumbling about no one doing anything about saving her son and husband. Apparently they went out fishing two days earlier, and a storm broke out soon after they left early in morning. It was a big storm with gusts and winds of 60-80 Km.p.h. and the sea was behaving as if a giant spoon was stirring it like an electric mixer. Huge waves and eddies everywhere, going on for more than two days now.

When I realised who she was, I asked what the coast guard was doing about it. She said they would not go out in this weather. I felt sorry for her and upset for my friend. (cont.)

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 16:45

bigOz. Re. Msg.39



So, the NCAF exists just to employ people?



What is the official line on it? How can they have someone with no knowledge of the business involved in running it?



We are now likekly to get messages on how "corrupt" things are...



As for the privately owned Cessna at Ercan - presumably they use it for flights t-from Turkey. Otherwise how do they manage to get permission to fly around NC in it?

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 17:35

To comfort her all I said was "do not worry mum, I promise I'll find them for you" only to realise I had just nominated myself for an impossible task. I left work immediately and drove down to the ferry harbour where the coastguard was stationed. When I realised the sea was too rough even for them, I knew this was going to be one adventure I would not resist

They have had no contact with the lads for more than 48 hours now. All other ships had moved into safe havens along the coast but this one had not turned up at all. The last they had heard was when they were fishing at the furthest Western part of Güzelyurt Körfezi (the crescent shaped Bay of Güzelyurt, west of Kayalar). They were believed to be drawned, but everyone would have to wait until the storm was over. I left the harbour at 1.00 am and called the then Aviation Association's president asking for his permission to take off at sunrise on a search mission. He reluctantly said "yes", providing I took a co-pilot with me (cont.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 17:51

brother; they can do anything as long as they can get away with it. It is not an irreversible process though. It is "who" you know rather than "what" you know in this country.

I have not seen any private aircraft fly round the island as such. The army has no say on the aircraft flying into Ercan and out of it, using Ercan TMA and the airspace on your way to / from Turkey. The only permission you would need to fly into Ercan would be from the North Cyprus CAA, and once granted, it is just a simple case of filling up a flight plan and paying the parking fees at either end. The annual fees for parking light aircraft at Ercan are not that high either.

Anyway, back to rescue mission; The other instructor was a T.C. from Germany and happened to be a relative of the two of the lads on the boat. He just did not want to fly in that weather! I had to wake him up 2-3 times until 4 am begging him to get off his arse. He finally gave up and we met at 5.30 am to head for the airfield (cont.)

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 18:25

I had already got the coordinates of the last reported position from the coast guard, as well as details of direction and force of the current, including surface wind speed. It was blowing strongly from West to East gusting, between two ridiculously high figures I do not recall now. Making some assumptions and rough calculations, I worked it out that these guys could not have drifted along the coast to Karpaz in 48 - 60 hrs, but rather pushed into the rocks at Kayalar, west of Guzelyurt bay. But I could not work out if they had already smashed into the rocks, or if they were still drifting towards the rocky coastline by rights they should have met their maker already, but one thing for sure, we had very little time left, if any, if I was right about the angle of drift. Hence, I had to narrow the search area by using my instincts and head towards the Kayalar, avoiding any search of the coastline East of the bay.

The military tower was not manned yet when we lined up at 6.45 am...

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 18:33

All very interesting bigOz.



I'm beginning to understand how some money spent by the NC authorities can factually be described as wasted money. If I didn't have dependants here I would love to take over the running of NCAF. At a minimum I can see a viable business providing the circuit training for UK PPLs. This UK weather is the main delay in early stage progress for students. Much gets "forgotten" due to initial infrequent lesson patterns as a result of impossible or inappropriate weather. ALthough my own instructor used to laugh at me - I learned to fly at a farm - when I complained about difficult weather. His favourite response was: "You have a choice, you can have sunny and windy weather or cloudy and misty weather!"

Anyway, as I found in later years, operating from that short narrow dirt strip just wide enough for the u/c was useful experience.

Please describe, as much as you can, the weather conditions on departure from the airfield and when over the search area.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 18:48

We could not get any info about the cross wind strength, which was clearly blowing at right angles from the port. It was clearly nothing like what we had experienced before. When the left wing started to move up and down crazily, my colleague said "That's it! Return back to the parking area now or I will jump off here". At a time when I was debating with myself weather we should take off or not from this narrow strip in this weather, what I just heard prompted me to push the throttle for full power! Tiniest of flap, full left aileron into the wind and rudder control for direction until take off, with, a call to Moses, Jesus & Mohammed for urgent messages to God seemed to have done the trick. As soon as we took off, I maintained the aircraft's direction into the wind, ascending sideways along the runway at around 50 degree angle to the actual heading, straight into the mountain face until we started an ascending turn to the right. The ascending almost stopped when we had tailwind...

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 19:03

...but as we turned into headwind again the altimeter went crazy and we were climbing pretty fast, with one complete wide turn we were high enough to cross the mountains East of St Hilarion, close to Alsancak. I decided to go with my instincts and headed straight towards the coast, next to Kayalar. My friend had gone completely quiet and would not even respond to my friendly questions - probably because our heads kept almost hitting the roof as if driving a truck on a very uneven surface. We had contacted Ercan and expressed our intentions when at 2000 ft, also asking them if they would be kind enough to contact Karter at Pınarbaşı and ask the helicopters to be on stand by for a rescue operation (we took off 6.45 am they start work at 7.30ish). We were just north of Lapta when I could see a boat like shape popping up and down very close to the coast straight ahead!

Just over 15 minutes from take off, and we had already located the lucky b***ers.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 19:18

As we descended to 500 ft for a low fly over, we could see one of the lads waving what looked like a white bed sheet in the centre of the boat. We did not have to rock our wings, the wind was already doing that for us! We circled above them for almost half an hour, trying to work out the drift rate towards the rocks, around 500 metres or so to their East. We climbed back up to 3000 ft to be able to communicate with Ercan. Around 7.30 am Ercan informed us that they had established contact with Karter tower, who were now preparing a helicopter for the rescue. We reconfirmed the location of the boat again and asked them to hurry up because they were drifting fast towards the rocks. We then headed back to Karter. With a strong tailwind, we must have got there in less than 10 minutes! I lined up for on the finals for a very "crab" approach, just as I touched down doing all the correct moves for a strong cross wind landing, I heard the familiar voice of the colonel on the radio...

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 19:31

"Do not stop! Take off immediately, lead the helicopter to the spot where the boat is!". Adding full power and hoping we had enough runway left, on top of another cross wind take off, I had to put up with the rudests of all comments and swearing from my colleague. He kept quiet when I threatened him with keeping the mike button pressed for all to hear what he is saying

Another trip to the boat with the helicopter (Hugh Bell) behind us and we could not resist circling overhead watching how they used the winch to pick up two of the lads. Apparently the battery went flat during the storm, cutting off the power and all communications with the boat. Another helicopter brought in a fresh battery from the base and in less than an hour, the father who on the boat, managed to take it slowly into Guzelyurt Harbour, under the watchful eyes of the helicopter pilots. That Bell was not bothered with the storm, it just hovered above the boat as if stuck to a unseen ceiling...

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 19:42

The army boys were great in their response and swiftness. Eventually we landed back an hour and a half after we took off at 08.20 - but the wind had subsided a bit by then. Unknown to us. Ercan Airport had informed Kıbrıs newspaper of the goings on, and as soon as we got out of the aircraft we were confronted with cameras and interviewed, little knowing we were going to be the headline following day!

I drove back my friend from the airfield to his mums house. I felt 12 ft tall when we walked through the front door and said to her "I always keep my promise" The very friend I saved, I had run into at him in the harbour night before last, after many years, and had a coffee together at his recently opened "Boat Cafe". If anyone wishes to see the boat we saved, and hear his side of the story (what hey went through during the storm until they saw us above), go and have a drink there and ask for Levent.

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
22/07/2011 21:33

A great story bigOz. I will look out for the boat cafe the next time I'm there. I usually avoid the harbour restaurants.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
23/07/2011 01:04

brother; I am not a great fun of the restaurants or the bars in the harbour either. But for nostalgic reasons I often stroll through the harbour with my partner, rarely having a drink at one of the bars down there. When I was a very young boy, there were only two bars (Do Limani and Salih's) and 4 restaurants. No crowds, except on Sundays when all the Lefkoşa folk would come for a stroll. We would sit having drinks with friends at candle light until the early hours of the morning, staring at the star studded sky, for the price of two drinks charged nowadays!

İf you ever get here, contact me at turkishlessons1to1@yahoo.com, and perhaps we could meet for a drink and a social chat. Maybe Denis and "flightholiday" will join us too!

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
23/07/2011 11:43

OK bigOz. I will contact you directly in due course. I'm usually return to NC for a week every year.



I'm glad that this thread has been positive and interesting (for me anyway) without any upsets



I hope it provided a little insight into the unique private flying environment that existed in NC and still exists in a "strange" and unusual sort of way.



Like many other common interests, I think flying (in particular) is such a levelling activity.

Ridle


Joined: 01/01/2009
Posts: 144

Message Posted:
23/07/2011 11:49

bigOz. Great story & exciting times.



I am here in Cyprus most of the time & would love to meet up for a drink & a chat sometime soon.



I will send you e mail to arrange convenient time.



Denis

spangles


Joined: 22/10/2008
Posts: 411

Message Posted:
23/07/2011 13:10

I nearly passed over this thread as I thought it would be boring. How wrong I would have been - it turned into a very enjoyable read. Thanks for sharing your stories bigOz.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
23/07/2011 13:55

Thanks spangles;

But I forgot to address the main theme of the whole thread! Can one do flight instruction in Cyprus avoiding the military restrictions and the monopoly of the current Aviation Federation? The answer is YES and I have the recipe! But it would involve registering some form of an aviation organisation as an extension of, say a flying school in UK or Turkey, before carrying on with the rest. One would also need an aircraft to be parked at Ercan or Geçitkale (the parking fees for light aircraft are so small they are negligible).

I will not go into fine details now, but I believe a joint effort made up of foreign share holders as well as TCs (and I know a few very interested ones) can produce good results. It would create an excellent environment for hour building at relatively cheap prices. Imagine offering inclusive hour building summer holidays in Cyprus! Commercially it cannot fail!

flyer


Joined: 07/09/2010
Posts: 74

Message Posted:
23/07/2011 18:14

I also have been looking at the possabilities of flying here. There are 2 Cessna's here that I know of. They are both White, one is a 172 & the other is a 150 or 152. I saw them both at Geçitkale. They were brought over from the UK years ago & still have the origional reg numbers on plaques inside the Cockpit. One of them, maybe both, was from Shoreham, W Sussex.



I did speak to someone there who said that something could probably be arranged. I think that it would be a great idea to get together.



Dennis, you know me anyway, & big Oz, my e-mail address is grant@astutefma.com



I am out of the County for a few days from Thursday 28th July - Monday 1st. Other than that I can be available when ever really with a little notice so I can shuffle work commitments.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
23/07/2011 19:58

flyer;

Just for information, was there or has there been any security checks requested from you, either prior to being allowed into Geçitkale or for any proposed flights? Have you asked if the aircraft had any certificate of airworthiness and who the issuing authority is. I have not been there for a long time, for fear of hurting my feelings, but I might visit the aircraft in the near future. I think The Flying branch of the Association has rotted beyond repair and is in urgent need of attention.

The 150 was originally GBTYB (until 1995 when I last flew it). The 172 must be TCFHA, delivered from UK by the flying school owner at Compton Abbas and a pilot friend of his (I believe he was called Dave). The very airfield Asil Nadir was flown out of when he ran away from England!

flyer


Joined: 07/09/2010
Posts: 74

Message Posted:
24/07/2011 17:11

Hi bigOz, there was no real security checks. I was given a phone number by my neighbour, a 737 captian who trained at Geçitkale. I phoned the guy & went to see him. I was given a cup of tea from a canteen that appeared to have served nobody for years. I showed the chap my Log book & PPL. He said that he could see no reason why I couldn't fly as long as I went with a safety pilot.



He then asked me to come back another day as he was very busy that day. He was expecting 6 microlights from Turkey who were going to be providing an airshow at Catalkoy! (I got the impression that he just sat at the Airfield all day doing nothing normally). The 6 microlights arrived while i was there and did indeed appear at Catalkoy the next day. However, I think 'Airshow' was a slight exaggeration..All they did was land & take off on the military unmade runway.



In respect of airworthiness, I gained no information. I have not had chance to go back allthough this will encourage me. Can we meet up?

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
24/07/2011 17:37

flyer;

I strongly think the guy you met was Mehmet, the one whom I mentioned before. His flying experience does not exceed that of someone with a PPL, who built hundreds, if not more than a thousand, of hours going round in circles in North East part of Cyprus. What kind of a "safety pilot" he would make is a bit iffy. An explanation of an emergency landing after an engine failure, or even one of the two methods for strong cross wind landing, would probably confuse him beyond repair. I do not believe he has any instrument rating either.

Having said that; he was one of my students, and I believe, so was your neighbour (must be Mustafa, a nice lad). If so, he did not learn at Geçitkale, but at Karter in Pınarbaşı. The only other one who flies commercially and lives in Cyprus is Tamer. Mustafa is a friend, I helped him go to USA for CPL/IR, and also put him in contact with some training centres there.

I have your profile email address. I will contact & meet you soon

flyer


Joined: 07/09/2010
Posts: 74

Message Posted:
24/07/2011 18:45

bigOz, I am certian the guy's name was Mehmet. My Neighbour is Tamer ( if it's pronounced TAM EAR ).



I Look forward to hearing from you. I am sure Riddle would also like to meet up.



It's complete coincidence but I was talking to a diving friend who operates a Diving School here about trying to set up a Flying school. His feeling was that it should be fairly easy & there may even be some cash available from the Tourism Ministry. A long shot possibly, but who knows?

Sid447


Joined: 15/05/2009
Posts: 141

Message Posted:
24/07/2011 20:45

Mssg #6 Jay76



"...Im currently doing my (ppl) private pilot's licence on helicopter solo stage and have 30 hours left to do oh and 6 more exams, would be great to be able to fly in the north but can't see it possible with the flight restrictions in the north part of the islands airspace...."



If you need any help or just chat, send me an email.

I went through all this (though in the military) back in 1980 and have been a licenced APTLH/IR since 1990 for UK, Nigeria and UAE GCAA.



Rgds, Steve.

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
24/07/2011 23:28

flyer; I have sent you an email

brother



Joined: 29/01/2010
Posts: 446

Message Posted:
24/07/2011 23:35

Folks, I would be concerned with the a/c maintenance provision and fire/rescue cover in NC when considering a commercially attractive proposition to do with civilian flight training.



It is also apparent from bigOz's messages that what little activity there is/was relied/relies to a great extent on nepotism and favour reciprocation.



I would therefore look into the potential risks to such a business venture (notwithstanding the level of operational risks in the specific environment).



As pilots, we share a certain standard. That is, we take part in a risky business but we do so by minimizing those risks as much as possible. Then again I'm just an "Old pilot" :->

bigOz


Joined: 29/09/2010
Posts: 1244

Message Posted:
25/07/2011 00:49

brother; a/c maintenance can be done adhering to EU regulations. Air Worthiness Certification is and can be done in Turkey who do maintain very high standards. For maintenance, three young lads were trained as mechanics in Turkey and UK, prior to us starting the flight school. I believe at least 1 of them is still in Cyprus. All checks were carried out without fail. Major servicing was done in Turkey, an hour and a half away in flight terms. The fire/rescue cover in Ercan and Geçitkale, where the training aircraft would be kept nowadays, has same standard as any other international airport in EU

My apologies if I did not make it clear in my previous posts, but the last thing Mr A. Şenova (the President of the Aviation Association at the time - my favorite) did before he left was, leave the military base at Pınarbaşı during 1997 or 1998 to Geçitkale, so as to be away from some of the restrictions imposed by the military.

Ridle


Joined: 01/01/2009
Posts: 144

Message Posted:
25/07/2011 06:46

Hi bigOz.



I have sent e mail hopefully to arrange meeting.



regards Denis